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Referendum Question ? Do we need both Senate and Parliament?

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Lolest!		#11 Posted : Monday, July 29, 2013 9:45:07 PM
Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma		@Siringi na wengineo, please remember that we have had to go through this as a country for more than 50years. There was great fear from some quarters that federalism would lead to great tribalism and eviction of Kenyans from areas where they are minorities. MPs have constantly increased. In the 60s they were 158, when i was schooling, 188, then 210 and now 290 elected. The principal tenet of democracy is 1man 1vote. This is what they tried to achieve by adding constituencies. The role of bunge is law making and oversight. How can we trust a skewed senate to make laws? Lamu will have 1 vote like Nairobi in such case.
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Lolest!		#12 Posted : Monday, July 29, 2013 10:02:40 PM
Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma		also @ siringi, on women rep, this was a fruit of many years of activism. There is no job description of a woman rep that is different from that of an MP. We just gave them extra nos to promote 'gender equality'. I think the biggest problem with our understanding of legislature arises from the fact that we view legislators as people responsible for development but not as lawmakers/executive overseers.
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guru267		#13 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 6:01:43 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi		Lolest! wrote: @Siringi na wengineo, please remember that we have had to go through this as a country for more than 50years. There was great fear from some quarters that federalism would lead to great tribalism and eviction of Kenyans from areas where they are minorities. MPs have constantly increased. In the 60s they were 158, when i was schooling, 188, then 210 and now 290 elected. The principal tenet of democracy is 1man 1vote. This is what they tried to achieve by adding constituencies. The role of bunge is law making and oversight. How can we trust a skewed senate to make laws? Lamu will have 1 vote like Nairobi in such case. @Lolest is there any reason why the USA which is thel most powerful super power in the world has only 50 governors and a small country like Kenya has 47?? The states do not necessarily have to be divided the same way as the old 8 provinces but 47 governments in Kenya doesn't really make sense practically! Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Lolest!		#14 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 7:07:08 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma		@guru, agreed. 47 govts are just too many. Initial proposal was to have 13 govts which would have been cheaper. Proponents of county system say it gives more equitable distribution of resources.But truth is, Kenya is still a unitary and not federal state. Power and responsibility is still at the centre. The governors are just county council chairmen/mayors with more money. Hence the clamour for governors to get favours and powers outside the law. And spending big time to impress all and stamp authority hence more taxes for us. But the county system has worked in Rwanda, it should work here too.
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murchr		#15 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 7:19:33 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980		Another group pretending to be concerned yet when Ruto was pushing for a "No" in the last referendum most of you here were insulting him infact given time I can prove that you all voted yes. SMH There will be no referendum get busy. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Siringi		#16 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:20:31 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517		murchr wrote: Another group pretending to be concerned yet when Ruto was pushing for a "No" in the last referendum most of you here were insulting him infact given time I can prove that you all voted yes. SMH There will be no referendum get busy. For the record Me and my entire clan voted NO with very many reasons. I came accross this devil-ution madness through some blog where i peep and know some wazuans na bado... Rink Hapa *Devolution madness Reason Gone Haywire* and when you read it together with this (Rink) Doctors Devil-Ution Crisis we need to talk... How do you rotate and transfer Doctors under a devolved system? it means Doctors can only serve within the county? help e understand this one. "😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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murchr		#17 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 8:36:38 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980		Siringi wrote: murchr wrote: Another group pretending to be concerned yet when Ruto was pushing for a "No" in the last referendum most of you here were insulting him infact given time I can prove that you all voted yes. SMH There will be no referendum get busy. For the record Me and my entire clan voted NO with very many reasons. I came accross this devil-ution madness through some blog where i peep and know some wazuans na bado... Rink Hapa *Devolution madness Reason Gone Haywire* and when you read it together with this (Rink) Doctors Devil-Ution Crisis we need to talk... How do you rotate and transfer Doctors under a devolved system? it means Doctors can only serve within the county? help e understand this one. Currently no one has the way and means of knowing how you voted. I believe the majority of those who voted yes did not understand what it was all about. So experience is the best teacher. When the central gov talks of devolving functions pole pole people say they want to kill devilusion...ndio hio sasa..let the same people deal with it. "Wengi wape" = democracy "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Impunity		#18 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:26:49 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,335 Location: Masada		murchr wrote: Siringi wrote: murchr wrote: Another group pretending to be concerned yet when Ruto was pushing for a "No" in the last referendum most of you here were insulting him infact given time I can prove that you all voted yes. SMH There will be no referendum get busy. For the record Me and my entire clan voted NO with very many reasons. I came accross this devil-ution madness through some blog where i peep and know some wazuans na bado... Rink Hapa *Devolution madness Reason Gone Haywire* and when you read it together with this (Rink) Doctors Devil-Ution Crisis we need to talk... How do you rotate and transfer Doctors under a devolved system? it means Doctors can only serve within the county? help e understand this one. Currently no one has the way and means of knowing how you voted. I believe the majority of those who voted yes did not understand what it was all about. So experience is the best teacher. When the central gov talks of devolving functions pole pole people say they want to kill devilusion...ndio hio sasa..let the same people deal with it. "Wengi wape" = democracy In fact I am on record here in wazua to have publicly put it that I emphatically voted NO in the last plebiscite! Most people here voted on the premise that baba had read it for them. Portfolio: Sold You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Siringi		#19 Posted : Tuesday, July 30, 2013 11:11:14 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517		Lolest! wrote: @guru, agreed. 47 govts are just too many. Initial proposal was to have 13 govts which would have been cheaper. Proponents of county system say it gives more equitable distribution of resources.But truth is, Kenya is still a unitary and not federal state. Power and responsibility is still at the centre. The governors are just county council chairmen/mayors with more money. Hence the clamour for governors to get favours and powers outside the law. And spending big time to impress all and stamp authority hence more taxes for us. But the county system has worked in Rwanda, it should work here too. Spoken like a true warrior Governor are Glorified County Concil Chairmen. Somebody needs to drum sense into these politicians. Government does not print money these are our taxes!! elsewhere Sh40bn-debt-threatens-to-halt-operations-in-Nairobi and elesewhere.. Wajir can only handle ‘two key functions Now You understand why Doctors and Devolved Civil Servants are ancious- Ask Mombasa Municipal Council workers what is going on at the coast... "😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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Siringi		#20 Posted : Wednesday, July 31, 2013 8:45:50 AM
Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517		guru267 wrote: Here is my suggestion to fight the ballooning wage bill and duplication! 1. Adopt a federal government and do away with this devolution mambo jambo... 2. Convert the former 8 provinces into 8 federal states with 8 elected governors and 8 elected senators 3. The newly created 47 counties should remain and be divided among the 8 states to be represented by 47 Members of parliament 4. The 290 constituencies should be headed by 290 constituency reps.. Include the women reps here The federal government of Kenya would have 8 governors, 8 senators, 47MPs and 290reps! Best response so far chances of some of these parliamentarians contributing anything substiantial is next to NIL "😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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