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Devolution - It's Back to 1960's
Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/15/2012 Posts: 1,110
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washiku wrote:I have personally said it time n again that devolution is our shortest route to growth as a country. We can't afford to lose it. But again devolution will not be saved by fact-less propaganda like this one. Why is it that when governors are asked to account for the "little" funds they have been allocated they jump through the roof yet they are vocal when they want to tell us they want more money?
Where are the audited accounts for the national government so that we can compare notes? And what makes you think that the national government is 'saintly'? Was the hustlers jet mystery solved? I'm sure you know that receipts and other important documents 'disappeared', don't you? I'm also sure you're fully aware that Olive's tender was 23 Billion and not 24 Billion, right?
In terms of budgeting, its quite rare to have all your budgetary requests fulfilled. If the money allocated to you is always enough for your growth needs, it means you might need to check on your ambitions. They could be too low. The greatest enemies of devolution are not Jubilee but specific governors who want to use monies their way instead of the wananchi way.
Names?
Wanjiku may not know what is going on in those offices, that's why we depend on institutions like Auditor General's office and budget allocations office to tell us what they are doing in there. When questions are asked based on the same institutions' reports, how is that fighting devolution?
Totally missed my initial train of thought and introduced your own to suit you. Why are MCAs begging car grant from the national government? Isn't this the same evil that we sought to address by devolving funds to county governments? Why is UK planning a meeting with MCAs for the second time in less than a month? Are MCAs answerable to the national government? This deal-breaking in the name of cutting governor's to size is tantamount to killing devolution.
Live Full Die Empty - Les Brown.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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InnovateGuy wrote:As Tycho would tell you, facts are opinions. Very inseparable.
Nonetheless, in the spirit of "factual" debate, here's something to think about:
- UK and his DP graced the MCAs forum a few weeks ago. It was a forum meant to look at what MCAs have done one year into office.
- Governors had the equivalent last week. UK and DP were conspicuously missing. Not even the devolution monster, madam Waiguru, was "sent" to that funkie.
Question:
What is so important with the MCAs function that the national government was fully represented, but went missing during the governor's forum?
So its your opinion that PORK not attending the forum has completely killed devolution? Have you factored in that the governors have met him before but he has never met the MCAs? Have you factored in that Rutto, Chair of governors was part of that MCAs meeting and actually asked for some perks for the MCAs? Have you forgotten in the Bomas forum governors still asked for perks for MCAs? Aren't the same governors then killing devolution too if your thinking is to be followed? On another thought, don't you think Baba would be more interested in devolution failing so that he can use it as a powerful campaign tool for 2017? If you look at matters devolution, its not about Jubilee or CORD. In any case, the biggest beneficiary of its failure would be CORD. All wananchis are asking for is results. I wonder why the money allocated should be enough for building governor's mansion n heavy guzzlers in some counties but not enough to build even a single dispensary. The biggest issue is not how much money has been allocated but how the "little" that has been allocated has been utilised. By the way, some of the things that some governors has done with the little cash they got has never been seen in those counties since independence. Go to Level 5 hospital in Kisii, visit some water projects in Bomet, rush to Machakos....beyond the noises, some are doing sth. Devolution is here to stay. Only governors can kill it.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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InnovateGuy wrote:washiku wrote:I have personally said it time n again that devolution is our shortest route to growth as a country. We can't afford to lose it. But again devolution will not be saved by fact-less propaganda like this one. Why is it that when governors are asked to account for the "little" funds they have been allocated they jump through the roof yet they are vocal when they want to tell us they want more money?
Where are the audited accounts for the national government so that we can compare notes? And what makes you think that the national government is 'saintly'? Was the hustlers jet mystery solved? I'm sure you know that receipts and other important documents 'disappeared', don't you? I'm also sure you're fully aware that Olive's tender was 23 Billion and not 24 Billion, right?
In terms of budgeting, its quite rare to have all your budgetary requests fulfilled. If the money allocated to you is always enough for your growth needs, it means you might need to check on your ambitions. They could be too low. The greatest enemies of devolution are not Jubilee but specific governors who want to use monies their way instead of the wananchi way.
Names?
Wanjiku may not know what is going on in those offices, that's why we depend on institutions like Auditor General's office and budget allocations office to tell us what they are doing in there. When questions are asked based on the same institutions' reports, how is that fighting devolution?
Totally missed my initial train of thought and introduced your own to suit you. Why are MCAs begging car grant from the national government? Isn't this the same evil that we sought to address by devolving funds to county governments? Why is UK planning a meeting with MCAs for the second time in less than a month? Are MCAs answerable to the national government? This deal-breaking in the name of cutting governor's to size is tantamount to killing devolution.
Boss, the discussion was not to compare the national govt vs the county govts, unless you want to expand the discussion to that. The main reason I have been supporting the devolution way of doing things is simply coz the central govt has failed for 50 years to give us the very basics. That doesn't mean that what the central govt has been doing(the incompetence) should be devolved. We must demand more from our governors. The National govt performance belongs to another thread, and we have discussed it in several threads in fact. My opinion on their performance is well documented in those. Let's narrow our discussion on this terrorism against devolution and separate myths from facts. Propaganda from truth. And how is the husler's jet and the laptop issue a devolution killer? Unless you want to divert the subject issue, I don't see the connection. I never mentioned how sacred the central govt is. I have a big issue with them already, esp on basic issues like security, but issue on this thread is devolution murder. Who is to blame?
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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I am still waiting for a reason why your eyes and ears have only heard Jubilee members critisise the governors and not any other so that it qualifies your sentiments that its Uhuruto specifically who want devolution out.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/15/2012 Posts: 1,110
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washiku wrote:InnovateGuy wrote:As Tycho would tell you, facts are opinions. Very inseparable.
Nonetheless, in the spirit of "factual" debate, here's something to think about:
- UK and his DP graced the MCAs forum a few weeks ago. It was a forum meant to look at what MCAs have done one year into office.
- Governors had the equivalent last week. UK and DP were conspicuously missing. Not even the devolution monster, madam Waiguru, was "sent" to that funkie.
Question:
What is so important with the MCAs function that the national government was fully represented, but went missing during the governor's forum?
So its your opinion that PORK not attending the forum has completely killed devolution? Have you factored in that the governors have met him before but he has never met the MCAs? Have you factored in that Rutto, Chair of governors was part of that MCAs meeting and actually asked for some perks for the MCAs? Have you forgotten in the Bomas forum governors still asked for perks for MCAs? Aren't the same governors then killing devolution too if your thinking is to be followed?
On one hand, UK is telling us how unacceptable the wage bill is. He then goes ahead to award MCAs car grants. Where is the seriousness? Isn't this political manipulation? If it's austerity, lets sticky to austerity. He who pays the piper calls the tune. But he is Uhuru, anyway. We can let him off anything - even if it means going against the same principles he's pretending to inculcate.
Here's how devolution is killed. MCAs have their own fights with governors. They want ward development funds that many governors have not assented to. It's divide and rule. Fan the mini fights, let them fight till 2017. On another thought, don't you think Baba would be more interested in devolution failing so that he can use it as a powerful campaign tool for 2017? If you look at matters devolution, its not about Jubilee or CORD. In any case, the biggest beneficiary of its failure would be CORD. All wananchis are asking for is results. I wonder why the money allocated should be enough for building governor's mansion n heavy guzzlers in some counties but not enough to build even a single dispensary. The biggest issue is not how much money has been allocated but how the "little" that has been allocated has been utilised. By the way, some of the things that some governors has done with the little cash they got has never been seen in those counties since independence. Go to Level 5 hospital in Kisii, visit some water projects in Bomet, rush to Machakos....beyond the noises, some are doing sth.
If some counties have done what the national government has not done in 50 years, why do we still refuse to give counties what they deserve? 270 Billion is not a lot. The national government will have a budget exceeding 1.6 trillion. Why should they give 217 Billion to counties while most of the functions have been devolved? More than 1.4 trillion for policy making, uh? Devolution is here to stay. Only governors can kill it.
Governors won't kill devolution; UK and hustler will kill it. Live Full Die Empty - Les Brown.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/20/2007 Posts: 4,432
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Washiku is right. Central Gov't failed. One of the reasons it failed is because of the current behaviour of some governors. They don't want accountability. It's not devolution that is failing, its some governors. That is the reason you will see all this posts online about reduce counties to save the country money. Those aren't sincere. I assure you they are part of the 2pm gang. I am extremely happy about how devolution is working. The governors did not come from mars. You elected them. Choices have consequences. So if you are one of these people who go around ticking peoples names on ballots coz its odm or pnu, shauri yako. May you suffer as the rest of the world moves on. Devolution is working perfectly. Those that voted unwisely will suffer, those that voted wisely will prosper. That is capitalism 101. As for Uhuruto team that is working overtime to try and change the constitution, ole wenu. 4 more years to try and do that. Thus far, you have failed in your ALLLLLL your promises. Even on this one, you shall fail miserably. Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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So @Innovateguy, if these allegations are not part of your innovations, and with devolution as the context, who is paying Midiwo and Muthama and their counterparts to kill devolution? Answer that then we can continue.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/15/2012 Posts: 1,110
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washiku wrote:I am still waiting for a reason why your eyes and ears have only heard Jubilee members critisise the governors and not any other so that it qualifies your sentiments that its Uhuruto specifically who want devolution out. I repeat.
Divide and rule is what maintains a leader's stranglehold onto power. Jubilees is fighting devolution through proxies. Case in point, a Jubilee senator by the name San'g came up with a bill to have county development boards. To make it look like a senators vs governor's issue, the bill seeks to make senators chairpersons of county development boards. What happened to the role of senator's as the oversight authority? Live Full Die Empty - Les Brown.
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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InnovateGuy wrote:washiku wrote:I am still waiting for a reason why your eyes and ears have only heard Jubilee members critisise the governors and not any other so that it qualifies your sentiments that its Uhuruto specifically who want devolution out. I repeat.
Divide and rule is what maintains a leader's stranglehold onto power. Jubilees is fighting devolution through proxies. Case in point, a Jubilee senator by the name San'g came up with a bill to have county development boards. To make it look like a senators vs governor's issue, the bill seeks to make senators chairpersons of county development boards. What happened to the role of senator's as the oversight authority? And I repeat...what you are not showing me is the Uhuruto connection. Tell me, did Uhuru pay that Keynan guy to bring the flags bill? If I agree with you on the divide n rule issue for purpose of this discussion, who is dividing who? If a jubilee legislator brings an issue, Wailer has divided. When a CORD one brings the issue, will it be safe to assume it has been sponsored by Baba? Or on those particular issues those ODMers listen to UK n on others they listen to Baba? You are yet to answer me on who would be the greatest beneficiary of "kifo cha tangazwa cha bwana devolution"
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/20/2007 Posts: 4,432
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washiku wrote:InnovateGuy wrote:washiku wrote:I am still waiting for a reason why your eyes and ears have only heard Jubilee members critisise the governors and not any other so that it qualifies your sentiments that its Uhuruto specifically who want devolution out. I repeat.
Divide and rule is what maintains a leader's stranglehold onto power. Jubilees is fighting devolution through proxies. Case in point, a Jubilee senator by the name San'g came up with a bill to have county development boards. To make it look like a senators vs governor's issue, the bill seeks to make senators chairpersons of county development boards. What happened to the role of senator's as the oversight authority? And I repeat...what you are not showing me is the Uhuruto connection. Tell me, did Uhuru pay that Keynan guy to bring the flags bill? If I agree with you on the divide n rule issue for purpose of this discussion, who is dividing who? If a jubilee legislator brings an issue, Wailer has divided. When a CORD one brings the issue, will it be safe to assume it has been sponsored by Baba? Or on those particular issues those ODMers listen to UK n on others they listen to Baba? You are yet to answer me on who would be the greatest beneficiary of " kifo cha tangazwa cha bwana devolution" Hakuna kifo cha devolution. It is kifo cha ass kissing kenyan voters. You voted for your governor. Wait 4 more years. If you haven't grown up yet. Wait another 5. Vote like Mayakos. Don't blame Uhuru or devolution. Please give me just 10 million shillings. I will change the lives of the people around me forever. Try me. I'm campaigning in 2017. Please vote for me. But you voted for your stupid governor. Choices have consequences. Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
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