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KRA's housing tax amnesty, and my choice to ignore it.
businesspundit
#1 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 9:36:13 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 9/16/2015
Posts: 15
Hello,
KRA is running a promotion. Landlord you are forgiven!
Is anyone actually paying tax of 10% of gross rental income?
can you give me your insights knowing 1/3 will be stolen.

First of all, for the record I am against paying tax to the Government. I avoid it like the plague.
Especially when I see prezo, ministers, mps, senators, mcas and everyone in between taking numerous useless foreign trips.

Then I see the huge convoys of cars with sirens and I get an ulcer. The big salaries. The big houses like the one of Kibaki with unpaid water bills that are supposedly the responsibility of tax payer.

When IEBC announced yesterday that they were going to procure a new set of bvr kits cause the ones they bought last time (that didn't work and costed a-ga-zillion) are obsolete, I almost threw up.


I think to my-self, you have to be an idiot to pay taxes. So what to do?
Hide? Under-declare? Wait for KRA? Wait for next amnesty? Bribe? Raise your rental prices and pass the cost to poor Wanjiku (or Atieno)?



cwmuruga
#2 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 10:38:41 AM
Rank: Hello

Joined: 4/11/2012
Posts: 2
Ignorance is bliss, until that day a caveat is placed on your property. You can run but you can never hide from the taxman. With GIS and the IDMS between Govt Agencies, Service providers, Banks & KRA, I wish you good luck. You need it, abd btw you elect the people you have mentioned, don't you?
sparkly
#3 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 11:58:44 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
businesspundit wrote:
Hello,
KRA is running a promotion. Landlord you are forgiven!
Is anyone actually paying tax of 10% of gross rental income?
can you give me your insights knowing 1/3 will be stolen.

First of all, for the record I am against paying tax to the Government. I avoid it like the plague.
Especially when I see prezo, ministers, mps, senators, mcas and everyone in between taking numerous useless foreign trips.

Then I see the huge convoys of cars with sirens and I get an ulcer. The big salaries. The big houses like the one of Kibaki with unpaid water bills that are supposedly the responsibility of tax payer.

When IEBC announced yesterday that they were going to procure a new set of bvr kits cause the ones they bought last time (that didn't work and costed a-ga-zillion) are obsolete, I almost threw up.


I think to my-self, you have to be an idiot to pay taxes. So what to do?
Hide? Under-declare? Wait for KRA? Wait for next amnesty? Bribe? Raise your rental prices and pass the cost to poor Wanjiku (or Atieno)?





Very juvenile thinking. Sossion please cancel the strike so that this standard 3 pupil can go back to school.
Life is short. Live passionately.
Tbags
#4 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 11:59:36 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 1/30/2015
Posts: 23
I would not declare.I'd Just hike the rent and wait.KRA are not as efficient/effective as they pretend to be. Otw talk to other Landlords in the neighbourhood.If one of them has declared,then better do the same.
DBLyon
#5 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 1:45:46 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/28/2014
Posts: 149
Location: Nairobi
businesspundit wrote:
Hello,
KRA is running a promotion. Landlord you are forgiven!
Is anyone actually paying tax of 10% of gross rental income?
can you give me your insights knowing 1/3 will be stolen.

First of all, for the record I am against paying tax to the Government. I avoid it like the plague.
Especially when I see prezo, ministers, mps, senators, mcas and everyone in between taking numerous useless foreign trips.

Then I see the huge convoys of cars with sirens and I get an ulcer. The big salaries. The big houses like the one of Kibaki with unpaid water bills that are supposedly the responsibility of tax payer.

When IEBC announced yesterday that they were going to procure a new set of bvr kits cause the ones they bought last time (that didn't work and costed a-ga-zillion) are obsolete, I almost threw up.


I think to my-self, you have to be an idiot to pay taxes. So what to do?
Hide? Under-declare? Wait for KRA? Wait for next amnesty? Bribe? Raise your rental prices and pass the cost to poor Wanjiku (or Atieno)?





@businesspundit How do you expect the government to run the country if your policy is to never pay taxes?
When you live for others' opinions, you are dead.

- Carlos Slim Helu
Ash Ock
#6 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 2:07:50 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 8/27/2010
Posts: 495
Location: Nairobi
DBLyon wrote:
@businesspundit How do you expect the government to run the country if your policy is to never pay taxes?


Not saying I support @businesspundit (I unwillingly pay my share), but just today, we read this: "Treasury promises IMF retrenchment of civil servants by December" while just a few months back we got this:



The government should really get its priorities right.

Sent from my Black Nokia 3310
DBLyon
#7 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 3:29:00 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/28/2014
Posts: 149
Location: Nairobi
Ash Ock wrote:
DBLyon wrote:
@businesspundit How do you expect the government to run the country if your policy is to never pay taxes?


The government should really get its priorities right.


@Ash Ock: Agreed. Our legislators need to clean up their act, that's for sure. In fact, their behaviour is quite disgusting. I just don't believe that 2 wrongs make a right. I do my bit (reluctantly too) and at the same time make noise about their wrongs that should be stopped.
When you live for others' opinions, you are dead.

- Carlos Slim Helu
Mike Ock
#8 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 6:00:09 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/22/2015
Posts: 682
@businesspundit all over the world most government money is wasted. As any entity grows headcount, it's efficiency declines. So your excuse for not paying taxes is not valid.

That being said, however, it is also common knowledge in the business community that if you pay each and every tax obligation, you are likely to have no profit left. I learnt this the hard way. After paying in full and toying with losses in my business this year, in March some stupid KRA matafakas still came for me aggressively. I had to part with 150k to shoo them off. I suspect it was my competitors doing.

So what balance can be struck between keeping the lights on in this godforsaken country of ours, and making profits in your business? I decided to do the following:

1. Just have a budget for KRA every month. Doesn't have to be every obligation in full, but it can just be whatever you can manage. This will serve to clear your conscience about contributing to Kenyas development and cool off whoever decides to investigate you. If you are one of those who have never paid anything and will never pay, the investigators will not spare you.

2. Practice tax avoidance wherever you can. Use tax haven loopholes if you can. They are the biggest loopholes available.

3. Have some money set aside for bribes, just in case they come for you. No more than 150k.

PS: all these tips are for small businesses.
Mike Ock
#9 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 6:07:34 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/22/2015
Posts: 682
DBLyon wrote:

@Ash Ock: Agreed. Our legislators need to clean up their act, that's for sure. In fact, their behaviour is quite disgusting. I just don't believe that 2 wrongs make a right. I do my bit (reluctantly too) and at the same time make noise about their wrongs that should be stopped.


You'll struggle to pay then your rival will eventually send KRA officials to harass you, EABL style. You'll be forced to bribe your way out just like someone who hasn't been paying. It happened to me, now I've had to stop paying in full in order to have a bribe war chest against any more salvos by my rival.
VituVingiSana
#10 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 7:31:04 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,371
Location: Nairobi
Mike Ock wrote:
DBLyon wrote:

@Ash Ock: Agreed. Our legislators need to clean up their act, that's for sure. In fact, their behaviour is quite disgusting. I just don't believe that 2 wrongs make a right. I do my bit (reluctantly too) and at the same time make noise about their wrongs that should be stopped.


You'll struggle to pay then your rival will eventually send KRA officials to harass you, EABL style. You'll be forced to bribe your way out just like someone who hasn't been paying. It happened to me, now I've had to stop paying in full in order to have a bribe war chest against any more salvos by my rival.

Don't blame EABL for Keroche's woes. As I read more and gathered more information the situation seemed clearer.

1) Keroche was selling similar products as EABL e.g. Viena Ice = Smirnoff Ice
2) The tax per Keroche on similar products was lower than what EABL was paying. KRA's rules are often vague and subject to different interpretations. Both Keroche & EABL could have been right.
3) EABL must have protested to KRA about the differential.
4) EABL must have asked KRA for one of 2 options: EABL pays the same lower rate as Keroche OR Keroche (et al) pay the same higher rate as EABL. [The same drama applies to BAT vs Mastermind + Safricom vs Airtel/Telkom for licensing fees].
5) KRA/GoK would 'lose' taxes if they reduced taxes on EABL to match Keroche so instead they went after Keroche for higher taxes.
6) IMHO, I think KRA should tighten up the ambiguities, tell Keroche & EABL to pay per the (unambiguous) law/rules going forward. For the past, give EABL a credit [to bring the taxes at par] for the differential vis-a-vis Keroche (et al). Why punish Keroche for KRA's (& lawmakers) faults?

@AShOck @Mike Ock - I feel your pain. The tax regime should be transparent. And simple. I believe it is deliberately not so because the folks at KRA want loopholes and ambiguities so they can hassle taxpayers for bribes.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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