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Referendum – the ambiguity of 1M signatures
Rank: Member Joined: 1/1/2011 Posts: 396
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Wendz wrote:This Katiba i love and hate at the same time. i love it more when politicians can not manipulate it knowing fully well we only got it because they disagreed. if they were all together, they'd be shafting us (the same "us" shouting hoarse in their support) by now.
Katiba ni sasa na kama si sasa, ni sasa hivi! Story ndio hii sasa! If you followed Kibaki regularly...he only had 3 genuine smiling moments I.e. a warm smile that lights up the eyes. 1. The day he was sworn in at Uhuru Park with his leg in a cast 2. The day he promulgated the constitution 3. The day UK was sworn in. Tuis from a man whose professor at Imperial College stated that his mind purrs like a Rolls Royce Engine
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 9/21/2011 Posts: 2,032
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masukuma wrote:limanika wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Part of the secretariat collecting signatures. 1 M tutapata. Kiambu alone will generate over 200k! Accuracy is on name/ID no/Voters card no full stop. Hapa hakuna BVR kit! If it is that simple any mole in IEBC can generate 1 million names with ID numbers within hours and print out. But pliz explain the process of verifying the signatures, that is subject of the thread i have already told you how it will play out Quote:
1) CORD will 'collect' these signatures.
2) They will be handed over to IEBC, IEBC will pokea them and 'trust' that the party that submitted them is telling the truth and kick of the process. in the same manner to supporters of presidential candidates (2k for each county for atleast half of the counties).
3) Ukitaka kustop process unakimbia kortini ukisema - these are fake voters. the court asks the IEBC - did you verify... the IEBC says it does not have a budget to hire data entry operators and the thing is stuck in limbo.
4) The court will ask IEBC to verify
5) once they verify that it's not 1m actual people (sijui signatures wata verify aje - i have a story to tell on that one but not for this forum) CORD gets called in and is accused of attempted fraud! in the same way some people presented fake voter registration slips worth 5/=
when you go to a gava office with your id - they don't call ole lenku to verify that you are actually having a real card - they 'trust' that you know that you will be prosecuted for fraud if you are caught having presented fraudulent papers. same thing with degree , KCSE cert or stuff from EACC or CID. they take it and 'file it'. When a challenge comes - the claims are examined. Maybe, maybe not. Katiba Clause 257 sub-section 4&5 – it states that IEBC shall verify and satisfy itself that the initiative is supported by 1 Million registered voters before transmitting to the counties. By IEBC taking the bill to various counties for approval, that in itself is confirmation that they have verified the signatures …and are satisfied. If a challenge later comes up in court and it comes to light that they did not verify, they will be guilty of violating the constitution…and that will not be a good place for IEBC to be…the court can order them to verify, an impossible task…they are then unable to verify or end up taking tooooo long.. and ‘people’ get impatient and end up accusing IEBC of incompetence…holding daily demos in protest , civil disobedience, etc anything really to make IEBC commissioners bow out of office even on own volition…This could all be part of the ‘grand plan’…Aliar is like a juggler really , you never quite know how it will end up…
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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limanika wrote:masukuma wrote:limanika wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Part of the secretariat collecting signatures. 1 M tutapata. Kiambu alone will generate over 200k! Accuracy is on name/ID no/Voters card no full stop. Hapa hakuna BVR kit! If it is that simple any mole in IEBC can generate 1 million names with ID numbers within hours and print out. But pliz explain the process of verifying the signatures, that is subject of the thread i have already told you how it will play out Quote:
1) CORD will 'collect' these signatures.
2) They will be handed over to IEBC, IEBC will pokea them and 'trust' that the party that submitted them is telling the truth and kick of the process. in the same manner to supporters of presidential candidates (2k for each county for atleast half of the counties).
3) Ukitaka kustop process unakimbia kortini ukisema - these are fake voters. the court asks the IEBC - did you verify... the IEBC says it does not have a budget to hire data entry operators and the thing is stuck in limbo.
4) The court will ask IEBC to verify
5) once they verify that it's not 1m actual people (sijui signatures wata verify aje - i have a story to tell on that one but not for this forum) CORD gets called in and is accused of attempted fraud! in the same way some people presented fake voter registration slips worth 5/=
when you go to a gava office with your id - they don't call ole lenku to verify that you are actually having a real card - they 'trust' that you know that you will be prosecuted for fraud if you are caught having presented fraudulent papers. same thing with degree , KCSE cert or stuff from EACC or CID. they take it and 'file it'. When a challenge comes - the claims are examined. Maybe, maybe not. Katiba Clause 257 sub-section 4&5 – it states that IEBC shall verify and satisfy itself that the initiative is supported by 1 Million registered voters before transmitting to the counties. By IEBC taking the bill to various counties for approval, that in itself is confirmation that they have verified the signatures …and are satisfied. If a challenge later comes up in court and it comes to light that they did not verify, they will be guilty of violating the constitution…and that will not be a good place for IEBC to be…the court can order them to verify, an impossible task…they are then unable to verify or end up taking tooooo long.. and ‘people’ get impatient and end up accusing IEBC of incompetence…holding daily demos in protest , civil disobedience, etc anything really to make IEBC commissioners bow out of office even on own volition…This could all be part of the ‘grand plan’…Aliar is like a juggler really , you never quite know how it will end up… I think you give Aliar too much credit - why didn't people question the 2000 voters from every county requirement for presidency? why? All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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limanika wrote:masukuma wrote:limanika wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Part of the secretariat collecting signatures. 1 M tutapata. Kiambu alone will generate over 200k! Accuracy is on name/ID no/Voters card no full stop. Hapa hakuna BVR kit! If it is that simple any mole in IEBC can generate 1 million names with ID numbers within hours and print out. But pliz explain the process of verifying the signatures, that is subject of the thread i have already told you how it will play out Quote:
1) CORD will 'collect' these signatures.
2) They will be handed over to IEBC, IEBC will pokea them and 'trust' that the party that submitted them is telling the truth and kick of the process. in the same manner to supporters of presidential candidates (2k for each county for atleast half of the counties).
3) Ukitaka kustop process unakimbia kortini ukisema - these are fake voters. the court asks the IEBC - did you verify... the IEBC says it does not have a budget to hire data entry operators and the thing is stuck in limbo.
4) The court will ask IEBC to verify
5) once they verify that it's not 1m actual people (sijui signatures wata verify aje - i have a story to tell on that one but not for this forum) CORD gets called in and is accused of attempted fraud! in the same way some people presented fake voter registration slips worth 5/=
when you go to a gava office with your id - they don't call ole lenku to verify that you are actually having a real card - they 'trust' that you know that you will be prosecuted for fraud if you are caught having presented fraudulent papers. same thing with degree , KCSE cert or stuff from EACC or CID. they take it and 'file it'. When a challenge comes - the claims are examined. Maybe, maybe not. Katiba Clause 257 sub-section 4&5 – it states that IEBC shall verify and satisfy itself that the initiative is supported by 1 Million registered voters before transmitting to the counties. By IEBC taking the bill to various counties for approval, that in itself is confirmation that they have verified the signatures …and are satisfied. If a challenge later comes up in court and it comes to light that they did not verify, they will be guilty of violating the constitution…and that will not be a good place for IEBC to be…the court can order them to verify, an impossible task…they are then unable to verify or end up taking tooooo long.. and ‘people’ get impatient and end up accusing IEBC of incompetence…holding daily demos in protest , civil disobedience, etc anything really to make IEBC commissioners bow out of office even on own volition…This could all be part of the ‘grand plan’…Aliar is like a juggler really , you never quite know how it will end up… The issue is that they verified and they were satisfied. If someone later claims the signatures were not genuine, then its the case of that person who presented the fake signature to answer in court. IEBC will just say they were not able to verify that it was fake. That way IEBC will actually be the ones aggrieved because someone "conned" them through a fake signature. Kwani how did they verify the signatures that the presidential candidates presented? Hapa hakuna case. Wacha Referendum ifanywe. Might be in 2015, maybe in 2016. Then 2017 we go to elections. Sijui how long it will take to "Okoa Kenya" through a referendum. Unless the referendum will be done this year. Why OKOA Kenya in 2016 through a referendum when the following year you can okoa it through the presidential ballot? Its just another way of starting campaigns early enough.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 9/21/2011 Posts: 2,032
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@washiku, the law is an ass, could turn either way in court.But we all know aliar's interest is to gain momentum ahead of 2017. For one how does he already know that Parliament will not pass the ammendments invalidating need 4 referendum. It's like someone gives you something to approve, then tells you to reject the same 4 no reason to achieve selfish ends behind your very back, using your refusal as justification. But as we wait 4 the maswali, which will be challenged in court immediately, no harm thinking ahead!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/15/2006 Posts: 3,907
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What is the problem with this fellow? He needs to respect the Opposition - from Lamu to land allocations, despite all the insecurity in the country. He is the cause of so much anguish in the country at the moment...
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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washiku wrote:limanika wrote:masukuma wrote:limanika wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Part of the secretariat collecting signatures. 1 M tutapata. Kiambu alone will generate over 200k! Accuracy is on name/ID no/Voters card no full stop. Hapa hakuna BVR kit! If it is that simple any mole in IEBC can generate 1 million names with ID numbers within hours and print out. But pliz explain the process of verifying the signatures, that is subject of the thread i have already told you how it will play out Quote:
1) CORD will 'collect' these signatures.
2) They will be handed over to IEBC, IEBC will pokea them and 'trust' that the party that submitted them is telling the truth and kick of the process. in the same manner to supporters of presidential candidates (2k for each county for atleast half of the counties).
3) Ukitaka kustop process unakimbia kortini ukisema - these are fake voters. the court asks the IEBC - did you verify... the IEBC says it does not have a budget to hire data entry operators and the thing is stuck in limbo.
4) The court will ask IEBC to verify
5) once they verify that it's not 1m actual people (sijui signatures wata verify aje - i have a story to tell on that one but not for this forum) CORD gets called in and is accused of attempted fraud! in the same way some people presented fake voter registration slips worth 5/=
when you go to a gava office with your id - they don't call ole lenku to verify that you are actually having a real card - they 'trust' that you know that you will be prosecuted for fraud if you are caught having presented fraudulent papers. same thing with degree , KCSE cert or stuff from EACC or CID. they take it and 'file it'. When a challenge comes - the claims are examined. Maybe, maybe not. Katiba Clause 257 sub-section 4&5 – it states that IEBC shall verify and satisfy itself that the initiative is supported by 1 Million registered voters before transmitting to the counties. By IEBC taking the bill to various counties for approval, that in itself is confirmation that they have verified the signatures …and are satisfied. If a challenge later comes up in court and it comes to light that they did not verify, they will be guilty of violating the constitution…and that will not be a good place for IEBC to be…the court can order them to verify, an impossible task…they are then unable to verify or end up taking tooooo long.. and ‘people’ get impatient and end up accusing IEBC of incompetence…holding daily demos in protest , civil disobedience, etc anything really to make IEBC commissioners bow out of office even on own volition…This could all be part of the ‘grand plan’…Aliar is like a juggler really , you never quite know how it will end up… The issue is that they verified and they were satisfied. If someone later claims the signatures were not genuine, then its the case of that person who presented the fake signature to answer in court. IEBC will just say they were not able to verify that it was fake. That way IEBC will actually be the ones aggrieved because someone "conned" them through a fake signature. Kwani how did they verify the signatures that the presidential candidates presented? Hapa hakuna case. Wacha Referendum ifanywe. Might be in 2015, maybe in 2016. Then 2017 we go to elections. Sijui how long it will take to "Okoa Kenya" through a referendum. Unless the referendum will be done this year. Why OKOA Kenya in 2016 through a referendum when the following year you can okoa it through the presidential ballot? Its just another way of starting campaigns early enough. exactly my point! the papers were accepted and FILED. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/17/2009 Posts: 3,583 Location: Kenya
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every registered kenyan citizen leaves behind a signature with the government, so I don't think it should be that hard to verify the authenticity of the same.
since tuko kwa digital gava, iebc might just crowd source the verification process
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,823 Location: Nairobi
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nakujua wrote:every registered kenyan citizen leaves behind a signature with the government, so I don't think it should be that hard to verify the authenticity of the same.
since tuko kwa digital gava, iebc might just crowd source the verification process hii ndio tunaita 'overthinking' All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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masukuma wrote:nakujua wrote:every registered kenyan citizen leaves behind a signature with the government, so I don't think it should be that hard to verify the authenticity of the same.
since tuko kwa digital gava, iebc might just crowd source the verification process hii ndio tunaita 'overthinking'  Where do we leave the signatures? Kwa ID? Are you sure the sign in your ID is the same you would use if you were asked to sign today? Plus there are people with multiple signatures just like the way the have multiple handles on Wazua. I don't know why people are afraid of this thing. My only problem with it is that it will waste money that could have been used otherwise. Politically, I bet it will leave CORD more divided than it is if it ever happens.
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Referendum – the ambiguity of 1M signatures
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