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Cytonn Investments
paulkimani
#1161 Posted : Wednesday, April 28, 2021 2:54:09 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/19/2016
Posts: 204
Angelica _ann
#1162 Posted : Wednesday, April 28, 2021 3:29:20 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/7/2012
Posts: 11,901
obiero wrote:
maka wrote:
obiero wrote:
madhaquer wrote:
Some rules about investing that I learnt in my short years playing with money.
1. Never count your chicks before they hatch. - You know you made money once you are out of the deal and have done the math. Looking at prices for a stock/product you are still holding doesn't mean that you will get the same on your exit day.
2. Know your place on the table - Minority shareholder means you are hanging on the tailcoats of other decision makers. If they choose to reinvest returns or divest the business, too bad for you.
3. Forget the marketing - What you see is what they want you to see. learn the scuttlebutt technique for any investment worth a substantial sum. If I don't understand how you are making money, then am a fool to be investing.
4. I know my limits - I know at what point I am willing to count an investment/deal over and count my losses. Beyond that limit, it will stress me and I don't need that.

As far a Cytonn is concerned, some people who put in a million, just couldn't stomach losing a million. Some people knew nobody in the organisation yet they believed and based their decision on what some sales staff was coached to tell them. Some people didn't understand the exit points or the lack of them.
Either way, hio ni funzo.

Even the way Cytonn was founded, should have been enough a red flag, you cannot steal someone’s wife to make her your own and thereafter expect loyalty



This is a disaster ... Waaah

Capitulation


smile smile smile watu wawache kucheza na their hard earned monies!!!
In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
poundfoolish
#1163 Posted : Wednesday, April 28, 2021 6:49:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/2/2009
Posts: 2,458
Location: Nairobi
paulkimani wrote:
https://twitter.com/Mur1thi/status/1387335431965061121?s=20


Lol!!! we shall give this post a rating of 9.1
Thiong'o
#1164 Posted : Thursday, April 29, 2021 10:00:19 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/14/2011
Posts: 661
poundfoolish wrote:
paulkimani wrote:


Lol!!! we shall give this post a rating of 9.1

9.6 it is!
Rollout
#1165 Posted : Thursday, April 29, 2021 3:34:09 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 759
Someone said somewhere that Cytonn is a tent of suspected thieves based on the allegation from a previous employer, why would Kenyans give them their money???? They probably can't raise money from legitimate/financially knowledge investors because of their credibility otherwise raising $100million is not hard if you have a track record and assets to show.
Rollout
#1166 Posted : Friday, May 21, 2021 10:21:01 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 759
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????
Angelica _ann
#1167 Posted : Tuesday, May 25, 2021 8:24:45 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/7/2012
Posts: 11,901
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?
In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
maka
#1168 Posted : Tuesday, May 25, 2021 8:31:02 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?



Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly
On amore serious note this needs to end.... Now.
possunt quia posse videntur
poundfoolish
#1169 Posted : Tuesday, May 25, 2021 9:11:01 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/2/2009
Posts: 2,458
Location: Nairobi
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.
watesh
#1170 Posted : Wednesday, May 26, 2021 7:47:23 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2014
Posts: 954
Location: Kenya
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!
tony stark
#1171 Posted : Wednesday, May 26, 2021 10:54:46 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/8/2008
Posts: 947
watesh wrote:
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!


This company has said exactly what is doing and people have refused to listen.

Cytonn is all about wealth. They are arbitraging real estate; Real estate in Kenya was having a return of over 25% pa. Arbitrage for the high yield investors was bring your investment and get 15-18%. Cytonn spread on the "producing" real estate would be 8-10% pa. This was and still is a scalable investment strategy post Rona when there is more liquidity.

All the other financial products cytonn has the process and systems in place to have products with better returns than their competitors. It is not magic or witchcraft it is business. They have clear client intake process and systems, they use technology smartly, using CRM etc.

This madness of rumours without understanding a business is stupid. They can make great returns on insurance and imagine what they can do with money? This is a very very smart play.

These companies really need to see what Cytonn is doing and learn as quickly as possible because peoples cakes are about to be eaten.

This is the warren buffet playbook with Geico and a company. They can buy another insurance company and professionalize it the same way they did for their other sector.

Watch this company!!!
mkenyan
#1172 Posted : Wednesday, May 26, 2021 11:49:15 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/1/2009
Posts: 1,882
tony stark wrote:
watesh wrote:
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!


This company has said exactly what is doing and people have refused to listen.

Cytonn is all about wealth. They are arbitraging real estate; Real estate in Kenya was having a return of over 25% pa. Arbitrage for the high yield investors was bring your investment and get 15-18%. Cytonn spread on the "producing" real estate would be 8-10% pa. This was and still is a scalable investment strategy post Rona when there is more liquidity.

All the other financial products cytonn has the process and systems in place to have products with better returns than their competitors. It is not magic or witchcraft it is business. They have clear client intake process and systems, they use technology smartly, using CRM etc.

This madness of rumours without understanding a business is stupid. They can make great returns on insurance and imagine what they can do with money? This is a very very smart play.

These companies really need to see what Cytonn is doing and learn as quickly as possible because peoples cakes are about to be eaten.

This is the warren buffet playbook with Geico and a company. They can buy another insurance company and professionalize it the same way they did for their other sector.

Watch this company!!!

btw, what happened to their college?
tony stark
#1173 Posted : Wednesday, May 26, 2021 12:11:34 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/8/2008
Posts: 947
mkenyan wrote:
tony stark wrote:
watesh wrote:
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!


This company has said exactly what is doing and people have refused to listen.

Cytonn is all about wealth. They are arbitraging real estate; Real estate in Kenya was having a return of over 25% pa. Arbitrage for the high yield investors was bring your investment and get 15-18%. Cytonn spread on the "producing" real estate would be 8-10% pa. This was and still is a scalable investment strategy post Rona when there is more liquidity.

All the other financial products cytonn has the process and systems in place to have products with better returns than their competitors. It is not magic or witchcraft it is business. They have clear client intake process and systems, they use technology smartly, using CRM etc.

This madness of rumours without understanding a business is stupid. They can make great returns on insurance and imagine what they can do with money? This is a very very smart play.

These companies really need to see what Cytonn is doing and learn as quickly as possible because peoples cakes are about to be eaten.

This is the warren buffet playbook with Geico and a company. They can buy another insurance company and professionalize it the same way they did for their other sector.

Watch this company!!!

btw, what happened to their college?


Great question.
I don't know what happened. However let's look at the business behind the colleges

1. Education sector is profitable and they can see it and several hedge funds have been buying up schools in Kenya.
2. Cytonn response is let's set up a education business. Their logic is they also need staff from Fundi for their construction business, to teachers for their nusery schools. etc. This business will be funded by students who will pay cytonn to acquire skills and knowledge. Cytonn will be able to assess students and this can be a funnel of good staff for their businesses.
3. If this college is profitable we can package the education business as a high yield product where you buy into this scalable business and this will give you good returns and cytonn gets it share for doing the hard work.

Where could it have gone wrong. I have no clue but I there are some sectors and businesses that are hard to crack just with technology and education and health 2 challenging people business that are not easily automated. Maybe they didn't have time? Maybe they did have focus? Maybe thats why paul kimani was fired. Who knows but I get the logic of the college.

You win some big and hopefully you lose alot small!
mkenyan
#1174 Posted : Wednesday, May 26, 2021 7:55:16 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/1/2009
Posts: 1,882
tony stark wrote:
mkenyan wrote:
tony stark wrote:
watesh wrote:
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!


This company has said exactly what is doing and people have refused to listen.

Cytonn is all about wealth. They are arbitraging real estate; Real estate in Kenya was having a return of over 25% pa. Arbitrage for the high yield investors was bring your investment and get 15-18%. Cytonn spread on the "producing" real estate would be 8-10% pa. This was and still is a scalable investment strategy post Rona when there is more liquidity.

All the other financial products cytonn has the process and systems in place to have products with better returns than their competitors. It is not magic or witchcraft it is business. They have clear client intake process and systems, they use technology smartly, using CRM etc.

This madness of rumours without understanding a business is stupid. They can make great returns on insurance and imagine what they can do with money? This is a very very smart play.

These companies really need to see what Cytonn is doing and learn as quickly as possible because peoples cakes are about to be eaten.

This is the warren buffet playbook with Geico and a company. They can buy another insurance company and professionalize it the same way they did for their other sector.

Watch this company!!!

btw, what happened to their college?


Great question.
I don't know what happened. However let's look at the business behind the colleges

1. Education sector is profitable and they can see it and several hedge funds have been buying up schools in Kenya.
2. Cytonn response is let's set up a education business. Their logic is they also need staff from Fundi for their construction business, to teachers for their nusery schools. etc. This business will be funded by students who will pay cytonn to acquire skills and knowledge. Cytonn will be able to assess students and this can be a funnel of good staff for their businesses.
3. If this college is profitable we can package the education business as a high yield product where you buy into this scalable business and this will give you good returns and cytonn gets it share for doing the hard work.

Where could it have gone wrong. I have no clue but I there are some sectors and businesses that are hard to crack just with technology and education and health 2 challenging people business that are not easily automated. Maybe they didn't have time? Maybe they did have focus? Maybe thats why paul kimani was fired. Who knows but I get the logic of the college.

You win some big and hopefully you lose alot small!

Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly
Rollout
#1175 Posted : Thursday, May 27, 2021 3:47:49 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 759
tony stark wrote:
watesh wrote:
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!


This company has said exactly what is doing and people have refused to listen.

Cytonn is all about wealth. They are arbitraging real estate; Real estate in Kenya was having a return of over 25% pa. Arbitrage for the high yield investors was bring your investment and get 15-18%. Cytonn spread on the "producing" real estate would be 8-10% pa. This was and still is a scalable investment strategy post Rona when there is more liquidity.

All the other financial products cytonn has the process and systems in place to have products with better returns than their competitors. It is not magic or witchcraft it is business. They have clear client intake process and systems, they use technology smartly, using CRM etc.

This madness of rumours without understanding a business is stupid. They can make great returns on insurance and imagine what they can do with money? This is a very very smart play.

These companies really need to see what Cytonn is doing and learn as quickly as possible because peoples cakes are about to be eaten.

This is the warren buffet playbook with Geico and a company. They can buy another insurance company and professionalize it the same way they did for their other sector.

Watch this company!!!


Insurance business in a country of "hustlers" and loose regulation is going to be very difficult for anyone because of the following:

(1) Complexity of risk management related to managing unpredictable claims.
(2) Lack of other products that could insure potential outliers, large unplanned claims e.g. stop-loss products.
(3) Significant capital reserve requirements.

However if you want to take advantage of loose regulation, you need cash to fund other businesses and you really have no other ways to get cash then insurance is the perfect industry to enter because of the following:
(1)you can collect premium and use legal loophole not to have to maintain reserve requirement
(2) you can use fine prints and legal ways not pay claims when they become due
(3) you can downright refuse to pick calls from customers when they want to make claims.

You can basically market the products aggressively and it might take years in a country like Kenya for the law to catch-up with you or for customers to figure you out and stop paying premiums to you, by then, you'll have all the cash you need to rescue other parts of your businesses that needed cash in the first place.

Entering insurance business can actually save Cytonn, brilliant idea from my Wharton Business School friend!

Insurance can be a perfect Ponzi scheme!
paulkimani
#1176 Posted : Thursday, May 27, 2021 1:15:48 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/19/2016
Posts: 204
The college stole students fees and shut down without giving certifications. What else would one expect. They’ve stolen money from investment sector, education and now insurance. What else is there to say? People will say they’re “expanding”, while others, like myself, read the facts and see the scam.

https://twitter.com/tran...181580042368892930?s=20

https://twitter.com/BuyW...367442021951148033?s=20

https://twitter.com/BuyW...367447068516712449?s=20

https://twitter.com/BuyW...367451267430313984?s=20


mkenyan wrote:
tony stark wrote:
watesh wrote:
poundfoolish wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
Rollout wrote:
Cytonn is entering insurance business, anyone seeing what I am seeing??????


Diversification?


Yes! Something they have been at from the onset.

When CMA refused to give them a lisence at the very onset. They started with the High Yield private product.

Finally the license came at they went into Unit trusts, Cash Management etc

They have a pension schemes

Now into Insurance...

I personally think they should have concentrated on wealth management. This now looks like it has become a resentment take on the main 'rival'... to do better.


Spot on!


This company has said exactly what is doing and people have refused to listen.

Cytonn is all about wealth. They are arbitraging real estate; Real estate in Kenya was having a return of over 25% pa. Arbitrage for the high yield investors was bring your investment and get 15-18%. Cytonn spread on the "producing" real estate would be 8-10% pa. This was and still is a scalable investment strategy post Rona when there is more liquidity.

All the other financial products cytonn has the process and systems in place to have products with better returns than their competitors. It is not magic or witchcraft it is business. They have clear client intake process and systems, they use technology smartly, using CRM etc.

This madness of rumours without understanding a business is stupid. They can make great returns on insurance and imagine what they can do with money? This is a very very smart play.

These companies really need to see what Cytonn is doing and learn as quickly as possible because peoples cakes are about to be eaten.

This is the warren buffet playbook with Geico and a company. They can buy another insurance company and professionalize it the same way they did for their other sector.

Watch this company!!!

btw, what happened to their college?

Mainat
#1177 Posted : Wednesday, June 09, 2021 11:24:40 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
There is a meeting on 26th for truthseekers and bsers to put in their 2 cents
Sehemu ndio nyumba
paulkimani
#1178 Posted : Friday, June 11, 2021 10:57:49 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/19/2016
Posts: 204
Out of all the hate I’ve received in this forum, this comment always stuck with me. Are we as Kenyans so desensitised we can’t admit that our peers are suffering really badly to the point of poverty because of this company?

Please read the letter below. This lovely lady who invested and trusted Cytonn has now:
1. lost her job
2. is unable to pay rent
3. has no money or insurance for medical assistance
4. has been unable to pay school fees and as a result her children and not getting an education
5. her mental health has been affected badly
6. has no income as a result of job loss and her savings are tied up with a scam. She is struggling to even put a meal on the table. She is on the brink of homelessness.

As an investment company, Cytonn had a duty of care to its clients which it has failed at miserably.

LETTER LINK BELOW:

https://twitter.com/Caro...402850684098260996?s=20

poundfoolish wrote:
Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

Which stage of mourning is this dear Wazuans...?

Or rather what stage of a congame is this, when a conman tries to play with emotions when caught..


paulkimani wrote:
When I’m watching a minimum of ten Scamtonn investors message me every week, with stories of how their kids had to drop out of school because they could not afford the fees, or how their families are surviving on one meal a day and even that one meal is trying to be spread out... when I’m listening to stories about how they’re trying to get extra odd jobs just be to able to keep a roof over their heads - all because Scamtonn is withholding the investors money that was due to them months or a year ago now - all because of a stupid biased contract the investors did not read because Cytonn KNEW they had not completed their education and specifically targeted those groups - yes, the entire company is a Ponzi. The Scamtonn four knew exactly who they were targeting - the poor and vulnerable and they successful did that. They will get away with it, they will be hiding millions and millions in their pockets while their investors suffer for generations to come, because of four greedy individuals in 2015 who made the choice to scam the innocent investors who were just trying to pay to educate their kids for a better future.


paulkimani
#1179 Posted : Wednesday, June 16, 2021 8:20:24 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/19/2016
Posts: 204
essyk
#1180 Posted : Friday, June 18, 2021 1:19:00 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/15/2011
Posts: 4,517
Waaa! Kai!!Pray Pray
This is the MOST embarrassing and painful thread in the history of wazua.ok after one that I know.Laughing out loudly
I came here because abt 2 months ago a financial consultant gave me an inside story on these fellows. He actually called them Ponzi.So I came, read and went away because wazuans know it all.Laughing out loudly where does one even start.
There's another one too.. a ponzi but whee! This is battle for one PK
So Paul you fought a good battle.
You have been vindicated.

Moving foward, just buy a cow uwe unakunywa milk daily than some putting money in some ponzi masquerading as 'investment schemes'




"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good.
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