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Pale blue dot
Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Wakanyugi wrote:tycho wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:tycho wrote:limanika wrote:There's space time and then there's matter, that's the natural. Then there's the supernatural. That's all. I'm thinking about all these ideas and please allow me to ask: 1. How do you know this statement is true? 2. Why is it important for you to be having belief in these assertions? Tycho: allow me to give my take on these questions, base on the earlier point about observer dependent reality: If we accept that everyone interprets reality in their own unique way, then it would follow that any interaction between us is an effort to seek areas of observation overlap, a consensus estimate of more than one observation, reducing them to something we can agree on. Without this, communication, or even existence in a common space/time frame would be impossible. It is likely that if there was nothing we could agree on, you and I would be practically invisible to each other. But, ultimately your truth remains yours and mine remains mine, even after the overlap. It is therefore possible for us to disagree and still be both correct. In fact it is likely that this is what happens most of the time. As for why all this is important, I can only answer this with the same question posed about mountains: why do people climb mountains? Ans. because they are there. Owning a body, a brain, the senses, intuition...the magnificent tools we have, and not using them to the ultimate is like buying a Ferrari and then driving it at 5Km per hour. Nothing wrong with it, but that is not what Ferrari's are meant for. I agree with you on the question of overlap and our quest for it and even the validity of various truths. Where we differ is why such activity is important. To put it into perspective, this activity is called philosophizing, and is it true that one will philosophize simply because he/she can? Humans philosophize because they must! I don't see where we disagree Tycho. We have the tools to philosophize, so we do. Some more than others of course. My pet peeve is about those who barely use those wonderful tools and allow all sorts of religious charlatans and politicians to do the philosophizing for them. But that is just me. True. Besides, there's no point for ever disagreeing. And still disagreeing isn't bad...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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limanika wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:Impunity wrote:masukuma wrote:I once someone once ask... so if I lost a hand and went to heaven - will the new body have the hand? the answer was YES.
So if someone had an intervention - like a nose job done and he loved it! what would happen? or even if someone had breast implants - will they go back to the small/big ones you had? Will Rooney keep his hair? What if i had gold teeth and liked them? Hizo fikira zako zote ni vanity! boss.... kama hujui jibu... lenga swali ama useme "sijui". there is no shame! really! no shame at all ni saying you don't know. it's not the only thing you don't know! by the way why do we demean, trivialise and belittle the only vessel we know for ourselves? we belittle it in such a way that we seem to see it as an enemy within or at best a necessary evil that has to accompany us. unknowingly we despise the one thing you have a long term commitment to! Commitment to the body is a delusion. When one sees the delusion then he gets to heaven. Even with one hand. interestingly enough it's parts of our bodies that tell us this garbage and create these delusions so that they can grasp, accept and "place a finger" on meaning in a random chaotic universe devoid of any purpose. The universe may be devoid of purpose, and yes we rely on the body to experience reality. But relations and how they're formed are beyond the body. Does man have any locus stadi to argue 'universe is devoid of purpose '. I think he doesn't have. Only the creator knows the purpose for which everything was created and how everything fits in the jig saw puzzle. For instance, remove the sun, moon, some of the planet's in solar system and life will end on earth. Who knows the entire role played by all other planetary bodies out there in keeping gravitation and solar system intact? Man has 'locus standi' to say anything and everything. The 'acid test' is whether intelligence is optimized or not.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,821 Location: Nairobi
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limanika wrote:
Does man have any locus stadi to argue 'universe is devoid of purpose '. I think he doesn't have. Only the creator knows the purpose for which everything was created and how everything fits in the jig saw puzzle. For instance, remove the sun, moon, some of the planet's in solar system and life will end on earth. Who knows the entire role played by all other planetary bodies out there in keeping gravitation and solar system intact?
reverse engineering purpose will always delude one. Was I meant (purposed) to be born? All the happenstances that led to my birth delude me to that fact. What if my mum just decided "ha feel my dad"? would I be born? We propergate our need to have a purpose back across time... our ansestors lived and did everything they did (good and bad) so that it may all terminate here and now... with us! I don't believe so... nature is random... there is no purpose to it other than it exists. the hand was not made for the glove! the glove was made for the hand! we were purposed by our parents but not that our parent's sole purpose was to make us. All the planetary movements, all the gazzilion chances and mischances gave rise to us and not by design! no one is minding the store... we are just naturally here like animals... just with a brain that clocks faster. purpose is however a useful delusion - it keeps us going forward.... All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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harrydre wrote:sisi ni 'watu' wadogo sana!!
That said, why is the area around the 'earth' dark? what about the other planets and objects some even larger than the earth? Not really, it depends on your point of view. We are quite big compared to the sun. 
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,821 Location: Nairobi
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hardwood wrote:harrydre wrote:sisi ni 'watu' wadogo sana!!
That said, why is the area around the 'earth' dark? what about the other planets and objects some even larger than the earth? Not really, it depends on your point of view. We are quite big compared to the sun. my finger looks bigger than the sun when i place it in front of my eye! we used to call it "perspective" in art and craft! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Is it that some here think big or bigger is better or more meaningful?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,821 Location: Nairobi
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tycho wrote:Is it that some here think big or bigger is better or more meaningful?  Well, "bigger" is just that "bigger" - a matter of fact, "better" is just that "better" - a matter of opinion, "more meaningful" is just that "more meaningful" - a matter of perception All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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masukuma wrote:tycho wrote:Is it that some here think big or bigger is better or more meaningful? Well, "bigger" is just that "bigger" - a matter of fact, "better" is just that "better" - a matter of opinion, "more meaningful" is just that "more meaningful" - a matter of perception Facts, opinions and perceptions. To know; difference, contrast all these are based on identity...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,821 Location: Nairobi
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tycho wrote:masukuma wrote:tycho wrote:Is it that some here think big or bigger is better or more meaningful? Well, "bigger" is just that "bigger" - a matter of fact, "better" is just that "better" - a matter of opinion, "more meaningful" is just that "more meaningful" - a matter of perception Facts, opinions and perceptions. To know; difference, contrast all these are based on identity... indeed.... remind me again why this conversation appears underneath the topic "Pale Blue Dot"? All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/23/2008 Posts: 3,017
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Everytime I read this and other similar threads, I find them very interesting, but then I am left wondering where you people find the time to dig up all this information. "The purpose of bureaucracy is to compensate for incompetence and lack of discipline." James Collins
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,821 Location: Nairobi
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:Everytime I read this and other similar threads, I find them very interesting, but then I am left wondering where you people find the time to dig up all this information.
for me I am always reading.... I like keeping my mind busy and while I get really fascinated by just knowing, the greatest pleasure if for me to philosophize the human condition and our lives in the context of all these happenings. I guess what happens is that it makes me feel rather fortunate to be here and I want to share this information to as many others in order for them to understand... just how fortunate they are to be on the planet and by some small twist it could be different - really different. I like thinking about butterfly effects and that makes me more careful in what I do today as what seems innocuous now could be really life changing in the future... All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 9/21/2011 Posts: 2,032
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masukuma wrote:limanika wrote:
Does man have any locus stadi to argue 'universe is devoid of purpose '. I think he doesn't have. Only the creator knows the purpose for which everything was created and how everything fits in the jig saw puzzle. For instance, remove the sun, moon, some of the planet's in solar system and life will end on earth. Who knows the entire role played by all other planetary bodies out there in keeping gravitation and solar system intact?
reverse engineering purpose will always delude one. Was I meant (purposed) to be born? All the happenstances that led to my birth delude me to that fact. What if my mum just decided "ha feel my dad"? would I be born? We propergate our need to have a purpose back across time... our ansestors lived and did everything they did (good and bad) so that it may all terminate here and now... with us! I don't believe so... nature is random... there is no purpose to it other than it exists. the hand was not made for the glove! the glove was made for the hand! we were purposed by our parents but not that our parent's sole purpose was to make us. All the planetary movements, all the gazzilion chances and mischances gave rise to us and not by design! no one is minding the store... we are just naturally here like animals... just with a brain that clocks faster. purpose is however a useful delusion - it keeps us going forward.... Don't belittle yourself. Imagine the earth and entire universe were prepared for eternity to accommodate man. Each and everyone of us was predestined before birth, that's why your parents are co-creators with God. You have an earthly father who's a step ahead in the hiearachy. And who knows, if you weren't born to your parents you would have been born elsewhere? That's why it's ridiculous to boast of our ethnicity. And man was made in God's image, that's why you're different from any animal out there
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,821 Location: Nairobi
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limanika wrote:masukuma wrote:limanika wrote:
Does man have any locus stadi to argue 'universe is devoid of purpose '. I think he doesn't have. Only the creator knows the purpose for which everything was created and how everything fits in the jig saw puzzle. For instance, remove the sun, moon, some of the planet's in solar system and life will end on earth. Who knows the entire role played by all other planetary bodies out there in keeping gravitation and solar system intact?
reverse engineering purpose will always delude one. Was I meant (purposed) to be born? All the happenstances that led to my birth delude me to that fact. What if my mum just decided "ha feel my dad"? would I be born? We propergate our need to have a purpose back across time... our ansestors lived and did everything they did (good and bad) so that it may all terminate here and now... with us! I don't believe so... nature is random... there is no purpose to it other than it exists. the hand was not made for the glove! the glove was made for the hand! we were purposed by our parents but not that our parent's sole purpose was to make us. All the planetary movements, all the gazzilion chances and mischances gave rise to us and not by design! no one is minding the store... we are just naturally here like animals... just with a brain that clocks faster. purpose is however a useful delusion - it keeps us going forward.... Don't belittle yourself. Imagine the earth and entire universe were prepared for eternity to accommodate man. Each and everyone of us was predestined before birth, that's why your parents are co-creators with God. You have an earthly father who's a step ahead in the hiearachy. And who knows, if you weren't born to your parents you would have been born elsewhere? That's why it's ridiculous to boast of our ethnicity. And man was made in God's image, that's why you're different from any animal out there it's not self belittlement - but really understanding how fortunate I am. I don't buy the rest of your explanation it's the case of claiming the hand was made for the glove. If my parents didn't give birth to me... I would not have been born! there is no master plan.... the cosmos conniving to have me here... it's chaos out there. As I have said today 32K African children under 5 will die from Malaria... I read sometime back about Nishapur a town of 1m plus people who were decapitated and their heads used to create a pyramid... I struggle to see why they didn't have a plan or their plan was chaotic. if there is indeed a plan for all of us, ending in tragedy or not that is just chaos in another name. The only thing that effectively explains that is chaos. But I also don't demean the need to feel purposed for "greatness". The human mind becomes what it thinks it is. I think the existence of the purpose is doubtful and unimportant when compared to the belief that there is a plan! especially the belief that there is a plan that requires your input. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,634
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:Every time I read this and other similar threads, I find them very interesting, but then I am left wondering where you people find the time to dig up all this information.
The only time I spend is when I write things here, which is not often. As for the thoughts this is what my mind constantly does, even when idling. A Sociologist friend of mine once told me that such 'roaming thoughts' are a an early sign of imminent insanity. I am yet to find out if she was joking or not. The only consolation is that, in Wazua nation, I would be in good company. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/4/2007 Posts: 1,162
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masukuma wrote:here is an interesting analogy - If the sun was a grapefruit, Earth would be the size of a grain of raw sugar 50 ft away!
you mean melon sized or plum sized?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:Everytime I read this and other similar threads, I find them very interesting, but then I am left wondering where you people find the time to dig up all this information.
There's an infinite supply of time here, and knowledge and sense for light are only acquired through work. Like now I have to read Brian Green's 'Fabric of the cosmos'. I have other tasks to do but I have to innovate/invent some way to shrink other tasks. It's like I'd rather have less of everything else and more of light!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/10/2008 Posts: 9,131 Location: Kanjo
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2010 Posts: 3,504 Location: Uganda
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harrydre wrote:Swenani wrote:Jesus Quote:The Voyager Golden Records are phonograph records that were included aboard both Voyager spacecraft launched in 1977. They contain sounds and images selected to portray the diversity of life and culture on Earth, and are intended for any intelligent extraterrestrial life form, or for future humans, who may find them. Neither Voyager spacecraft is heading toward any particular star, but Voyager 1 will pass within 1.6 light-years of the star Gliese 445, currently in the constellation Camelopardalis, in about 40,000 years. Will it survive that long? by the way 1.6 light years = 9.3 Trillion Miles! Where do they refuel these spacecrafts.IOW what powers spacecrafts and what makes it last for these long distances. Kwanini the same energy sources can't be utilised to power aeroplanes or Toyotas.hiyo tu ndio swali yangu. punda amecheka
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/23/2008 Posts: 3,017
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newfarer wrote:harrydre wrote:Swenani wrote:Jesus Quote:The Voyager Golden Records are phonograph records that were included aboard both Voyager spacecraft launched in 1977. They contain sounds and images selected to portray the diversity of life and culture on Earth, and are intended for any intelligent extraterrestrial life form, or for future humans, who may find them. Neither Voyager spacecraft is heading toward any particular star, but Voyager 1 will pass within 1.6 light-years of the star Gliese 445, currently in the constellation Camelopardalis, in about 40,000 years. Will it survive that long? by the way 1.6 light years = 9.3 Trillion Miles! Where do they refuel these spacecrafts.IOW what powers spacecrafts and what makes it last for these long distances. Kwanini the same energy sources can't be utilised to power aeroplanes or Toyotas.hiyo tu ndio swali yangu. The crafts are powered by nuclear fission and later on with the absensce of gravitational interference, they are able to maintain momentum in perpetuity. "The purpose of bureaucracy is to compensate for incompetence and lack of discipline." James Collins
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Rank: Member Joined: 9/25/2008 Posts: 510
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newfarer wrote:harrydre wrote:Swenani wrote:Jesus Quote:The Voyager Golden Records are phonograph records that were included aboard both Voyager spacecraft launched in 1977. They contain sounds and images selected to portray the diversity of life and culture on Earth, and are intended for any intelligent extraterrestrial life form, or for future humans, who may find them. Neither Voyager spacecraft is heading toward any particular star, but Voyager 1 will pass within 1.6 light-years of the star Gliese 445, currently in the constellation Camelopardalis, in about 40,000 years. Will it survive that long? by the way 1.6 light years = 9.3 Trillion Miles! Where do they refuel these spacecrafts.IOW what powers spacecrafts and what makes it last for these long distances. Kwanini the same energy sources can't be utilised to power aeroplanes or Toyotas.hiyo tu ndio swali yangu. Voyager 1 uses two types of fuels, one to power the thrusters, and another to keep the electronics running. The propellant is hydrazine, which is a mix of nitrogen and hydrogen that has a faint ammonia smell. This is used due to it being relatively cheap as well as it having a very low freezing point. The jets on Voyager 1 aren’t to push it through out space but only to reorient the space craft. Outer-space is gravity free meaning that it does not take much to get and keep and object moving. Voyager 1 has been traveling its multi-billion journey from its initial push at launch. Voyager 1 has had some help to keep going though from natural forces. When passing near by planets, the spacecraft took advantage of their gravitational fields which then acted like slingshots pushing it farther and faster into space I AM trust in GOD, I AM belief in THYSELF
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