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TNA - I Believe
Rank: Elder Joined: 11/14/2007 Posts: 4,152
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@ Mkeiyd.....I'd really like to know why you did not vote for RAO in 2007. Since you seem to have a soft spot for RAO (wacha kujifanya) please tell us how you think he'll address the historical injustices you're talking about? Can you also give us an assessment of what RAO has done since he became PM in 2008. What's your take on the alleged involvement of RAO in the maize & Kazi kwa Vijana scandals? Look at all the election top contenders we have at the moment and tell me who has never been part of the Kanu regime. Most of the people who are criticizing UK now are the same people who praised him when he teamed up with RAO to reject the proposed constitution in the 2005 referendum....now that he's no longer on their side ndio wanaongea mambo ya historical injustices, same thing with WR and MM. Apart from the small matter of the ICC, i believe you do not have anything against UK that's why you are talking about the sins of his father, hata RAO was born with a silver spoon in his mouth.
Btw why would you vote for RAO and not Karua, after all she was also part of the second liberation and has never been involved with Kanu.....anyway I'm sure you'll give us the usual argument of her role in the 2007 elections!
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Rank: Member Joined: 7/20/2011 Posts: 161 Location: nairobi
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truth be told......either UHURU OR RAO will be kenyas next president. But if you ask me...neither of them has the credentials to be A GOOD PRESIDENT....but then again, the idiocy that is the Kenyan populance does not desrve one! Patience. You cannot have a baby in one month by impregnating nine women....
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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nostoppingthis wrote:nakujua wrote:Sigiriri wrote:@nakujua, story ya passats tafadhali usiilete hapa. The limos are back in business anyway!! But I like your signature line.....it applies to salos only, but in politics, Kenyans WILL get what they deserve!! Well my signature line applies to all aspects of life, even political. Kenyans will negotiate with the politicians come election period, we will demand some stuff and they will promise some stuff. The poor Kenyans deserve a better life, the sick deserve medical care, the unschooled deserve education, but they will not get that only what they negotiate for. Well since you brought up the passat story, you have to agree that it was a good move attempting to cut down some spending - if the implementation has been messed, that is not UK's fault, just like the traffic rules. Give him credit where its due and blame him where it applies. How do you become a manager of a company/country if you can not see through the successes you hope to achieve....? The more the reason you should become manager so that you get the powers to implement the policies you have set up. If say you are the HR manager and you suggest that all employees who do not do work travel return the company cars - then the other managers refuse and the responsible managers refuse to collect the cars there is nothing much you can do - but if you become the CEO, then you can make those responsible for that to do it if they refuse, you have the power to sack them. So yes you should become manager to see through the successes you hope to achieve.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/26/2008 Posts: 319
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mkeiyd wrote:Asking for EVIDENCE to back allegations of land grabbing by Mzee Kenyatta is asking too much from ordinary Kenyans. Does lack of evidence from ordinary Kenyans amount to innocence? NO! I think when common law was developing, common sense was the key ingredient. My common sense tells me, it is not possible to own swathes of land in a far place like Taita,if you hail from Kiambu. You can argue that he bought it,i give you that. How about the fund that was set after the white settlers left, was it not for the original land owners to get funds to re-purchase their land? Maybe there was no such fund.As a president, how moral is it, for you to buy land,swathes of it,when you know the original owners are squatters? Thousands of hectares when the populace you lead is landless? That was the dad's fault,not Uhuru's, you may say. Then how is he going to address historical injustices like the above,the alleged assassinations? HOW? Create some land from thin air for the original owners of the land now owned by the Kenyatta's? Maybe the numbers will be on his side and win the next general elections,then ICC, then what next? We have a Bashir? Bashir has the Arab money bags,what does Kenya have? Who's drilling the Turkana oil? Tullow. He becomes a Bashir, the drilling stops. I heard today the Japanese gave a 29bn loan for by-passes in Mombasa, that will stop too. Nobody knows what will happen with the ICC,it's like a dark cloud, no one knows what's inside. So why take the whole country thru' such uncertainties,just for someone? Why risk your daily bread for someone who never risked for anyone? [Watch out what you throw in response]. You may call it fear-mongering, but unless and until you tell me how the whole thing gonna play out, you will let me monger.
It's not worth it. At all it's not,to take the country into the miasma of uncertainty. I voted twice for Kibaki,2002 and 2007, because i believed he would transform the country.He has to some extend,but i'm not happy with what happened after 2007.I'm not happy with him side-stepping the law. Now we need a different kind of leader,someone who can [sensibly] address the historical injustices. Somebody not afraid to step on people's toes. I remember during the Mau evictions, i read on this very Wazua people saying "RAO amejimaliza" and i wondered, "Is Mau,the waters and rivers from Mau, RAO's property"? Ain't it for the good of all if Mau is protected,rains fall,Maasai Mara quenched? When it rains,is it RAO who gets the rains? The masqueraders[Uhuru,Kalonzo,Musalia etc] were busy looking at their interests, at the nation's peril. [the omission of Ruto's name is deliberate] When demolitions for by-passes started in 2003/4, i remember even Kibaki backed away, saying it was RAO[then roads minister] demolishing people's sweat [houses]. Who uses the by-passes now? I gez RAO, all by himself. With the way things are looking now, that's the kind of guy i would like as my president. But i have only one vote and the numbers might not be on our side and so, Uhuru might end up winning, well let him win, without my vote. Then i will sit back and watch the Kanu days crawl back, into our sitting rooms and into the bedrooms. Uhuru has been going against the law with the budget several times. He never fought for the new constitution,he was not decisive months before last referendum until he was sure it was safe to be on the YES side. I don't think he has passion for the reforms/constitution. @mkeiyd Applause Applause Applause
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 3/26/2012 Posts: 1,182
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@TAZ. You ask why i didn't vote for RAO? Because i had Kibaki. I have been a fan of Kibaki since 1997 because of a rally he had upcountry and had the chance of listening to him explain what he will do about our economy. That's why i voted for him in 2002&07. I was young to vote in 1997.
I said RAO can sensibly address historical injustices,having suffered he same and not enjoying the fruits of the same injustices. Uhuru telling us he will address those injustices, while enjoying their fruits is taking us for fools.
As i said, with the way things are, RAO is the man for me. Not because he's an angel, but because he has the character to champion for the nation. Has Uhuru ever done anything to such an end? And now he's talking of transformation and not reforms?
Why i would not for Karua is simple, politics is about numbers. She doesn't have them as of now. She's not the most ideal candidate for me. My ideal candidate is Peter Kenneth,but him too, no numbers yet. So voting for any of the two is like voting for Uhuru and i don't believe in him. Which makes me go for the second best alternative.
Remember its a TNA thread and if you believe, i think you are better telling us what Uhuru will do than criticizing his opponents. Promote the TNA agenda.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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mkeiyd wrote:Asking for EVIDENCE to back allegations of land grabbing by Mzee Kenyatta is asking too much from ordinary Kenyans. Does lack of evidence from ordinary Kenyans amount to innocence? NO! I think when common law was developing, common sense was the key ingredient. My common sense tells me, it is not possible to own swathes of land in a far place like Taita,if you hail from Kiambu. You can argue that he bought it,i give you that. How about the fund that was set after the white settlers left, was it not for the original land owners to get funds to re-purchase their land? Maybe there was no such fund.As a president, how moral is it, for you to buy land,swathes of it,when you know the original owners are squatters? Thousands of hectares when the populace you lead is landless? That was the dad's fault,not Uhuru's, you may say. Then how is he going to address historical injustices like the above,the alleged assassinations? HOW? Create some land from thin air for the original owners of the land now owned by the Kenyatta's? Maybe the numbers will be on his side and win the next general elections,then ICC, then what next? We have a Bashir? Bashir has the Arab money bags,what does Kenya have? Who's drilling the Turkana oil? Tullow. He becomes a Bashir, the drilling stops. I heard today the Japanese gave a 29bn loan for by-passes in Mombasa, that will stop too. Nobody knows what will happen with the ICC,it's like a dark cloud, no one knows what's inside. So why take the whole country thru' such uncertainties,just for someone? Why risk your daily bread for someone who never risked for anyone? [Watch out what you throw in response]. You may call it fear-mongering, but unless and until you tell me how the whole thing gonna play out, you will let me monger.
It's not worth it. At all it's not,to take the country into the miasma of uncertainty. I voted twice for Kibaki,2002 and 2007, because i believed he would transform the country.He has to some extend,but i'm not happy with what happened after 2007.I'm not happy with him side-stepping the law. Now we need a different kind of leader,someone who can [sensibly] address the historical injustices. Somebody not afraid to step on people's toes. I remember during the Mau evictions, i read on this very Wazua people saying "RAO amejimaliza" and i wondered, "Is Mau,the waters and rivers from Mau, RAO's property"? Ain't it for the good of all if Mau is protected,rains fall,Maasai Mara quenched? When it rains,is it RAO who gets the rains? The masqueraders[Uhuru,Kalonzo,Musalia etc] were busy looking at their interests, at the nation's peril. [the omission of Ruto's name is deliberate] When demolitions for by-passes started in 2003/4, i remember even Kibaki backed away, saying it was RAO[then roads minister] demolishing people's sweat [houses]. Who uses the by-passes now? I gez RAO, all by himself. With the way things are looking now, that's the kind of guy i would like as my president. But i have only one vote and the numbers might not be on our side and so, Uhuru might end up winning, well let him win, without my vote. Then i will sit back and watch the Kanu days crawl back, into our sitting rooms and into the bedrooms. Uhuru has been going against the law with the budget several times. He never fought for the new constitution,he was not decisive months before last referendum until he was sure it was safe to be on the YES side. I don't think he has passion for the reforms/constitution. I thought even RAO owns land at the coast - how will he address the same if all the way from bondo he has managed to also get land at the coast, is that not against your common sense.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/14/2007 Posts: 4,152
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mkeiyd wrote:
Why i would not for Karua is simple, politics is about numbers. She doesn't have them as of now. She's not the most ideal candidate for me. My ideal candidate is Peter Kenneth,but him too, no numbers yet. So voting for any of the two is like voting for Uhuru and i don't believe in him. Which makes me go for the second best alternative.
Pardon me for turning this thread into a discussion on MK and RAO but i just want to understand your point of view. In 2002 almost all Kenyans voted for Mk what i want to know is what has RAO done since 2007 that has made you think otherwise of him. Don't you think the part highlighted in red contradicts with what you stated in you previous post. If your ideal candidate is PK then why don't just vote for him instead of going for the next worst person after UK. UK is not my preferred candidate, as someone has pointed out i also don't think either him of RAO deserve to be President but kama its between those two then he'll have my vote. If it was about issues then i would not be talking about these two because they both belong in the crop of politicians we need to get rid of if we are to achieve anything as a country. I believe the reason why most RAO supporters want the race to be between him and UK is because they feel Kenyans will always have issues with the Kenyatta family (historical injustices), the ICC and the fact that he is a kikuyu. In my opinion if we elect UK, no matter what he does or does not do, hizi kelele will go on for the next 5 years...same goes for RAO. One of the reason why i have never been a supporter of RAO is because he has been in govt since siku za Moi (in very powerful positions) but always maintains that he can only bring change as President. We seem to forget that since 2002 we have not had any official opposition to check on the government.....they've all been part of the govt sasa they are telling us ati its time for change and reforms, please!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/17/2008 Posts: 23,365 Location: Nairobi
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@TAZ, very well, neither RAO nor UK is your candidate.....I find is then contradictory that in all political threads you are always against Raila and sympathetic to UK......wacha uongo bana, it's very clear where your vote will be!!! ..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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McReggae wrote:@TAZ, very well, neither RAO nor UK is your candidate.....I find is then contradictory that in all political threads you are always against Raila and sympathetic to UK......wacha uongo bana, it's very clear where your vote will be!!! Not necessarily. It might be the question of the possible run off btwn UK and RAO that he is alluding to bias for UK.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/14/2007 Posts: 4,152
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TAZ wrote:
UK is not my preferred candidate, as someone has pointed out i also don't think either him of RAO deserve to be President but kama its between those two then he'll have my vote. If it was about issues then i would not be talking about these two because they both belong in the crop of politicians we need to get rid of if we are to achieve anything as a country.
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