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Robert Mugabe
radiomast
#21 Posted : Friday, September 06, 2019 8:10:56 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/15/2018
Posts: 428
Impunity wrote:
Real black African.


The man committed genocide and atrocities killing 20,000 fellow black Africans in a genocide event he called Gukurahundi. It may have been worse than the Rwanda Genocide.

This is typical of many black African leaders. So in that sense you are right.
hardwood
#22 Posted : Friday, September 06, 2019 8:17:25 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.
hardwood
#23 Posted : Friday, September 06, 2019 8:34:10 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
I am shocked that the new guy mganangwa is undoing what Mugabe did....

https://www.africanews.c...ost-land-under-mugabe//

Quote:
Zimbabwe pays $64m to white farmers who lost land under Mugabe

Compensation payments have been made to white farmers in Zimbabwe who lost their farms in a controversial land reform policy under the erstwhile Robert Mugabe – led government.

Finance Minister Mthuli Ncube is quoted by the state-owned Herald newspaper as saying 93 farmers had so far benefited to the tune of $64 million.

According to him efforts were still underway to trigger more disbursements via a verification exercise given that the government had identified more farmers who needed to be duly compensated.

“Compensating the affected farmers is a noble idea and is in keeping with our constitutional dispensation,” he added.

The plan apparently angered a South African firebrand politician, Julius Malema, leader of the Economic Freedom Fighters, EFF, who branded President Emmerson Mnangagwa a sellout by agreeing to compensate the farmers.

Malema opined that it was particularly worrying for a financially burdened country as Zimbabwe to find money for other reasons than alleviating poverty.

“It’s a sellout position. The way he is going about it, he is not going to finish his term,” Malema said.

“That country is swimming in a pool of poverty; they can’t afford basic things like primary health, proper education and infrastructure. He gets money and goes to give it to people who are not deserving. He is reversing the gains of the revolution struggle. It’s unsustainable,” he added.

The Zimbabwe government and ruling party, Zanu-PF, have stood by the decision charging Malema to stay off their internal affairs and justifying that the move was to win investor confidence.

The party spokesman Simon Khaya Moyo urged Malema to let Zimbabwe deal with its internal issues whiles deputy information minister Energy Mutodi was quoted as telling local NewsDay portal that Harare is seeking to mend fences with western countries.

“Government is clearing all obstacles that have hampered cordial and co-operative relations with Britain and the whole European Union bloc. The Second Republic is focusing on re-engagement.



https://www.telegraph.co...farmers-99-year-leases/
Quote:
Emmerson Mnangagwa offers Zimbabwe's white farmers 99-year leases

White farmers in Zimbabwe have said they are are relieved and “at peace” after president Emmerson Mnangagwa's government said it would end land invasions and offer them longer leases for their farms.

Mr Mnangagwa, who came to power after a soft coup d’etat last November, gave orders earlier this month to grant the estimated 200 to 300 remaining white farmers in the country 99-year leases for their land.

A government letter, dated January 3 but published only on Wednesday, said: “Please be informed that the Minister of Lands, Agriculture and Rural Resettlement has directed that all remaining white farmers be issued 99-year leases.

Collectively, white farmers were forced to abandon more then 17 million acres of land as well as equipment, personal possessions, and livestock.

Many of them have drawn up detailed audited claims in the hoped of one day winning compensation. The total value of the claims is estimated to be about £6 billion, including for land and “improvements.”

On February 1 this year, the state-owned newspaper The Herald reported that Mnangagwa had pronounced that white farmers willing to come back and farm were free to do so but had to apply for land just as anyone else has to. Under Zimbabwe’s constitution all agricultural land belongs to the government.

The new administration also moved to stop fresh illegal farm occupations, and some illegal settlers have since appeared in courts across the country.

Eddie Cross, the Movement for Democratic Change’s economic affairs secretary, said reliable information shows that about 600 white farmers are back on Zimbabwean farms since Mnangagwa took over.

radiomast
#24 Posted : Friday, September 06, 2019 10:03:41 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/15/2018
Posts: 428
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.



@hardwood

Mandela's crime according to you is that he cooled down angry blacks.

Mugabe's crime which is well documented is that he killed 20,000 black African people during the genocide he called Gukurahundi.

Which one is worse?
Bigchick
#25 Posted : Saturday, September 07, 2019 2:36:59 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/8/2013
Posts: 4,068
Location: At Large.
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.


Ok,I know this is petty but I thought the challenge was in the spoken word not the written word.
Love is beautiful and so are those who share it.With Love, Marriage is an amazing event in ones life time, the foundation of joy, happiness and success.
Wakanyugi
#26 Posted : Saturday, September 07, 2019 11:25:17 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/3/2007
Posts: 1,634
Angelica _ann wrote:
Passes on while being treated in Singapore.


Finally we can retire all those stupid memes.

Farewell Comrade Bob.
"The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
hardwood
#27 Posted : Saturday, September 07, 2019 11:47:02 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Bigchick wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.


Ok,I know this is petty but I thought the challenge was in the spoken word not the written word.

smile
Lolest!
#28 Posted : Saturday, September 07, 2019 9:37:36 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Wakanyugi wrote:

Finally we can retire all those stupid memes.


Applause Applause Applause
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
sparkly
#29 Posted : Sunday, September 08, 2019 9:32:49 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
RIP Bob, true liberator of his Country.
Life is short. Live passionately.
Impunity
#30 Posted : Sunday, September 08, 2019 8:46:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,328
Location: Masada
Angelica _ann wrote:
gk wrote:
Bigchick wrote:
My grandfather(RIP) had very kind words for him.Rest well Bob,you what you had to do.

How old is Grace......guess she will need someone to love her.

smile smile


For Grace, there must be many in the queue, if not already'inside'. smile


There was a minister who was already up to task when Bob was still kicking.
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

mpobiz
#31 Posted : Sunday, September 08, 2019 11:10:00 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 2,264
https://youtu.be/1NpjFiM4TQk
I was watching this and realized that we also have our own Mugabe. He needs to retire early to avoid a coup. he has been aaround for too long now people see him as a small god. They have started kneeling before him. Shindwe!!
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
2012
#32 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 12:13:42 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.


That's not fair to Mandela. He was a transitional one-term president. If he had gone against the whites, SA economy would have crashed. The whites were well educated and controlled all the important aspects of the nation. I'm sure Mandela hated as he could not have made any drastic moves. The xenophobia there shows you that Mandela made the right move, can you imagine if the first black president was an angry black man like Malema? He also did not want the whites as a 'new' minority to start receiving sympathy from the world. It was a very tough balancing act for him and he did very well. I also heard that some timelines were agreed on amounts of land being surrendered back slowly over time in the independence negotiations... but I'm not well informed on that matter, maybe someone here has more details.

BBI will solve it
:)
Gathige
#33 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 10:24:55 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/29/2011
Posts: 2,242
2012 wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.


That's not fair to Mandela. He was a transitional one-term president. If he had gone against the whites, SA economy would have crashed. The whites were well educated and controlled all the important aspects of the nation. I'm sure Mandela hated as he could not have made any drastic moves. The xenophobia there shows you that Mandela made the right move, can you imagine if the first black president was an angry black man like Malema? He also did not want the whites as a 'new' minority to start receiving sympathy from the world. It was a very tough balancing act for him and he did very well. I also heard that some timelines were agreed on amounts of land being surrendered back slowly over time in the independence negotiations... but I'm not well informed on that matter, maybe someone here has more details.


I have watched the clips on the violence in SA and my conclusion is that our SA brothers need serious help. Years of oppression where the only meaningful work was toiling in the mines, farms, while living in shanties had a devastating effect on them psychologically. The anger in Malema typically expresses the psyche of the blacks.

ANC has failed them terribly. Mandela set the tone, Zuma messed the Mbeki years, and subsequently sold SA to Indians during his term. Cyril is part of what Malema calls" white monopoly capital" and is soo deep in the white economy. The factionalism in ANC is soo deep and factions always plotting on how to bring down the president. Too much corruption deals/past among the key leaders like DP, Secretary General and others.

The boers should just take back power and run the place before it degenerates to another Congo.




"Things that matter most must never be at the mercy of things that matter least." Goethe
hardwood
#34 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 11:15:10 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
The Daily Nation agrees with me 100% that Mugabe was a great leader....

https://www.nation.co.ke...4644-13uqnwoz/index.html
hardwood
#35 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 2:51:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
radiomast wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.



@hardwood

Mandela's crime according to you is that he cooled down angry blacks.

Mugabe's crime which is well documented is that he killed 20,000 black African people during the genocide he called Gukurahundi.

Which one is worse?



Mugabe answers your question regarding gukurahundi. Before and after independence there was rivalry between mugabe's ZANU and Joshua Nkomo's ZAPU. After Mugabe took power at independence ZAPU and their ndebele supporters then imported arms from the soviet union to topple mugabe. It is Nyerere who informed Mugabe about the arm imports through dar es salam port. Then Mugabe sent the army to mop up the arms which had been distributed to the ZAPU ndebele supporters, just like any leader would have done. Did you want Mugabe to sit back and do nothing?

hardwood
#36 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 3:37:24 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
hardwood wrote:
radiomast wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
Rest in peace Bob.

I hope he had left power earlier then he would have been held up in mention with the greats in Africa; Mandela, Nyerere, Nkuruma and the likes.


Mandera was worst. Only whites love him coz he cooled down the angry blacks after apartheid ended and thus prevented a massacre and dispossession of msungus with his rainbow nation nonsense. Otherwise he did nothing for the black man.



@hardwood

Mandela's crime according to you is that he cooled down angry blacks.

Mugabe's crime which is well documented is that he killed 20,000 black African people during the genocide he called Gukurahundi.

Which one is worse?



Mugabe answers your question regarding gukurahundi. Before and after independence there was rivalry between mugabe's ZANU and Joshua Nkomo's ZAPU. After Mugabe took power at independence ZAPU and their ndebele supporters then imported arms from the soviet union to topple mugabe. It is Nyerere who informed Mugabe about the arm imports through dar es salam port. Then Mugabe sent the army to mop up the arms which had been distributed to the ZAPU ndebele supporters, just like any leader would have done. Did you want Mugabe to sit back and do nothing?



Also note that it is the current president Mnagangwa who was the Minister for State security then and was in charge of operation Gukurahundi.

https://mg.co.za/article...i-ghosts-haunt-mnangagwa
radiomast
#37 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 4:36:43 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/15/2018
Posts: 428
@hardwood.
Lets says that mugabe is right that ZAPU was trying to import weapons and that said weapons were impounded by Nyerere at the Dar es Salaam port. What should the correct course of action be?

I believe he should have arrested the ZAPU dissidents, produced the evidenced and have them sentenced in a court of law. Even detention of dissidents would have been semi-acceptable. Instead what did he do?

He went about killing 20,000 Ndebele civilians.

1. Any Ndebele of fighting age was considered a dissident and shot in the head.
2. Young Ndebele men were forced to dig their own graves and then shot in front of their families
3. Even ordinary teachers, farmers, councillors etc were summarily shot
4. A harmless mentally dissturbed woman had boiling water poured on her
5. Women were raped by ZANU soldiers
6. Homes were burned down
7. Starvation was used as a weapon by destroying crops and closing shops
8. Government food aid was stopped
9 . Only bars were left open so that ZANU soldiers could drink heavily before going to beat civilians
10. A muzungu missionary was beaten senseless for trying to protect his maid from beatings and rape


Are you suggesting that indiscriminate murder , rape , torture and starvation of civilians is an appropriate reaction to ZAPU leaders importing weapons?

Also
The ring leader of Gukurahundi Brigadier General Emile Munemo admitted that the whole exercise was about retribution because according to him, Ndebele feel superior to Shona and they had aold scores to settle. It was not about the shipment of arms as you claim.
hardwood
#38 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 5:23:53 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
radiomast wrote:
@hardwood.
Lets says that mugabe is right that ZAPU was trying to import weapons and that said weapons were impounded by Nyerere at the Dar es Salaam port. What should the correct course of action be?

I believe he should have arrested the ZAPU dissidents, produced the evidenced and have them sentenced in a court of law. Even detention of dissidents would have been semi-acceptable. Instead what did he do?

He went about killing 20,000 Ndebele civilians.

1. Any Ndebele of fighting age was considered a dissident and shot in the head.
2. Young Ndebele men were forced to dig their own graves and then shot in front of their families
3. Even ordinary teachers, farmers, councillors etc were summarily shot
4. A harmless mentally dissturbed woman had boiling water poured on her
5. Women were raped by ZANU soldiers
6. Homes were burned down
7. Starvation was used as a weapon by destroying crops and closing shops
8. Government food aid was stopped
9 . Only bars were left open so that ZANU soldiers could drink heavily before going to beat civilians
10. A muzungu missionary was beaten senseless for trying to protect his maid from beatings and rape


Are you suggesting that indiscriminate murder , rape , torture and starvation of civilians is an appropriate reaction to ZAPU leaders importing weapons?

Also
The ring leader of Gukurahundi Brigadier General Emile Munemo admitted that the whole exercise was about retribution because according to him, Ndebele feel superior to Shona and they had aold scores to settle. It was not about the shipment of arms as you claim.


Weapons had already been distributed huko mashinani. Nyerere only impounded one consignment. It was the govts job to mop up the weapons. And you do know what happens when the army is sent to a village to recover weapons. Even hapa kenia villagers flee when they hear that GSU is coming for an operation to recover just one lost weapon. All am saying is that it was mugabe govt's job to ensure that no weapons were in the hands of ZAPU and wananchi, and that the dissidents had been crushed.

Also you can never recover any weapon if your strategy is to arrest people and take them to court. You have to finya makende until they produce the weapons.
radiomast
#39 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 7:37:44 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/15/2018
Posts: 428
@hardwood

Why would Nyerere allow weapons to be sneaked in through Dar es Salaam, only to warn Mugabe after the weapons had already been sent to mashinani?
It does not make sense.

In fact there is evidence that those weapons that Mugabe is referencing were planted by Mugabe's goons in collusion with apartheid south Africa

Quote:
Some of the buried weapons uncovered in 1982 and used as evidence against ZAPU are said to have been planted by these agents led by Matt Calloway who, as head of the Zimbabwe CIO branch, connived withSouth Africa (LRF and CCJPZ 1997) without ZAPU’s knowledge.


Link

Seems like a similar tactic to the one Moi applied during the 1982 coup where he allowed the coup to happen so he could around using it as an excuse to jail and fire officials from the Jomo Kenyatta government.

The General I referenced above admitted that Gukurahundi happened because of hatred between Ndebele and Mashona.

Also please explain why these drunk soldiers went around raping women and pouring hot water on elderly women among other things.

Lolest!
#40 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 8:11:08 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Quote:
That's not fair to Mandela. He was a transitional one-term president. If he had gone against the whites, SA economy would have crashed. The whites were well educated and controlled all the important aspects of the nation. I'm sure Mandela hated as he could not have made any drastic moves. The xenophobia there shows you that Mandela made the right move, can you imagine if the first black president was an angry black man like Malema? He also did not want the whites as a 'new' minority to start receiving sympathy from the world. It was a very tough balancing act for him and he did very well.


Most of what you've written about Mandela on land could be written about Jomo Kenyatta. Only that there was the Settlement Fund Trustees money(British government loan to buy off White farmers in Kenya).

Also, Kenya was getting independent in 63, SA didn't get independent in '94, just black majority rule. SA was independent from 1910 and was recognized as succh internationally, even fighting on the allies' side in the World Wars!
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