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Elade Attack
Alba
#261 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 4:10:46 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
¿ wrote:
Alba wrote:
The incompetence of Kenya military is largely due to decades of dubious promotions. As Kenyans we don't value the concept of having competent people running our institutions. We don't value accountability.
Even if they come home, I have no confidence that they can protect Kenyans. Look at how they reacted to Westgate and Garissa Univ. Look at the lack of coordination.


How can that be changed?


Only if Kenyans demand accountability and switch from tribal voting to issue based voting. If you dont't then issues like corruption, incompetence, impunity and lack of accountability will never be solved. Likely won't happen in our lifetimes. But it can start somewhere.
maka
#262 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 4:12:53 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Just sad....
possunt quia posse videntur
Alba
#263 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 4:18:20 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
Um Sayala wrote:

@ Alba, you sound bitter. Did you try getting into the forces and failed?
Were you sacked due to your incompetence now that you know so much about their incompetence?

What you call dubious promotions is a naked lie. Officers get training in same institutions, right from cadet to various career progressing courses. and you'll not get a promotion before doing a pr-requisite course.
Leading men in uniform with weapons is no child's play. Gaining their trust so that they fight till the last drop of blood is an equally daunting task. They must believe that you measure up man.
Sorry.


You are rather naive if you think promotions are done purely on merit in an government institution. Heck even in the private sector their is a lot of politics and tribalism. I was not denied a promotion in the Forces. I would never dream of working for the Kenya government precisely because merit is not the key factor in who rises to the top. I have spoken numerous times with people in the police and in the army.

And if promotions are done purely on merit and there is accountability then why are our security forces so incompetent? Look at their reaction to Westgate, Garissa Univ etc. Look at how that El Adde camp was so poorly secured. Look at the lack of intelligence gathering. And what about the possibility that they were warned of an impending attack.

No I'm not bitter. I am just disappointed at the fact that we keep handing Al Shaitan propaganda victories because we can't get the basics right. If we don't hold people accountable, we are doomed to keep repeating the same mistakes.
gregory
#264 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 4:43:38 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 12/2/2011
Posts: 176
kiash wrote:
I watched some part and i just wonder why Kenya does things in a "kariko" manner the tents covered with some blue tents like those they sell to cover pickups transporting potatoes. Its sad but looking at the state of the camp, somepeople somewhere are eating military money and this behind the security clause where we cannot ask for details.Any one been to those Nanyuki sides and compare how the Njonis camps are to Kenya army camps? I remember being a kid and the landrovers we used to see them days + buses that used to take military kids to forces academy are not what we see today. Yet the budget has been going upwards. That is what we can see so imagine what we cannot see.

The sad bit is their lives are in the end worthless. One of the dying soldiers talked about how the families don't get paid when they die in battle yet the figure is USD 50,000!!! where does that money go? Even some of their salaries get delayed.
Othelo
#265 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 5:00:02 PM
Rank: User

Joined: 1/20/2014
Posts: 3,528
gregory wrote:
kiash wrote:
I watched some part and i just wonder why Kenya does things in a "kariko" manner the tents covered with some blue tents like those they sell to cover pickups transporting potatoes. Its sad but looking at the state of the camp, somepeople somewhere are eating military money and this behind the security clause where we cannot ask for details.Any one been to those Nanyuki sides and compare how the Njonis camps are to Kenya army camps? I remember being a kid and the landrovers we used to see them days + buses that used to take military kids to forces academy are not what we see today. Yet the budget has been going upwards. That is what we can see so imagine what we cannot see.

The sad bit is their lives are in the end worthless. One of the dying soldiers talked about how the families don't get paid when they die in battle yet the figure is USD 50,000!!! where does that money go? Even some of their salaries get delayed.

@Um Sayala should tell us.
Formal education will make you a living. Self-education will make you a fortune - Jim Rohn.
Intelligentsia
#266 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 5:39:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/1/2009
Posts: 2,436
Good we are discussing this.
But there is clearly an al shatain sympathizer in this thread.
Musimo
#267 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 8:16:54 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/3/2015
Posts: 118
Location: Nairobi
those who are pro-pull-out:remember garissa, most of you cried incompetence. The military deployed to close that door. since then, there have been ZERO attacks in kenya. but still you cry incompetence. The nterior ministry proposed a boundary demarcation (called a wall), most of you complained and cried...you guessed it,incompetence.(Google Jordan waklls with their neighbours to see how effective they are against what we are facing currently,google serbia's wall). One side we cry how we want equal distribution of government positions based on tribes not merit, other sides we cry distribute based on merit. When the current CBK governor (Opus Dei) was handed the job, guys cried tribe tribe. Now that he is seen to be working guys claim he was right for the job. We are our own worst enemies. So before you come here and embarrass yourself with a poor opinion of how things are broken and how yu are the only one who can see the same (e.g. why KQ didnt fly the Kenyan sevens team home yet they are their sponsors) first research then write/give your opinion, otherwise what you write ittatumika kufunga nyama na isahaulike.
Sorry for getting away from topic, but I leave you with this: UN has always delayed dues for soldiers in somalia, something that kibaki before and now uhuru have complained about,ati verification (google is your friend). Google also CDF Karangi in somalia to personally apologise to soldiers because the UN and AU failed them in terms of rations and ammo. Uhuru went to france, Germany. Mission: have AMISOM convert to a UN mission, complete with troops other than those who have manned somalia since AMISOM went in, or increase funding accordingly. some wazuans were here crying how kazi yake ni kutembea nje. present and previous governments have been fighting trench wars to admit kenya's air and naval assets into AMISOM, whereas the UN has refused numerous times (google the same). So who is incompetent now?(Remember the many observers who cry and scream everytime the airforce does its thing in somalia, or the navy sinks some skiffs in the ocean)

Honour that soldier out there pulling in a shift so that you sleep well, educate yourself accordingly with the issues at hand, then when you give your opinions, you are regarded to as smart and learned. I leave you with a video here, see the 'incompetence'...

"embed https://www.facebook.com...ideos/1226473667393245/ embed"
hardwood
#268 Posted : Thursday, April 21, 2016 8:25:40 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Othelo wrote:
gregory wrote:
kiash wrote:
I watched some part and i just wonder why Kenya does things in a "kariko" manner the tents covered with some blue tents like those they sell to cover pickups transporting potatoes. Its sad but looking at the state of the camp, somepeople somewhere are eating military money and this behind the security clause where we cannot ask for details.Any one been to those Nanyuki sides and compare how the Njonis camps are to Kenya army camps? I remember being a kid and the landrovers we used to see them days + buses that used to take military kids to forces academy are not what we see today. Yet the budget has been going upwards. That is what we can see so imagine what we cannot see.

The sad bit is their lives are in the end worthless. One of the dying soldiers talked about how the families don't get paid when they die in battle yet the figure is USD 50,000!!! where does that money go? Even some of their salaries get delayed.

@Um Sayala should tell us.


The initial bomb blast must have injured many soldiers. The defense positions were then targeted with rocket propelled grenades and vehicle mounted machine guns and ak47s. From what I saw on the video it seems the camp had some perimeter protection in form of what could be razor wire or electric fence or trip wires about 200m from the camp and could see the kebabs jumping over an area they had placed a fabric/tarpaulin over. Seems they bombarded the camp with rocket propelled grenades and machine gun fire for quite some time (some hours from 5am to daylight) before jumping over the barrier and into the camp and by then the bomb and grenades my have had a devastating effect on camp defences. All in all I am proud our boys fought to the end. Some even "fought their way out" and were airlifted back home.

For those commenting on the camp's architecture and conditions, they should know that soldiers on the front line deep in enemy territory sleep in trenches or rabbit holes or underground tunnels. At least our boys have the luxury of living above ground which is an indicator that they have secured their surroundings. I'd suggest they use land mines to secure their surroundings. They should also maintain a 10km radius buffer/security zone around the camps where no man or beast is allowed to enter, anything that enters that zone would be kwisha.
Um Sayala
#269 Posted : Friday, April 22, 2016 10:49:23 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 12/17/2010
Posts: 1,163
Location: Sudan
Alba wrote:
Um Sayala wrote:

@ Alba, you sound bitter. Did you try getting into the forces and failed?
Were you sacked due to your incompetence now that you know so much about their incompetence?

What you call dubious promotions is a naked lie. Officers get training in same institutions, right from cadet to various career progressing courses. and you'll not get a promotion before doing a pr-requisite course.
Leading men in uniform with weapons is no child's play. Gaining their trust so that they fight till the last drop of blood is an equally daunting task. They must believe that you measure up man.
Sorry.


You are rather naive if you think promotions are done purely on merit in an government institution. Heck even in the private sector their is a lot of politics and tribalism. I was not denied a promotion in the Forces. I would never dream of working for the Kenya government precisely because merit is not the key factor in who rises to the top. I have spoken numerous times with people in the police and in the army.

And if promotions are done purely on merit and there is accountability then why are our security forces so incompetent? Look at their reaction to Westgate, Garissa Univ etc. Look at how that El Adde camp was so poorly secured. Look at the lack of intelligence gathering. And what about the possibility that they were warned of an impending attack.

No I'm not bitter. I am just disappointed at the fact that we keep handing Al Shaitan propaganda victories because we can't get the basics right. If we don't hold people accountable, we are doomed to keep repeating the same mistakes.


Naive I'm not. Incompetent they are not. I initially intended to correct your misguided perception word for word, but wehen I read your statement in red I changed my mind.

For Kenyan Systems may not be perfect, Promotions May not be purely on merit( And I believe this is ok, there are many other factors, merit being among them)BUT I have chosen to get into the mud and try to correct whenever I can, Rather than make noise and curse how I would not work for the Govt.
If only the private sector did not condone corruption, if only YOU could do your part, May be the public sector could improve.
But for the gallant soldiers, to our brothers and sisters in Unifrorm, I Salute you. I know my freedom is hinged on your selfless blood. RIP the fallen heroes, you paid the ultimate price.
"Peace is our profession, War is our business" ...Unknown
Alba
#270 Posted : Friday, April 22, 2016 4:45:48 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
Um Sayala wrote:


Naive I'm not. Incompetent they are not. I initially intended to correct your misguided perception word for word, but wehen I read your statement in red I changed my mind.

For Kenyan Systems may not be perfect, Promotions May not be purely on merit( And I believe this is ok, there are many other factors, merit being among them)BUT I have chosen to get into the mud and try to correct whenever I can, Rather than make noise and curse how I would not work for the Govt.
If only the private sector did not condone corruption, if only YOU could do your part, May be the public sector could improve.
But for the gallant soldiers, to our brothers and sisters in Unifrorm, I Salute you. I know my freedom is hinged on your selfless blood. RIP the fallen heroes, you paid the ultimate price.


Your naivette knows no bounds. You think one individual can change an entire culture that pervades an entire country?

If you really cared about those gallant soldiers you speak of, you would be calling for reforms that lead to better leadership. You would be demanding that they be better equipped.

Instead you are making excuses for a broken system. People like you who are sycophants and keep making excuses for a broken system are the reason so much Kenya is in such a mess.

Everyone else looking at this situation has admitted that there were major tactical blunders. From journalists to experts and even other wazuans. You are the only one here making sycophantic excuses. Kenya's problems are because of people like you. The unemployment rate, poor housing, incessant traffic, insecurity, land grabbing, corruption scandals, poor health systems all happen because we have too many sycophants who are quick to make excuses for lousy behavior. We will never progress unless we demand better leadership at levels.
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