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Kenya Airways...why ignore..
Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,060 Location: Nairobi
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When even AKS is pessimistic about KQ... http://www.nation.co.ke/...16178-bnefr9z/index.htmlGreedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,060 Location: Nairobi
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Uganda in plans to relaunch national carrier, upgrade Entebbe airport http://www.theeastafrica...43756-nw4qwvz/index.htmlGreedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2009 Posts: 8,083 Location: Enk are Nyirobi
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obiero wrote:maka wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Good what is the average interest rate for the loans? 15.5% Milking a dead cow. Life is short. Live passionately.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,060 Location: Nairobi
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The sad bit is I am a shareholder in KQ. [The idiots in GoK keep on pumping Taxpayer cash into this dead beast and my "stake" keeps on growing in size but not value] Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/22/2010 Posts: 11,522 Location: Nairobi
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VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. possunt quia posse videntur
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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maka wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. They are NPLs but not hardcore
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/29/2016 Posts: 898 Location: Nairobi
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obiero wrote:maka wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. They are NPLs but not hardcore The precarious cash flow situation is going to persist. I am sure the loan borrowed by treasury on their behalf is already finished. The proceeds from sales is also not enough since if there is demand and group bookings the capacity is not there. It is a very difficult period for KQ. I wonder why Ngunze can't throw in the towel now. There is nothing he can do differently.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2016 Posts: 1,996 Location: Kitale
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As things currently stand at KQ,i will not understand the reason a small investor will continue keeping his cash their. Current return on equity: -0.7 current return on assets: -0.2 Debt to equity ratio: 544% If KQ was to be liquidated today,all shareholders,big and small will not get even a single coin. The total assets worth kshs 158,415,000,000 is not even enough to pay creditors.They will have to auction Nguze and the board members properties to raise the additional ksh 35,667,000,000. It will take atleast the next 6 years for kq to return to positive equity.This is because revenue increase is currently at 5% Yoy.And this is on assumption that it will maintain the same trend. I will need someone to tell me other reasons why i should buy this share.Based on the current financial results,i wont touch this share unless Jesus tells me to buy. kq is just surviving on the mercies of creditors. Towards the goal of financial freedom
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/15/2013 Posts: 301
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Ebenyo wrote:As things currently stand at KQ,i will not understand the reason a small investor will continue keeping his cash their.
Current return on equity: -0.7
current return on assets: -0.2
Debt to equity ratio: 544%
If KQ was to be liquidated today,all shareholders,big and small will not get even a single coin.
The total assets worth kshs 158,415,000,000 is not even enough to pay creditors.They will have to auction Nguze and the board members properties to raise the additional ksh 35,667,000,000.
It will take atleast the next 6 years for kq to return to positive equity.This is because revenue increase is currently at 5% Yoy.And this is on assumption that it will maintain the same trend.
I will need someone to tell me other reasons why i should buy this share.Based on the current financial results,i wont touch this share unless Jesus tells me to buy.
kq is just surviving on the mercies of creditors.  I got out of this bus amid at a very high loss. KQ was a stain on my sparkling clean white shirt(portfolio). I cant help but feel KQ is Mumias all over again....in every way from loss making, management issues, bail outs etc
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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mulla wrote:Ebenyo wrote:As things currently stand at KQ,i will not understand the reason a small investor will continue keeping his cash their.
Current return on equity: -0.7
current return on assets: -0.2
Debt to equity ratio: 544%
If KQ was to be liquidated today,all shareholders,big and small will not get even a single coin.
The total assets worth kshs 158,415,000,000 is not even enough to pay creditors.They will have to auction Nguze and the board members properties to raise the additional ksh 35,667,000,000.
It will take atleast the next 6 years for kq to return to positive equity.This is because revenue increase is currently at 5% Yoy.And this is on assumption that it will maintain the same trend.
I will need someone to tell me other reasons why i should buy this share.Based on the current financial results,i wont touch this share unless Jesus tells me to buy.
kq is just surviving on the mercies of creditors. I got out of this bus amid at a very high loss. KQ was a stain on my sparkling clean white shirt(portfolio). I cant help but feel KQ is Mumias all over again....in every way from loss making, management issues, bail outs etc KQ must not be looked at in its current state but rather futuristically.. It will not make sense to many now
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/22/2010 Posts: 11,522 Location: Nairobi
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obiero wrote:mulla wrote:Ebenyo wrote:As things currently stand at KQ,i will not understand the reason a small investor will continue keeping his cash their.
Current return on equity: -0.7
current return on assets: -0.2
Debt to equity ratio: 544%
If KQ was to be liquidated today,all shareholders,big and small will not get even a single coin.
The total assets worth kshs 158,415,000,000 is not even enough to pay creditors.They will have to auction Nguze and the board members properties to raise the additional ksh 35,667,000,000.
It will take atleast the next 6 years for kq to return to positive equity.This is because revenue increase is currently at 5% Yoy.And this is on assumption that it will maintain the same trend.
I will need someone to tell me other reasons why i should buy this share.Based on the current financial results,i wont touch this share unless Jesus tells me to buy.
kq is just surviving on the mercies of creditors. I got out of this bus amid at a very high loss. KQ was a stain on my sparkling clean white shirt(portfolio). I cant help but feel KQ is Mumias all over again....in every way from loss making, management issues, bail outs etc KQ must not be looked at in its current state but rather futuristically.. It will not make sense to many now whats the point of waiting 10-15 years to make money in this thing. possunt quia posse videntur
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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maka wrote:obiero wrote:mulla wrote:Ebenyo wrote:As things currently stand at KQ,i will not understand the reason a small investor will continue keeping his cash their.
Current return on equity: -0.7
current return on assets: -0.2
Debt to equity ratio: 544%
If KQ was to be liquidated today,all shareholders,big and small will not get even a single coin.
The total assets worth kshs 158,415,000,000 is not even enough to pay creditors.They will have to auction Nguze and the board members properties to raise the additional ksh 35,667,000,000.
It will take atleast the next 6 years for kq to return to positive equity.This is because revenue increase is currently at 5% Yoy.And this is on assumption that it will maintain the same trend.
I will need someone to tell me other reasons why i should buy this share.Based on the current financial results,i wont touch this share unless Jesus tells me to buy.
kq is just surviving on the mercies of creditors. I got out of this bus amid at a very high loss. KQ was a stain on my sparkling clean white shirt(portfolio). I cant help but feel KQ is Mumias all over again....in every way from loss making, management issues, bail outs etc KQ must not be looked at in its current state but rather futuristically.. It will not make sense to many now whats the point of waiting 10-15 years to make money in this thing. H1 ends in a month.. KQ shareholders shall review the future by the said results
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,060 Location: Nairobi
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obiero wrote:maka wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. They are NPLs but not hardcore Which IFRS/IAS standard deals with "Softcore NPLs"? What does Mr. Opus say re: KQ loans? Are the loans being serviced [even if interest-only]? According to CBK guidelines, if a loan is not serviced according to the terms of the agreement, for 3 months... the loan starts on the process to becoming a NPL. After 6 months, it is a 100% NPL loan. Furthermore, CBK's guidelines also state that if the Lender thinks the loan is going to go bad [even before the 6 months are up] the Lender has to move it to NPLs. Are these loans secured? If yes, with what assets? If they are unsecured, then based on the "Negative Liability" position, the CBK guidelines would lean towards NPLs. These are the questions Investors should ask. I am KK-damu but (sadly) I own 1/44,000,000 of 30% of KQ. Plus a share of the loans given to KQ. And on the hook for the guarantees. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. They are NPLs but not hardcore Which IFRS/IAS standard deals with "Softcore NPLs"? What does Mr. Opus say re: KQ loans? Are the loans being serviced [even if interest-only]? According to CBK guidelines, if a loan is not serviced according to the terms of the agreement, for 3 months... the loan starts on the process to becoming a NPL. After 6 months, it is a 100% NPL loan. Furthermore, CBK's guidelines also state that if the Lender thinks the loan is going to go bad [even before the 6 months are up] the Lender has to move it to NPLs. Are these loans secured? If yes, with what assets? If they are unsecured, then based on the "Negative Liability" position, the CBK guidelines would lean towards NPLs. These are the questions Investors should ask. I am KK-damu but (sadly) I own 1/44,000,000 of 30% of KQ. Plus a share of the loans given to KQ. And on the hook for the guarantees. NPL grading is on CBK prudential guidelines not IFRS.. In Kenya, a loan has 5 core grade scores, with 1 being soft
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,060 Location: Nairobi
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obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. They are NPLs but not hardcore Which IFRS/IAS standard deals with "Softcore NPLs"? What does Mr. Opus say re: KQ loans? Are the loans being serviced [even if interest-only]? According to CBK guidelines, if a loan is not serviced according to the terms of the agreement, for 3 months... the loan starts on the process to becoming a NPL. After 6 months, it is a 100% NPL loan. Furthermore, CBK's guidelines also state that if the Lender thinks the loan is going to go bad [even before the 6 months are up] the Lender has to move it to NPLs. Are these loans secured? If yes, with what assets? If they are unsecured, then based on the "Negative Liability" position, the CBK guidelines would lean towards NPLs. These are the questions Investors should ask. I am KK-damu but (sadly) I own 1/44,000,000 of 30% of KQ. Plus a share of the loans given to KQ. And on the hook for the guarantees. NPL grading is on CBK prudential guidelines not IFRS.. In Kenya, a loan has 5 core grade scores, with 1 being soft CBK guidelines are even tougher than IFRS. What is a "softcore" [say 1] grade? What does it mean? What does it entail? Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:obiero wrote:maka wrote:ArrestedDev wrote:obiero wrote:@arresteddev only time will tell whether KQ shall sink further The road to recovery is long and treacherous. A competent management is required going forward. It is evident Ngunze is not the right person. Today he says one thing and tomorrow another thing. Any gains at the operating level will be wiped out by hedging losses and finance costs. @Obiero what is the average tenor of their loans?How much are they owed? 13 local banks have lent to KQ amounts in excess of KES 52 billion shillings. 11 banks, 7 months ago agreed to restructure the tenor from 1-3 years to 7 years. But two refused, leading to average tenor of 4 years Which 2 banks refused? [Smart management] Kaburu banks Which banks have lent KQ money? Please list names and amounts. Asante. Why did the 2 Kaburu banks refuse? Have they been paid? Dear @Bankers @Auditors, I wonder, according to CBK/Opus guidelines, whether the loans to KQ are considered NPLs? Must be NPLs...they are living hand to mouth.Wait for kidogo sales pay a few people default on others...vicious cycle. They are NPLs but not hardcore Which IFRS/IAS standard deals with "Softcore NPLs"? What does Mr. Opus say re: KQ loans? Are the loans being serviced [even if interest-only]? According to CBK guidelines, if a loan is not serviced according to the terms of the agreement, for 3 months... the loan starts on the process to becoming a NPL. After 6 months, it is a 100% NPL loan. Furthermore, CBK's guidelines also state that if the Lender thinks the loan is going to go bad [even before the 6 months are up] the Lender has to move it to NPLs. Are these loans secured? If yes, with what assets? If they are unsecured, then based on the "Negative Liability" position, the CBK guidelines would lean towards NPLs. These are the questions Investors should ask. I am KK-damu but (sadly) I own 1/44,000,000 of 30% of KQ. Plus a share of the loans given to KQ. And on the hook for the guarantees. NPL grading is on CBK prudential guidelines not IFRS.. In Kenya, a loan has 5 core grade scores, with 1 being soft CBK guidelines are even tougher than IFRS. What is a "softcore" [say 1] grade? What does it mean? What does it entail? I would have broken it down but I do not have time.. Please visit www.centralbank.go.ke
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2007 Posts: 1,162
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[quote=VituVingiSana]Uganda in plans to relaunch national carrier, upgrade Entebbe airport http://www.theeastafrica...3756-nw4qwvz/index.html[/quote] I would advise the Ugandans to upgrade Entebbe but not relaunch their airline. Airlines lose money and wise governments leave that risk to private operators unless that government is very rich and the taxpayers don't mind.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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majimaji wrote:[quote=VituVingiSana]Uganda in plans to relaunch national carrier, upgrade Entebbe airport http://www.theeastafrica...3756-nw4qwvz/index.html[/quote] I would advise the Ugandans to upgrade Entebbe but not relaunch their airline. Airlines lose money and wise governments leave that risk to private operators unless that government is very rich and the taxpayers don't mind. Seconded.. Uganda shall fail in the attempt. Running an airline isn't a simple thing. If Nigeria doesn't have one..
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Member Joined: 7/1/2014 Posts: 895 Location: sky
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obiero wrote:majimaji wrote:[quote=VituVingiSana]Uganda in plans to relaunch national carrier, upgrade Entebbe airport http://www.theeastafrica...3756-nw4qwvz/index.html[/quote] I would advise the Ugandans to upgrade Entebbe but not relaunch their airline. Airlines lose money and wise governments leave that risk to private operators unless that government is very rich and the taxpayers don't mind. Seconded.. Uganda shall fail in the attempt. Running an airline isn't a simple thing. If Nigeria doesn't have one.. they can manage if only they avoid hedging and corruption There are only two emotions in the stock market, fear and hope. The problem is, you hope when you should fear and fear when you should hope
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,475 Location: nairobi
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littledove wrote:obiero wrote:majimaji wrote:[quote=VituVingiSana]Uganda in plans to relaunch national carrier, upgrade Entebbe airport http://www.theeastafrica...3756-nw4qwvz/index.html[/quote] I would advise the Ugandans to upgrade Entebbe but not relaunch their airline. Airlines lose money and wise governments leave that risk to private operators unless that government is very rich and the taxpayers don't mind. Seconded.. Uganda shall fail in the attempt. Running an airline isn't a simple thing. If Nigeria doesn't have one.. they can manage if only they avoid hedging and corruption KQ looking like one of the few bargain counters at the NSE
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 15,750 ABP 6.45
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