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North is not up!
masukuma
#61 Posted : Sunday, June 16, 2013 10:30:35 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
Mukiri wrote:
limanika wrote:
Mukiri wrote:
Super power is for what? Is it needed? 666=end of times=new world order=super power

It is human nature, many nations or peoples are envious of any country that is superpower. That is why there is struggle for economic and military dominance everywhere as a means to superpower status. This economic and military competition is the reason why the superpower trophy has changed hands several times throughout human history.
By the end of the 19th century Germany and the United States had eroded Britain's economic lead. Subsequent military and economic tensions between Britain and Germany were major causes of the First World War. The First World War can therefore be seen as a transition from Britain as superpower to either Germany or US. Of course Germany lost the battle. After Second World War, the USSR came calling for the trophy hence the onset of transition period marked by the cold war. USSR lost the battle. As we speak, China is aiming for the trophy.
As you can see, transition period from one superpower to another is very unsettling and is one factor that can lead to Third World War.
But come to think of it, where would we be without this kind of competition throughout human history? Not very far from Dark Ages in my view.

My point exactly! Dark ages is good.. Me, my goats, my crops and bare chested beauties running around. Isn't that the life?

Now I'm stuck with this modern times.. STDs, cancer, stress and unnecessary thinking! Think about it, the more we think we are going forward, the more we go back!

don't fight change - like a judoca use its force and direct it. those dark days did not have cures for simple things like diahorea. be like those guys in 1 Chronicles 12:32.... Know the times and know what step you are going to take.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
mkeiyd
#62 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 10:57:59 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 3/26/2012
Posts: 1,182
masukuma wrote:
it is my argument that all these 'images' have had a negative impact on africa not only to the eyes of the western world but by africans themselves. images such as this represent Africa's perception of itself.
for the last 300 years African labour build the 'new world' and now our minerals and wealth is building the east! Zindukeni and determine the future you want your kids to live in. Self sufficiency is the only way out! the only way to get some respect around here.


This sort of argument doesn't sit well with me.
3,000 years ago the Chinese, the Indians, the Greeks were doing their thing building their empires and economies, were they using Africans?
Did the Japanese use Africans to develop? The Koreans? The Singaporeans? Which are these minerals "building" the East? Can we consume all the minerals? The coffee? The tea?

They used their brains, laid down their priorities, put their houses in order and rolled their sleeves for serious business.

Blaming the size of our continent or oue countries on maps or turning them upside down won't take us anywhere. We should instead be looking at those maps,their geology, ecosystem etc, in order to help our country and our counties to develop.

I take the green part with both hands and legs.
masukuma
#63 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 11:25:24 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
mkeiyd wrote:
masukuma wrote:
it is my argument that all these 'images' have had a negative impact on africa not only to the eyes of the western world but by africans themselves. images such as this represent Africa's perception of itself.
for the last 300 years African labour build the 'new world' and now our minerals and wealth is building the east! Zindukeni and determine the future you want your kids to live in. Self sufficiency is the only way out! the only way to get some respect around here.


This sort of argument doesn't sit well with me.
3,000 years ago the Chinese, the Indians, the Greeks were doing their thing building their empires and economies, were they using Africans?
Did the Japanese use Africans to develop? The Koreans? The Singaporeans? Which are these minerals "building" the East? Can we consume all the minerals? The coffee? The tea?

They used their brains, laid down their priorities, put their houses in order and rolled their sleeves for serious business.

Blaming the size of our continent or oue countries on maps or turning them upside down won't take us anywhere. We should instead be looking at those maps,their geology, ecosystem etc, in order to help our country and our counties to develop.

I take the green part with both hands and legs.

you cannot rubbish history! not all progress on the planet has been from african backs - I never said so.
I am just stating a fact that if we are not careful now our resources will build the east as african backs built the new world.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
limanika
#64 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 12:02:02 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 2,032
In the West, Africa is referred to or thought to be the World’s cesspool.
Much more seriously though, it is reported that more than half of the 10 most rapidly growing economies are in Africa. The engine of growth in these economies is export of raw materials to the East. This is fake growth and is not sustainable in the long run. Sample this:

.The East buys raw materials from Africa, builds finished goods and sell the same to Africa at much higher cost.
.The East gives cheap loan to Africa so it can develop infrastructure, but the contractors, consultants and key materials are sourced from the same East. Then Africa is left paying back the loan for generations
.The East borrows ideas from the West, develops new / cheaper technologies to make more competitive products compared to those in West. This way, the East has been able to compete with the West.
.50 years after independence, we do not have any local contractor with capacity to build Thika Superhighway
.100 years ago after the British built the lunatic express, and 200 years after America built it’s railways, we still have to borrow funds and import labour to upgrade / build our own railway
.Who has ever heard of an African contractor winning a contract in the West or in the East?
In other words, we point accusing fingers to our fore fathers of 100-500 years ago that they were outsmarted and exploited by both the West and the East, yet in our time and age, under our very own eyes, the West and the East are indeed exploiting us in the very same way if not worse. Why can’t Africa build it’s own smart technologies (like M-PESA), exploit solar energy, make and export cheap finished goods etc. and compete with both West and East?
masukuma
#65 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 12:20:51 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
limanika wrote:
In the West, Africa is referred to or thought to be the World’s cesspool.
Much more seriously though, it is reported that more than half of the 10 most rapidly growing economies are in Africa. The engine of growth in these economies is export of raw materials to the East. This is fake growth and is not sustainable in the long run. Sample this:

.The East buys raw materials from Africa, builds finished goods and sell the same to Africa at much higher cost.
.The East gives cheap loan to Africa so it can develop infrastructure, but the contractors, consultants and key materials are sourced from the same East. Then Africa is left paying back the loan for generations
.The East borrows ideas from the West, develops new / cheaper technologies to make more competitive products compared to those in West. This way, the East has been able to compete with the West.
.50 years after independence, we do not have any local contractor with capacity to build Thika Superhighway
.100 years ago after the British built the lunatic express, and 200 years after America built it’s railways, we still have to borrow funds and import labour to upgrade / build our own railway
.Who has ever heard of an African contractor winning a contract in the West or in the East?
In other words, we point accusing fingers to our fore fathers of 100-500 years ago that they were outsmarted and exploited by both the West and the East, yet in our time and age, under our very own eyes, the West and the East are indeed exploiting us in the very same way if not worse. Why can’t Africa build it’s own smart technologies (like M-PESA), exploit solar energy, make and export cheap finished goods etc. and compete with both West and East?

the ink of history has not dried yet! Kwani history has kwishad? Human beings have been on this planet for thousands of years.
secondly, I am against using solar (it requires importing technology) our saviour in as far as cheap energy is simply using COAL!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
limanika
#66 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 12:49:08 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 2,032
masukuma wrote:
limanika wrote:
In the West, Africa is referred to or thought to be the World’s cesspool.
Much more seriously though, it is reported that more than half of the 10 most rapidly growing economies are in Africa. The engine of growth in these economies is export of raw materials to the East. This is fake growth and is not sustainable in the long run. Sample this:

.The East buys raw materials from Africa, builds finished goods and sell the same to Africa at much higher cost.
.The East gives cheap loan to Africa so it can develop infrastructure, but the contractors, consultants and key materials are sourced from the same East. Then Africa is left paying back the loan for generations
.The East borrows ideas from the West, develops new / cheaper technologies to make more competitive products compared to those in West. This way, the East has been able to compete with the West.
.50 years after independence, we do not have any local contractor with capacity to build Thika Superhighway
.100 years ago after the British built the lunatic express, and 200 years after America built it’s railways, we still have to borrow funds and import labour to upgrade / build our own railway
.Who has ever heard of an African contractor winning a contract in the West or in the East?
In other words, we point accusing fingers to our fore fathers of 100-500 years ago that they were outsmarted and exploited by both the West and the East, yet in our time and age, under our very own eyes, the West and the East are indeed exploiting us in the very same way if not worse. Why can’t Africa build it’s own smart technologies (like M-PESA), exploit solar energy, make and export cheap finished goods etc. and compete with both West and East?

the ink of history has not dried yet! Kwani history has kwishad? Human beings have been on this planet for thousands of years.
secondly, I am against using solar (it requires importing technology) our saviour in as far as cheap energy is simply using COAL!


We can build those solar panels right here and export them as well. If need be we can still import some of the raw materials used in their manufacture and export finished goods just line the East is doing.
Those rare earth minerals in Kwale - Illumenite,Rutile and Zircon – Rather than exporting the raw materials and earn peanuts, then import finished goods, we can use them to make finished goods right here such as paints, ceramics & tiles. These we can use when building our houses and export the remainder. I have never understood why we have to import tiles, sanitary fixtures, light fittings etc made in the East when building our houses.
Those rare earth minerals in Congo – Why can’t Kenya import them (at an advantage due to the short distance), make finished goods and export finished goods to the West and East? Why must the raw materials be exported to China, then we pay for finished goods including cost of transporting raw materials and then finished goods? What a waste?
masukuma
#67 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 2:07:17 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
limanika wrote:
masukuma wrote:
limanika wrote:
In the West, Africa is referred to or thought to be the World’s cesspool.
Much more seriously though, it is reported that more than half of the 10 most rapidly growing economies are in Africa. The engine of growth in these economies is export of raw materials to the East. This is fake growth and is not sustainable in the long run. Sample this:

.The East buys raw materials from Africa, builds finished goods and sell the same to Africa at much higher cost.
.The East gives cheap loan to Africa so it can develop infrastructure, but the contractors, consultants and key materials are sourced from the same East. Then Africa is left paying back the loan for generations
.The East borrows ideas from the West, develops new / cheaper technologies to make more competitive products compared to those in West. This way, the East has been able to compete with the West.
.50 years after independence, we do not have any local contractor with capacity to build Thika Superhighway
.100 years ago after the British built the lunatic express, and 200 years after America built it’s railways, we still have to borrow funds and import labour to upgrade / build our own railway
.Who has ever heard of an African contractor winning a contract in the West or in the East?
In other words, we point accusing fingers to our fore fathers of 100-500 years ago that they were outsmarted and exploited by both the West and the East, yet in our time and age, under our very own eyes, the West and the East are indeed exploiting us in the very same way if not worse. Why can’t Africa build it’s own smart technologies (like M-PESA), exploit solar energy, make and export cheap finished goods etc. and compete with both West and East?

the ink of history has not dried yet! Kwani history has kwishad? Human beings have been on this planet for thousands of years.
secondly, I am against using solar (it requires importing technology) our saviour in as far as cheap energy is simply using COAL!


We can build those solar panels right here and export them as well. If need be we can still import some of the raw materials used in their manufacture and export finished goods just line the East is doing.
Those rare earth minerals in Kwale - Illumenite,Rutile and Zircon – Rather than exporting the raw materials and earn peanuts, then import finished goods, we can use them to make finished goods right here such as paints, ceramics & tiles. These we can use when building our houses and export the remainder. I have never understood why we have to import tiles, sanitary fixtures, light fittings etc made in the East when building our houses.
Those rare earth minerals in Congo – Why can’t Kenya import them (at an advantage due to the short distance), make finished goods and export finished goods to the West and East? Why must the raw materials be exported to China, then we pay for finished goods including cost of transporting raw materials and then finished goods? What a waste?

this is the mentality that is dragging us back - CLIMB A TREE FROM THE BOTTOM! ask yourself - what do you have at hand!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
mkeiyd
#68 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 2:17:21 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 3/26/2012
Posts: 1,182
masukuma wrote:
limanika wrote:

We can build those solar panels right here and export them as well. If need be we can still import some of the raw materials used in their manufacture and export finished goods just line the East is doing.
Those rare earth minerals in Kwale - Illumenite,Rutile and Zircon – Rather than exporting the raw materials and earn peanuts, then import finished goods, we can use them to make finished goods right here such as paints, ceramics & tiles. These we can use when building our houses and export the remainder. I have never understood why we have to import tiles, sanitary fixtures, light fittings etc made in the East when building our houses.
Those rare earth minerals in Congo – Why can’t Kenya import them (at an advantage due to the short distance), make finished goods and export finished goods to the West and East? Why must the raw materials be exported to China, then we pay for finished goods including cost of transporting raw materials and then finished goods? What a waste?

this is the mentality that is dragging us back - CLIMB A TREE FROM THE BOTTOM! ask yourself - what do you have at hand!


@masukuma, Isn't @limanika saying we should start building our own? How is that retrogressive?

Ama lazima maps zi-change first before anything can happen?

Help me understand. Start with local road contractors for ease of understanding.
masukuma
#69 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 6:21:56 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
mkeiyd wrote:
masukuma wrote:
limanika wrote:

We can build those solar panels right here and export them as well. If need be we can still import some of the raw materials used in their manufacture and export finished goods just line the East is doing.
Those rare earth minerals in Kwale - Illumenite,Rutile and Zircon – Rather than exporting the raw materials and earn peanuts, then import finished goods, we can use them to make finished goods right here such as paints, ceramics & tiles. These we can use when building our houses and export the remainder. I have never understood why we have to import tiles, sanitary fixtures, light fittings etc made in the East when building our houses.
Those rare earth minerals in Congo – Why can’t Kenya import them (at an advantage due to the short distance), make finished goods and export finished goods to the West and East? Why must the raw materials be exported to China, then we pay for finished goods including cost of transporting raw materials and then finished goods? What a waste?

this is the mentality that is dragging us back - CLIMB A TREE FROM THE BOTTOM! ask yourself - what do you have at hand!


@masukuma, Isn't @limanika saying we should start building our own? How is that retrogressive?

Ama lazima maps zi-change first before anything can happen?

Help me understand. Start with local road contractors for ease of understanding.

For roads I agree! we can do the same but for for some technologies we need to size ourselves first.
Let me explain - a person of low capacity needs to pick their battles!kindly learn from others. stand on the shoulders of giants. for example - use layers of abstraction. if you are making a tablet - you don't have to design the chip, fabricate the chip, create the resistors, capacitors and all peripherals and casing so that you can call the resulting tablet 'african/kenyan'. abstract - use existing chips and components from their sources and fabricate a PCB - fairly easy. design your own casing and label it. Apple does not make the IPS screens on their IPads but that does not mean the device is 'less american'. in the case of Solar power - we many not have the capacity to build the cells but we can 'shikanisha' them and package them AKA adding value. Am I making sense?
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Mukiri
#70 Posted : Monday, June 17, 2013 7:03:12 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
limanika wrote:
masukuma wrote:
limanika wrote:
In the West, Africa is referred to or thought to be the World’s cesspool.
Much more seriously though, it is reported that more than half of the 10 most rapidly growing economies are in Africa. The engine of growth in these economies is export of raw materials to the East. This is fake growth and is not sustainable in the long run. Sample this:

.The East buys raw materials from Africa, builds finished goods and sell the same to Africa at much higher cost.
.The East gives cheap loan to Africa so it can develop infrastructure, but the contractors, consultants and key materials are sourced from the same East. Then Africa is left paying back the loan for generations
.The East borrows ideas from the West, develops new / cheaper technologies to make more competitive products compared to those in West. This way, the East has been able to compete with the West.
.50 years after independence, we do not have any local contractor with capacity to build Thika Superhighway
.100 years ago after the British built the lunatic express, and 200 years after America built it’s railways, we still have to borrow funds and import labour to upgrade / build our own railway
.Who has ever heard of an African contractor winning a contract in the West or in the East?
In other words, we point accusing fingers to our fore fathers of 100-500 years ago that they were outsmarted and exploited by both the West and the East, yet in our time and age, under our very own eyes, the West and the East are indeed exploiting us in the very same way if not worse. Why can’t Africa build it’s own smart technologies (like M-PESA), exploit solar energy, make and export cheap finished goods etc. and compete with both West and East?

the ink of history has not dried yet! Kwani history has kwishad? Human beings have been on this planet for thousands of years.
secondly, I am against using solar (it requires importing technology) our saviour in as far as cheap energy is simply using COAL!


We can build those solar panels right here and export them as well. If need be we can still import some of the raw materials used in their manufacture and export finished goods just line the East is doing.
Those rare earth minerals in Kwale - Illumenite,Rutile and Zircon – Rather than exporting the raw materials and earn peanuts, then import finished goods, we can use them to make finished goods right here such as paints, ceramics & tiles. These we can use when building our houses and export the remainder. I have never understood why we have to import tiles, sanitary fixtures, light fittings etc made in the East when building our houses.
Those rare earth minerals in Congo – Why can’t Kenya import them (at an advantage due to the short distance), make finished goods and export finished goods to the West and East? Why must the raw materials be exported to China, then we pay for finished goods including cost of transporting raw materials and then finished goods? What a waste?

I ditto everything here.

And cars/machinery, why in heavens name can't we manufacture our own machinery? We have the machines here.. Let's 'copy' what we have (improve on it if need be), rename the same and use it! Unethical someone might say, but we've been dealt with unethically for hundreds of years.. We would call it 'sharing'.

We should STOP export of any raw materials! If someone has found a use for what we have, let them come here and build a factory and we can discuss how to share the profits!!! We are the regional godfather, we don't take care of ourselves and thereafter our neighbors, who will?

Proverbs 19:21
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