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IMF: Kenya's economy self reliant, don't need EU
Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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guru267 wrote:Nabwire wrote:guru267 wrote:dunkang wrote:So, you are saying BAT, Vodafone, diageo, Lafarge collect taxes from their debt ridden economies and give it to KRA?
These firms actually milk our economy.
@dunkang yes these firms milk our economy but do you see any Kenyans setting up rival firms to compete with these guys?? The fact is reliance is not only about aid.. If their governments ban these guys from operating in Kenya who will fill the gap in taxes & services that will arise?? Kwani this CFA is gotten from River Road? What kind of reasoning is this? So you agree that they are milking our economy dry, but then go ahead to give reasons why they should stay and keep milking us, just so they can pay taxes? RETARDED!!! @Nabwire Economics 101: GOK has a budget that is sustained by taxes and borrowing... Currently taxes sustain about 75% - 80% of the budget leaving 20% -25% for borrowing... This was probably why the team thinks Kenya is self sustaining! But I was merely pointing out that the biggest tax payers are foreign multinationals & our dear exporters and the biggest lenders to GOK are foreign banks! Lets not even go into how the clothes on our backs are imported! Lets not even go into how you will not be able to send money home! The big question is who finances the budget when they leave?? @guru do you believe that multinationals esp BAT will close shop in Kenya because Uhuru is president? I have told you before, these sanctions etc are not about you but the issuers countries interest. If their interests are met, they care less about you and your choice of president. Its a fact that these multinationals make the most in Africa and pay the least of taxes. May be you need to do more research b4 you pen your thoughts. You must be dreaming big if you believe that Safcom would close shop come April...that is even laughable I dont know what about clothes your talking about but ask any clothes merchant and they will guide you through the streets of Guangzhou "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/2/2011 Posts: 4,818 Location: -1.2107, 36.8831
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EUROPE DISAPPEARING FROM THE FACE OF AFRICAQuote: The West, and particularly European countries, are slowly being driven out of Africa by emerging economies, with China at the forefront. Its argued that if Europe still wants to play any role at all, it should cast aside its paternalism and fear of neocolonialism. Receive with simplicity everything that happens to you.” ― Rashi
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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murchr wrote:guru267 wrote:Nabwire wrote:guru267 wrote:dunkang wrote:So, you are saying BAT, Vodafone, diageo, Lafarge collect taxes from their debt ridden economies and give it to KRA?
These firms actually milk our economy.
@dunkang yes these firms milk our economy but do you see any Kenyans setting up rival firms to compete with these guys?? The fact is reliance is not only about aid.. If their governments ban these guys from operating in Kenya who will fill the gap in taxes & services that will arise?? Kwani this CFA is gotten from River Road? What kind of reasoning is this? So you agree that they are milking our economy dry, but then go ahead to give reasons why they should stay and keep milking us, just so they can pay taxes? RETARDED!!! @Nabwire Economics 101: GOK has a budget that is sustained by taxes and borrowing... Currently taxes sustain about 75% - 80% of the budget leaving 20% -25% for borrowing... This was probably why the team thinks Kenya is self sustaining! But I was merely pointing out that the biggest tax payers are foreign multinationals & our dear exporters and the biggest lenders to GOK are foreign banks! Lets not even go into how the clothes on our backs are imported! Lets not even go into how you will not be able to send money home! The big question is who finances the budget when they leave?? @guru do you believe that multinationals esp BAT will close shop in Kenya because Uhuru is president? I have told you before, these sanctions etc are not about you but the issuers countries interest. If their interests are met, they care less about you and your choice of president. Its a fact that these multinationals make the most in Africa and pay the least of taxes. May be you need to do more research b4 you pen your thoughts. You must be dreaming big if you believe that Safcom would close shop come April...that is even laughable I dont know what about clothes your talking about but ask any clothes merchant and they will guide you through the streets of Guangzhou @murchr 1. it is possible for foreign governments to ban their companies from operating anywhere that they have slapped sanctions... It will all be part of the package 2. Except the TSC, the top 10 Kenyan tax payers are at the clutches of the west... www.businessdailyafrica....48/-/s5bfc2/-/index.html3. Kenya is just one of the African countries set for an economic boom.. If it were to fall trust me the world would move on! (A $35bn economy is a drop in the ocean) 4. I would take a white man's threat seriously.. Just ask Gaddafi 5. Just because something is made in China doesn't make it Chinese owned.. Ask apple!! 6. This has nothing to do with UMK but more to do with Western states abiding to treaties that do not allow them to relate with officially suspected war criminals! Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/17/2012 Posts: 1,461 Location: Ngong Forest
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guru267 wrote:Who are Kenya's biggest tax payers that finance our budget?? Isn't it BAT, Vodafone, Diageo, Lafarge?? Isn't it exporters like KQ??
Who are the biggest buyers of CBK bonds?? Isn't it Barclays & Stanchart!
When sanctions hit and the above are banned from operating what exactly will sustain the economy? Do BB-UK & STANCHART make same profits in their countries like they do in kenya? It's our money those companies are proud off. We are the customer & l believe u know the value of the customer in any business.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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guru267 wrote:murchr wrote:guru267 wrote:Nabwire wrote:guru267 wrote:dunkang wrote:So, you are saying BAT, Vodafone, diageo, Lafarge collect taxes from their debt ridden economies and give it to KRA?
These firms actually milk our economy.
@dunkang yes these firms milk our economy but do you see any Kenyans setting up rival firms to compete with these guys?? The fact is reliance is not only about aid.. If their governments ban these guys from operating in Kenya who will fill the gap in taxes & services that will arise?? Kwani this CFA is gotten from River Road? What kind of reasoning is this? So you agree that they are milking our economy dry, but then go ahead to give reasons why they should stay and keep milking us, just so they can pay taxes? RETARDED!!! @Nabwire Economics 101: GOK has a budget that is sustained by taxes and borrowing... Currently taxes sustain about 75% - 80% of the budget leaving 20% -25% for borrowing... This was probably why the team thinks Kenya is self sustaining! But I was merely pointing out that the biggest tax payers are foreign multinationals & our dear exporters and the biggest lenders to GOK are foreign banks! Lets not even go into how the clothes on our backs are imported! Lets not even go into how you will not be able to send money home! The big question is who finances the budget when they leave?? @guru do you believe that multinationals esp BAT will close shop in Kenya because Uhuru is president? I have told you before, these sanctions etc are not about you but the issuers countries interest. If their interests are met, they care less about you and your choice of president. Its a fact that these multinationals make the most in Africa and pay the least of taxes. May be you need to do more research b4 you pen your thoughts. You must be dreaming big if you believe that Safcom would close shop come April...that is even laughable I dont know what about clothes your talking about but ask any clothes merchant and they will guide you through the streets of Guangzhou @murchr 1. it is possible for foreign governments to ban their companies from operating anywhere that they have slapped sanctions... It will all be part of the package 2. Except the TSC, the top 10 Kenyan tax payers are at the clutches of the west... www.businessdailyafrica....48/-/s5bfc2/-/index.html3. Kenya is just one of the African countries set for an economic boom.. If it were to fall trust me the world would move on! (A $35bn economy is a drop in the ocean) 4. I would take a white man's threat seriously.. Just ask Gaddafi 5. Just because something is made in China doesn't make it Chinese owned.. Ask apple!! 6. This has nothing to do with UMK but more to do with Western states abiding to treaties that do not allow them to relate with officially suspected war criminals! Please endelea kuota....if you are cheated to believe vodafone would sell off their cash cow to please their govt and you, your very mistaken. Even in the most sanctioned country Zimbabwe these jungus still hover around there looking for the next deal. Remember they danced with Gadaffi and even awarded his son with degrees from their best schools yet he dint step in any of the classes, even with those treaties in place. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/17/2012 Posts: 1,461 Location: Ngong Forest
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Na pia hii theories nyingi muache unless nyinyi ni walimu. Be real, these Europeans & US are bankrupt! Our economy is doing Okay & IMF Says we don'nt need them much!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Ngong wrote:guru267 wrote:Who are Kenya's biggest tax payers that finance our budget?? Isn't it BAT, Vodafone, Diageo, Lafarge?? Isn't it exporters like KQ??
Who are the biggest buyers of CBK bonds?? Isn't it Barclays & Stanchart!
When sanctions hit and the above are banned from operating what exactly will sustain the economy? Do BB-UK & STANCHART make same profits in their countries like they do in kenya? It's our money those companies are proud off. We are the customer & l believe u know the value of the customer in any business. Lets talk real numbers!! Barclays Kenya makes 9billionkshs($100million) net profit while Barclays UK makes 400billionkshs($4.6billion) net profit... We only contribute a tiny tiny 2% to the parents earnings This simply means that even though the Kenyan subsidiary was wiped off the earth today Barclays UK wouldn't even announce a profit warning! Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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murchr wrote:Remember they danced with Gadaffi and even awarded his son with degrees from their best schools yet he dint step in any of the classes, even with those treaties in place. I'm sorry... In which court of law was court was Gaddafi charged while they danced with him?? This was actually the beginning of the end for Gaddafi! www.nytimes.com/2011/06/...africa/28libya.html?_r=0Sound similar?? Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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guru267 wrote:murchr wrote:Remember they danced with Gadaffi and even awarded his son with degrees from their best schools yet he dint step in any of the classes, even with those treaties in place. I'm sorry... In which court of law was court was Gaddafi charged while they danced with him?? This was actually the beginning of the end for Gaddafi! www.nytimes.com/2011/06/...africa/28libya.html?_r=0Sound similar?? Madam, if the people of Libya had not rebelled, Gadaffi would still have been President. Even Museveni was once a dictator and now he is the "best" leader in EA. http://www.guardian.co.u...fice-oxford-gaddafi-son
http://www.dailymail.co....hief-Howard-Davies.html
Stop acting like you live in mars. Welcome to plannet Earth my sisto "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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guru267 wrote:Ngong wrote:guru267 wrote:Who are Kenya's biggest tax payers that finance our budget?? Isn't it BAT, Vodafone, Diageo, Lafarge?? Isn't it exporters like KQ??
Who are the biggest buyers of CBK bonds?? Isn't it Barclays & Stanchart!
When sanctions hit and the above are banned from operating what exactly will sustain the economy? Do BB-UK & STANCHART make same profits in their countries like they do in kenya? It's our money those companies are proud off. We are the customer & l believe u know the value of the customer in any business. Lets talk real numbers!! Barclays Kenya makes 9billionkshs($100million) net profit while Barclays UK makes 400billionkshs($4.6billion) net profit... We only contribute a tiny tiny 2% to the parents earnings This simply means that even though the Kenyan subsidiary was wiped off the earth today Barclays UK wouldn't even announce a profit warning! Thanks@guru267 for debunking this myth. The lie has been repeated so many times it is unbelievable. Ati kenya's economy is robust while europe is collapsing. The largest banking group in africa is the standard bank(stanbic). A while back their CEO was saying that their contribution to the parent was negligible; in his own words "it gets lost in translation"
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/13/2011 Posts: 5,964
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Foreign Govt. Aid is as busted as Austerity measures. Get used to it.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2010 Posts: 2,220 Location: Sundowner,Amboseli
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We look neither East nor West. We look forward. - Kwame Nkurumah! @SufficientlyP
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2010 Posts: 2,220 Location: Sundowner,Amboseli
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The Greatest asset you have is your brain. - @Sufficient #Makingmoney2013 @SufficientlyP
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/22/2011 Posts: 1,325
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You didnt answer my original question, you just danced around it with irrelevant stats. Question was you want them to stay so that they can milk us and pay taxes? This is not a popularity contest, just answer the question directly, your irrelevant stats only amuse people like Mathenge. I dont know where Economics 101 fits into this, these companies are in Kenya because they are making profits. If they are forced to leave ( unlikely) someone else will reap those profits,unless you are implying that Kenyan companies are not capable of paying taxes, in which case thats a question of enforcement. Stop being so blindwashed by western propaganda, you would make more sense if you argued that sanctions will slow down FDI flows but taxes? And who said we have to import clothes? How will sanctions affect how I send money home? I hope you know that I can easily send an ATM card to someone in Kenya, and incurr a $3 charge everytime they withdraw money from Kenya, so how exactly will money flows be affected? Dont just spew irrelevant rhetoric!!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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I suspect some of us didn't see Drucker's quote by admin, yesterday.
'The aim of business is marketing and innovation'. So I am surprised by this talk of 'foreign' companies doing this and that, sanctions, and elections.
Why? It seems some of us have been appointed prefects by the west!
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/16/2011 Posts: 196 Location: united states of africa
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guru267 wrote:Who are Kenya's biggest tax payers that finance our budget?? Isn't it BAT, Vodafone, Diageo, Lafarge?? Isn't it exporters like KQ??
Who are the biggest buyers of CBK bonds?? Isn't it Barclays & Stanchart!
When sanctions hit and the above are banned from operating what exactly will sustain the economy? I always say that as long as those laws that were crafted by the colonial government that up to date help cater for these multinational companies in Kenya are abolished or rather changed, then sanctions shouldn't be a big deal because there are lots of ways to make money. Example, BAT monopoly, its not that we ( I ) can't produce and sell our cigarettes but if that law was amended to give us the opportunity to do business, you can only imagine where we would be especially if you take into consideration that we are not a welfare nation although we are trapped into their ploys with their foreign aid. Note: Am only giving an example using BAT so for those who are morally conservative on the issue http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17297056
"The law was actually drafted by us but the Government is to be congratulated on its wise actions": British American Tobacco and public policy in Kenya. On intellectual property ownership, there is a book titled Armed Madhouse, authored by Greg Palast which is about the war in Iraq and how they say democracy democracy for Iraq while undoing or redoing the laws according to their own interests. Now, this is from Kenya Industrial Property Institute and its what I call BULLSHIT!!!! "No person resident in Kenya must, without written authority granted by the Managing Director, file or cause to be filed outside Kenya, an application for a patent for invention, unless an application for a patent for the same invention has been filed with the Institute not less than six weeks before the filing of the application outside Kenya. A person who files or causes to be filed an application for the grant of a patent in contravention of this is liable on conviction, to a fine not exceeding twenty thousand shillings, or to an imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years, or to both". http://www.kipi.go.ke/in...road-by-kenya-residents
Are you kidding me?? Me to ask the shitty govt of Kenya for permission when the idea is mine?? And you wonder why, after paying thousands of shillings to educate your children in computer science for the last two to four years, why their ideas/innovations are used by the likes of Safaricom, HP (Correct me if am wrong but am thinking HP put their headquarters in Kenya)etc while they are being paid nuts or the govt uses it for its own selfish use or decides to sell the idea. One more thing on the issue of patents relating to living matter. To be continued. Energy.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Nabwire wrote:You didnt answer my original question, you just danced around it with irrelevant stats. Question was you want them to stay so that they can milk us and pay taxes? This is not a popularity contest, just answer the question directly, your irrelevant stats only amuse people like Mathenge. I dont know where Economics 101 fits into this, these companies are in Kenya because they are making profits. If they are forced to leave ( unlikely) someone else will reap those profits,unless you are implying that Kenyan companies are not capable of paying taxes, in which case thats a question of enforcement. Stop being so blindwashed by western propaganda, you would make more sense if you argued that sanctions will slow down FDI flows but taxes? And who said we have to import clothes? How will sanctions affect how I send money home? I hope you know that I can easily send an ATM card to someone in Kenya, and incurr a $3 charge everytime they withdraw money from Kenya, so how exactly will money flows be affected? Dont just spew irrelevant rhetoric!! @Nabwire just who will replace the kshs115billion paid by the top ten tax payers! If the US government stops you from sending money to Kenya, trust me you will not send a dime! The reason GOK lets these guys milk us dry is simply because we cannot setup rival companies ourselves and they desperately need the tax that these guys pay! I didn't say we have to import clothes I said we do not have a choice but to import clothes.. Even mitumba is imported! If exporters can't export, if importers can't import, if foreign multinationals leave, if they are no remittances, if you and I have no jobs then who exactly will pay taxes???So yes not only FDI but also taxes are affected with sanctions! Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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@murchr I'm a little confused! What does LSE have to do with the British government?? Why was there a lot of distaste in the relationship LSE had with Gaddafi's son?? Mark 12:29 Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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guru267 wrote:
@murchr I'm a little confused!
What does LSE have to do with the British government??
Why was there a lot of distaste in the relationship LSE had with Gaddafi's son??
Let me quote wikipedia Quote: The private commercial arrangement was made by Gaddafi. According to WikiLeaks, American diplomats were told in September 2009 that they were “co-operating with the U.K. government and the London School of Economics, among other U.K. institutions, on an exchange program to send 400 people to London for leadership and management training." Professor Francis Terry, Dept of Public Management, was academic director for the Libya programme and Julius Sen, LSE Enterprise, the co-director. Professor Terry described his involvement as "a very stimulating experience." According to press reports, references to the program on LSE's website have subsequently been removed. Isnt it eye opening enough that an institution like LSE would work with Gaddafi even when the man had refused to honor summons at the Hague? Please try to find out more about this world. You still have alot to learn. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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