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KENOL/KOBIL
milken
#1331 Posted : Monday, February 14, 2011 3:35:53 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/25/2008
Posts: 192
Location: Nairobi
VituVingiSana wrote:
@milken - Please see my comments & questions above re: KPC, Triton, OMCs



"I thought imports had to be coordinated if you used common facilities e.g. KPC or KOSF. No ovyo ovyo imports. KK claims its imports were scheduled imports. Were Triton's scheduled imports?"

See my comments above that KK withdrew from the ullage nomination committee hence making their imports unscheduled.


Pumping - Shouldn't KPC have backup generators? Seems sensible since power cuts are/were common in Kenya.

Am sure they have some generators but am not sure that all pumping stations are covered. It is worth noting that if KPC goes offline for two hours each day, that months ullage is compromised by 33,000M3

KK claims the ullage was blocked for a long time. I think 1 month {not sure). I doubt there was no power at KPC pumping stations for 1 month

KK ullage was blocked because after they withdrew from the ullage committee they resulted to bringing several unscheduled imports that were causing chaos in the industry. They were given the option of either rejoining the committee or lose ullage.

KK transports a lot of fuel by Road. All the deliveries from South coast to Lamu are done by road.
Also deliveries as far as Machakos are often done by road from SOT & Changanwe.
Of course the pipeline is not a road with branches in every direction hence product has to be moved by road. However the pipeline moves AGO at te rate of 550M3 per hour. That means you will need to offload 18 trailers in an hour to match the pipeline. This is impossible hence you can not compare the pipeline to road transport. Additionally the pilepile is about 50cts per litre cheaper than road. When you add transport losses, theft and adulteration in road transport, the pipeline wins hands-down

The joint facility at SOT [with Total but I may be mistaken] is used for private imports for local sales + exports.

While you can receive product directly in your facility from a vessel, KPRL or KPC (KOSF), KPC can not allow you to pump back that material in to pipeline for ownward transport to Nairobi (from Mombasa) or West Kenya (from Nairobi)Consequently, unless you are ready to use road transport as explained above it is not feasible to receive product other than that meant for coast market in Mombasa Depots

So you do admit that KPC allocated unfair ullage to Triton [u say KPC but I think you meant Triton]. Seems a clear-cut case of wrongdoing by KPC regardless of all the rest.

Considering that there was no stated way of sharing ullage, it will not be right to say that KPC were unfair. let the courts decide whether KPC breached the agreement with KK. An agreement that does not guarantee ullage. However, common sense disagrees with KPC's ullage allocation to Triton.
Itari muting'oe ihuragwo ngi ni Ngai
jerry
#1332 Posted : Monday, February 14, 2011 5:02:12 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/29/2006
Posts: 2,570
@milken,vvs; Now that you are in agreement as per @milken's statement and I quote "However, common sense disagrees with KPC's ullage allocation to Triton.", let us have a break on this. Meanwhile demand 436,400 against supply 593,500 and price down to 9.75. If I had kwacha I would buy more.
The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
2012
#1333 Posted : Monday, February 14, 2011 5:52:23 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
If you ask me, I think people are selling to buy that CBK 30yr bond. It's a very good deal and won't keep your adrenaline rushing.

BBI will solve it
:)
VituVingiSana
#1334 Posted : Monday, February 14, 2011 6:57:30 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,380
Location: Nairobi
milken wrote:
"I thought imports had to be coordinated if you used common facilities e.g. KPC or KOSF. No ovyo ovyo imports. KK claims its imports were scheduled imports. Were Triton's scheduled imports?"

See my comments above that KK withdrew from the ullage nomination committee hence making their imports unscheduled.

Does it mean ALL importers are part of the Ullage Nomination Committee? Isn't ullage determined by market share? [So if KK has 20% then it gets 20% 'allocation' of imports & ullage?]

KK claims the ullage was blocked for a long time. I think 1 month {not sure). I doubt there was no power at KPC pumping stations for 1 month

KK ullage was blocked because after they withdrew from the ullage committee they resulted to bringing several unscheduled imports that were causing chaos in the industry. They were given the option of either rejoining the committee or lose ullage.
Why would they withdraw from the ullage committee unless there was a stink in the industry. Something here does not seem right i.e. there must have been something that sparked it off. What was it?

KK transports a lot of fuel by Road. All the deliveries from South coast to Lamu are done by road. Also deliveries as far as Machakos are often done by road from SOT & Changanwe.
Of course the pipeline is not a road with branches in every direction hence product has to be moved by road. However the pipeline moves AGO at te rate of 550M3 per hour. That means you will need to offload 18 trailers in an hour to match the pipeline. This is impossible hence you can not compare the pipeline to road transport. Additionally the pilepile is about 50cts per litre cheaper than road. When you add transport losses, theft and adulteration in road transport, the pipeline wins hands-down

Yes & No.
1) For deliveries to coastal locations either KPC/KOSF or SOT would be fine.
2) Deliveries equidistant from off-take points would be OK i.e. why pump to Nairobi then deliver 'backwards' to Mtito Andei vs using trucks to deliver straight to Voi from SOT/KOSF.
3) Due to off-take delays etc in Nairobi, some prefer road deliveries to all town east of Machakos


So you do admit that KPC allocated unfair ullage to Triton [u say KPC but I think you meant Triton]. Seems a clear-cut case of wrongdoing by KPC regardless of all the rest.

Considering that there was no stated way of sharing ullage, it will not be right to say that KPC were unfair. let the courts decide whether KPC breached the agreement with KK. An agreement that does not guarantee ullage. However, common sense disagrees with KPC's ullage allocation to Triton.
I believe KK over KPC execs. As you say, let the court/s decide. Pity it will take much longer as the lawyer fight it out!


BTW, I am learning from this exchange. Thanks. In addition, I do have a non-KK Oil Marketer who answers some of my queries. Seems he prefers a TRANSPARENT entity as a middleman i.e. the space/ullage allocation by KPC should be independently verified.

The unfortunate casualty from Triton's collapse was the abandoned storage tanks they were building. It's a pity a trader/speculator like Vitol won the auction vs a Kenyan OMC consortium.

Finally, am I biased? Maybe... I own 1/40,000,000 of KPC but probably 100x that of KK.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#1335 Posted : Monday, February 14, 2011 10:51:49 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,380
Location: Nairobi
BTW, did KPC deposit the KES 4.6bn into a joint account as ordered by the Court?
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
youcan'tstopusnow
#1336 Posted : Tuesday, February 15, 2011 1:26:57 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 3/24/2010
Posts: 6,779
Location: Black Africa
Who is picking up KK? A couple of a million-share trades
GOD BLESS YOUR LIFE
youcan'tstopusnow
#1337 Posted : Wednesday, February 16, 2011 7:36:27 AM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 3/24/2010
Posts: 6,779
Location: Black Africa
milken, VVS: Would you happen to know the breakdown of KK's service stations by province?
GOD BLESS YOUR LIFE
winston
#1338 Posted : Wednesday, February 16, 2011 10:44:16 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/14/2010
Posts: 806
Location: Nairobi
Just been following the discussion and coupling with my little knowledge about the oil industry, I would like to (agree with @milken) and say that it would not have been logical for KPC to guarantee KK exclusive use of the facilities...simply because it is a multi-user facility (ie any oil company has a right to use the facility). The question then that remains is the validdity of the Transport and storage agreement clause purporting to give KK a right which in itself was not possible to assign. On this point the charge acgainst KPC should have failed as you can not purport to give something that from the start you cant(it was not set up to do).

There has been lots of claims about preference to some other company. The counter argument which I think is proveable is that the other company that got more ullage allocation was having industry material ie was not allocated ullage as the company for own use/sale but to hold the industry material as it waits for the industry players to pay up and take 'delivery' of their share. It is the inability of KPC to demonstrate this clearly coupled with a misguided report by one audit firm that is leading to the perpetuation of this incorrect position.

On issues of loss of financial goodwill, marketing costs etc. these are largely difficult to quantify, especially if the financials( profit, sales) are not directly attributed to the event.

To summarise, KK's case against KPC should not have stood. But it will stand simply because the KPC never wins cases (based on history and other factors).

Now....please dont kill the messenger!Laughing out loudly
VituVingiSana
#1339 Posted : Wednesday, February 16, 2011 11:48:50 AM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,380
Location: Nairobi
@winston - I am sending Rambo to see you... ;-)

BTW, if KPC did not have the ability to enter into the Agreement then it (or officers) committed FRAUD if done with the knowledge they did have the ability to offer such an Agreement...

Based on the above, KK has Locus Standi to ask KPC for compensation since KK made business decisions based on the Agreement.

As far as the loss of financial goodwill, marketing costs, etc:
1) There were demurrage costs for the vessel/s
2) There are financing costs

The others might be 'vague' but in KK's defense, they are in the business of importing & selling fuel. They have the numbers to back up the losses they suffered...
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#1340 Posted : Wednesday, February 16, 2011 11:52:39 AM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,380
Location: Nairobi
winston wrote:
Just been following the discussion and coupling with my little knowledge about the oil industry, I would like to (agree with @milken) and say that it would not have been logical for KPC to guarantee KK exclusive use of the facilities...simply because it is a multi-user facility (ie any oil company has a right to use the facility)

KK did not want (or have) 'exclusive use' but under the Ullage Agreement/s all OMCs are given an 'allocation' based on Market Share.
There are rules about evacuation as well therefore, KPC should have availed that percentage to KK.
What probably happened is that Triton bribed some KPC chaps who allowed Triton to use KPC/KOSF tanks as STORAGE [above their ullage allocation] exceeding 30 days thus denying others the chance to use it to offload fuel.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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