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Kenya Debt Watch
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Cde Monomotapa
#101 Posted : Monday, October 17, 2011 5:49:07 AM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/13/2011
Posts: 5,964
Stop being naive guys. Show me one country that was built with hard cash.
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kizee1
#102 Posted : Monday, October 17, 2011 10:16:56 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/29/2010
Posts: 679
Location: nairobi
Cde Monomotapa wrote:
Stop being naive guys. Show me one country that was built with hard cash.


read your history, when did nations start borrowing to finance their deficits? your assertion is that NO nation grew other than from debt?
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kizee1
#103 Posted : Monday, October 17, 2011 10:29:28 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/29/2010
Posts: 679
Location: nairobi
from wiki

HistoryThe first ever government bond was issued by the English government in 1693 to raise money to fund a war against France. It was in the form of a tontine. Later, governments in Europe started issuing perpetual bonds (bonds with no maturity date) to fund wars and other government spending. The use of perpetual bonds ceased in the 20th century, and currently governments issue bonds of limited duration.

so to answer your question...every prosperous nation before 1693
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Scubidu
#104 Posted : Monday, October 17, 2011 3:58:13 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/4/2009
Posts: 700
Location: Nairobi
hisah wrote:
Thanks @scubidu. I had forgotten the name of this thread.

scubidu wrote:

USD 2.0 Billion 4-Year Fixed Rate; Coupon: 1.125% - August 18, 2010
http://treasury.worldban...billionGlobal_Bond.html

But the curious thing is that all the USD bonds before and after it had a basis for their pricing; a spread over a corresponding US Treasury Note. However, the August 2010 auction had no pricing details and the coupon rate was significantly lower than all the others (you just need to compare the coupon rates on the April and May 2010 issues; The rate on the 3-year bond in April was considerably higher than the 4-year).


Nobody saw this nor questioned this world bank houdini act. See no evil... Goodluck with the rains for they'll 'fix' the economy...


@Hisah. Yes nobody questioned it. Well... but think about it World Bank tells you to buy bonds it's issuing (you really don't have no choice). And what's the return? Interest income on World Bank RAMP for fiscal year June 2011 was 355m from a 38b investment... oh dear.
“We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
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Scubidu
#105 Posted : Monday, October 17, 2011 4:10:06 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/4/2009
Posts: 700
Location: Nairobi
Mainat wrote:
Scubidu-you've been MIA hope its for a good cause.
Yes, ile ndeni this mzee will leave us with is a work of ugly art. Imho, its easy to look good when you are splashing out but even when its on good projects, you still need to remember its borrowed cash.
Imho, our choice of the next president must be informed by:
Either we get a president with the strategy to grow the economy at 10% pa (without additional borrowing).
Or one who will help Kenya cuts its cloth accordingly.


@mainat. Always for a good cause, but u still have the record... u were away for year, last i remember.
We're pretty much screwed on the borrowing side... as long as cbk is not independent. But we borrow for so much unncessary crap, like military... we can't even take museveni on in a fair fight.
Unfortunately for prezzo, the latest increase in debt has been pure revaluation... guess that's why he's getting serious on exchange rates.
Off topic though. Ive been catching up on The Banking (Amendment) Bill, 2011. The new sections are limiting the interest rates spread. The MPC will set the lending rate and a cbk base rate will determine deposit rates. Bankers will not be happy.
“We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
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Scubidu
#106 Posted : Saturday, October 22, 2011 2:39:57 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/4/2009
Posts: 700
Location: Nairobi
Fingers crossed. Hoping we don't buy this!

http://treasury.worldban...D4billionGlobalBond.html
“We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
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the deal
#107 Posted : Sunday, November 27, 2011 11:36:05 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
Kenya's domestic debt now stand at 759 bln, interest rate payment up to July top last year.
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Scubidu
#108 Posted : Monday, November 28, 2011 2:34:54 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/4/2009
Posts: 700
Location: Nairobi
the deal wrote:
Kenya's domestic debt now stand at 759 bln, interest rate payment up to July top last year.


@the deal. Actually it's around 795 bln. Add to that the 799 bln on external and things start to look crazy (glad the exchange rate has come down). Oh yeah that's external debt figures was before IMF gave us the emergency loan and KenGen the new one.

Keep your eye out for the domestic debt figure on 12th & 19th December though. Interesting times ahead. I foresee injections.
“We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
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accelriskconsult
#109 Posted : Monday, November 28, 2011 8:20:28 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
Scubidu wrote:
Mainat wrote:
Scubidu-you've been MIA hope its for a good cause.
Yes, ile ndeni this mzee will leave us with is a work of ugly art. Imho, its easy to look good when you are splashing out but even when its on good projects, you still need to remember its borrowed cash.
Imho, our choice of the next president must be informed by:
Either we get a president with the strategy to grow the economy at 10% pa (without additional borrowing).
Or one who will help Kenya cuts its cloth accordingly.


@mainat. Always for a good cause, but u still have the record... u were away for year, last i remember.
We're pretty much screwed on the borrowing side... as long as cbk is not independent. But we borrow for so much unncessary crap, like military... we can't even take museveni on in a fair fight.
Unfortunately for prezzo, the latest increase in debt has been pure revaluation... guess that's why he's getting serious on exchange rates.
Off topic though. Ive been catching up on The Banking (Amendment) Bill, 2011. The new sections are limiting the interest rates spread. The MPC will set the lending rate and a cbk base rate will determine deposit rates. Bankers will not be happy.



Guys do you think the CBK has been acting as the lender of last resort?
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hisah
#110 Posted : Monday, November 28, 2011 3:49:48 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 8/4/2010
Posts: 8,977
Gubberment debt at a squeeze crossroad... I can hardly wait for the June 2012 budget.

http://www.businessdaily...2/-/o405ocz/-/index.html
$15/barrel oil... The commodities lehman moment arrives as well as Sovereign debt volcano!
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