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July deadline for ban on cash for bus fare
masukuma
#1 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 9:36:32 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,821
Location: Nairobi
government’s July deadline for a ban on using cash in paying for bus fare


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrNh0KAyw14

rink

Kwani these people believe everyone is on M-PESA or BebaPay. This thing will be fought!! since when did m-pesa become legal tender for the payment of debts? Consumer organizations should fight this thing!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
tycho
#2 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 10:31:10 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
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Location: Nairobi
Will there be money transfer costs? How will they be distributed?

Why should there seem to be a favoritism on M-pesa or bebapay? I have no problem with us going digital but I think the government needs more consultation on how they are going to get revenues in a digital world. For example, the anticipated revenues may not be realized because the digital system is inherently against increasing costs, so delivery systems and multimedia conferencing will rise and government will have a harder time collecting taxes.

washiku
#3 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 10:35:12 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
On the flip side, this will encourage innovative products to sprout. All forms of electronic payments shud be encouraged. There is also a directive in place that will see all government money paid electronically. In several years time, cashless transactions will be the in thing n that will be very good for the economy.
dunkang
#4 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 10:49:43 AM
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The News Article wrote:
The move is expected to both help the Kenya Revenue Authority (KRA) to collect data on tax compliance in the sector, as well as reduce theft of cash by crew and bribery to traffic police officers to make it more investor friendly.


So the banks get 1% of the matatu revenue?

Bullcrap Legislations by this Jubilee Confused 'Leadership'.

1. Police will still be bribed, even shuttles pay protection money to cops through the SACCOs yet the fares are well documented by issuance of receipts in the offices.

2. Tax evation (income tax) will still continue as usual, since, even landlords have not yet complied. This will cause a hike in fares.

3. Adding VAT on my bus fare (which is what KRA is wants) will not go well with me as an overtaxed citizen.
Receive with simplicity everything that happens to you.” ― Rashi

Caveman
#5 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 10:55:18 AM
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Joined: 4/15/2009
Posts: 371
Will children also be required to pay fare? How?
Are mobile phones going to be used in the transactions? How about mobile theft/snatching?
If I am going for a very short distance, will I have enough time to transact before I alight?....
Muheani
#6 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 11:12:31 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/20/2009
Posts: 1,402
Caveman wrote:
Will children also be required to pay fare? How?
Are mobile phones going to be used in the transactions? How about mobile theft/snatching?
If I am going for a very short distance, will I have enough time to transact before I alight?....


Mayb saccos will come up with prepaid seasonal tickets. Problem is our public transport system is so unreliable and one might need to have a number. Unless of course they come up with a sort of visa card.
Ole Lenku
#7 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 11:17:48 AM
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Joined: 11/25/2013
Posts: 402


"THESE PEOPLE" are nuts.
maka
#8 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 11:50:59 AM
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Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Muheani wrote:
Caveman wrote:
Will children also be required to pay fare? How?
Are mobile phones going to be used in the transactions? How about mobile theft/snatching?
If I am going for a very short distance, will I have enough time to transact before I alight?....


Mayb saccos will come up with prepaid seasonal tickets. Problem is our public transport system is so unreliable and one might need to have a number. Unless of course they come up with a sort of visa card.


That unreliability part should be sorted first...
possunt quia posse videntur
Lolest!
#9 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 11:54:06 AM
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Joined: 3/18/2011
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It's a welcome move but probably wrong timing. Penetrration of mobile phones and cards is low. Govt should allow private sector to make the market receptive before moving to compel markets to go cashless.
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Lolest!
#10 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 11:57:40 AM
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Location: Kianjokoma
@dunkang, apart from your second point, I disagree. I doubt govt would want to add VAT for fare. They most likely though will want to get some income tax from the PSV guys which is good for us all. We've been talkin bout widening tax bracket, right?
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
alma
#11 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 1:50:14 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/20/2007
Posts: 4,432
So now the gov't can tell you what mode of payment you must use?

This is a tax and spend gov't. they will tax anything that is walking if they have to, to get those raptops.

Can't even come up with an idea of what happens to the people who don't like phones or even use them.

Honestly this is worse than the imagination can reach.

It's ok to move a society to move towards a cashless society, but it is criminal to force someone to become digital by a particular date and also force business owners to pay tax to a bank of 1%

This is another of those fake jubilee decrees that are going nowhere very fast.
Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
Much Know
#12 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 2:10:57 PM
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Joined: 12/6/2008
Posts: 3,548
alma wrote:
So now the gov't can tell you what mode of payment you must use?

Actually yes, and not now, since kidu 18 century and in some cases some year BC, in every country it is now the case, governments declare the legal tender, the issue of electronic money is key, especially to cut the interest rate for you (the cost of using money)/corruption and to enhance security which is the key factor in economic growth, very simple really! This could in itself "transport alone" cut the regular banks interest rates given to customers by my guessumptions by something like 1 to 2% and much more if other sectors adopted it.
A New Kenya
Ole Lenku
#13 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 3:05:48 PM
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Joined: 11/25/2013
Posts: 402
Much Know wrote:
alma wrote:
So now the gov't can tell you what mode of payment you must use?

Actually yes, and not now, since kidu 18 century and in some cases some year BC, in every country it is now the case, governments declare the legal tender, the issue of electronic money is key, especially to cut the interest rate for you (the cost of using money)/corruption and to enhance security which is the key factor in economic growth, very simple really! This could in itself "transport alone" cut the regular banks interest rates given to customers by my guessumptions by something like 1 to 2% and much more if other sectors adopted it.

Of all challenges the country has, the garment is focussing on the wrong things. @Much Know has written eloquently and seems to make so much sense. It does not change the fact that we are fighting the wrong battles.# Garment of misplaced priorities.
quicksand
#14 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 3:14:39 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/5/2010
Posts: 2,061
Location: Nairobi
alma wrote:
So now the gov't can tell you what mode of payment you must use?

This is a tax and spend gov't. they will tax anything that is walking if they have to, to get those raptops.

Can't even come up with an idea of what happens to the people who don't like phones or even use them.

Honestly this is worse than the imagination can reach.

It's ok to move a society to move towards a cashless society, but it is criminal to force someone to become digital by a particular date and also force business owners to pay tax to a bank of 1%

This is another of those fake jubilee decrees that are going nowhere very fast.

Quite right. I also remember that the PORK has interests in a major bank, so the 1% is very welcome. .. and going off the tangent here a bit this is probably why we cant have sane regulation of interest rates, inflation and borrowing.
Isnt it illegal to refuse legal tender in the first place? It seems ludicrous to place such massive overheads on an industry where the transactional exchange is 30 or 50 bob. These are laws designed by a rich oaf who has probably never used public transport.
Of course there will be another sourcing fiasco, where fat cats will hijack the sourcing of any of the systems involved. I hope someone sues and the Supreme court forces some more rational thinking into this.
Toxicity
#15 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 3:18:52 PM
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Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 458
why can't they first organize the public transport/ the transport system before sorting out the payment system? ABK!!!
update president set president = speaker where president is null
washiku
#16 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 3:42:18 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
The reasoning here has to do with all the risks involved in handling cash, some of which are direct risks to the economy eg tax evasion. However, instead of government forcing people to use it, they could make it attractive for all stakeholders to consider damping cash transactions by offering incentives. If the incentives are more attractive, and with the private sector given the leeway to innovate around the cash-less systems to make the costs of the systems down, more n more will move to the cashless system by choice. But I the directive requiring govt offices not to accept cash payments is much welcome. A look at how much money is lost by NCC between their cash office at City Hall n Cooper bank will make the switch an urgency.
washiku
#17 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 3:49:56 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
Toxicity wrote:
why can't they first organize the public transport/ the transport system before sorting out the payment system? ABK!!!


In fact the government need not organize the sector, they just need to facilitate through attractive policy framework and the private sector will sort out the order as they try to take advantage of govt offers. Some of these things shud not be the day job for the govt coz the private sector has much more capability to innovate around the same. Our young boys n girls in the universities would come up with very smart ideas if the policy frame work is sorted. The policy should be more incentive-oriented than orders-oriented.
vky
#18 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 4:32:05 PM
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Joined: 6/17/2010
Posts: 572
this will never work pragmatically speaking, our public transport system has alot of variables that beba pay and mpesa cannot address, having said that, cashless transactions are long overdue in +254 but in the transport industry reliability and standardisation need to be achieved take for instance the public transport in london is such that the fares are capped at one pound fifty regardless of what part of london you are going to plus the buses are very reliable and always on time, this applies to all bus companies operating in london, if this cashless thing was to work we need reliability and standardisation without this then govt. should let those who pay cashless pay and those who want to pay cash should be allowed to do so
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murchr
#19 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 5:04:48 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
alma wrote:
So now the gov't can tell you what mode of payment you must use?

This is a tax and spend gov't. they will tax anything that is walking if they have to, to get those raptops.

Can't even come up with an idea of what happens to the people who don't like phones or even use them.

Honestly this is worse than the imagination can reach.

It's ok to move a society to move towards a cashless society, but it is criminal to force someone to become digital by a particular date and also force business owners to pay tax to a bank of 1%

This is another of those fake jubilee decrees that are going nowhere very fast.


Hold your guns...look at it keenly, its one way of encouraging ticketing so that some form of tax is collected by the gov. Sincerely the Matatu industry is lucrative and huge enough to be a contributor to the economy..

MPESA is not the only payment platform there are others but Mats prefer it. I think the system used by Tea room matatus is fair enough, well documented may be what remains is to make it electronic. We need more education in this unfortunately the media wont
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
alma
#20 Posted : Saturday, January 04, 2014 5:07:23 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/20/2007
Posts: 4,432
We are mixing two things here.

First a cashless society which is a dream being that its not been achieved anywhere on this earth. It may also be a good thing.

The second is a gov't that wakes up and decides that on this date, no one will ever use cash again in a matatu.

The second is a sign of never having understood the problem with the first and is not a solution to anything especially any of the problems it pretends it wants to solve.

Just another way for a gov't to tax its citizens and also ensure that friends of gov't win tenders.

Hii ni serekali ya kusema na kutender kweli.

Now all Kenyans must have a digital tv, mpesa, a laptop and God knows whats next.

The work of gov't is to facilitate not to create another unworkable law that is meant to glorify muthamaki as digital. My grandmother doesn't carry her phone from home, does that mean she will never enter a matatu? Does it mean that all parents must buy each of their kids a phone and ensure it has mpesa in it? Is the gov't working in cohorts with banks to create monopolies?

This reminds me so much of Al Capone and the mafia. For you to operate in this area you must pay each bank 1% of your earnings. And its enforced by the gov't. Wow!
Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
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