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2012 elections, what can we do differently
eboomerang
#1 Posted : Tuesday, January 03, 2012 9:23:40 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 6/27/2011
Posts: 301
Location: Nairobi
Short caption from a blog entry...

blog wrote:
...
How do we ensure that we conduct a better election in 2012?

Without a lot of details and political innuendos, my theory is that the 2007/8 election crumbled due to an epic failure in logistics, period!!

With the kind of logistics that had been put in place, it mattered not who led the election organization, that individual would still have had challenges with running a clean election. The matter was and still is aggravated by the kind of personality politics we have in Kenya.

Fast forward, I’m afraid that the challenges with logistics have now been compounded with the addition of Senators, governors etc. etc. and the general change in the governance structure...


More can be read from: http://wp.me/p1B0a4-21
Impunity
#2 Posted : Tuesday, January 03, 2012 9:27:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,330
Location: Masada
Reduce the number of electable post to say 4; that is elect Prezyy,shietnators and gaanas in say August, then elact Mpigs,kanjoras,women rapes and walemavu on say December.

My Zim dime!
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You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

Lolest!
#3 Posted : Tuesday, January 03, 2012 9:40:17 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Impunity wrote:
Reduce the number of electable post to say 4; that is elect Prezyy,shietnators and gaanas in say August, then elact Mpigs,kanjoras,women rapes and walemavu on say December.

My Zim dime!

women rapes ni kina nani?Sad
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
Impunity
#4 Posted : Tuesday, January 03, 2012 9:51:21 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,330
Location: Masada
Lolest! wrote:
Impunity wrote:
Reduce the number of electable post to say 4; that is elect Prezyy,shietnators and gaanas in say August, then elact Mpigs,kanjoras,women rapes and walemavu on say December.

My Zim dime!

women rapes ni kina nani?Sad


Typo.

Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly
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You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

harrydre
#5 Posted : Wednesday, January 04, 2012 1:54:07 AM
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Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 9,131
Location: Kanjo
Do it electronically such that once a vote is cast wherever, it hits a central database and a cumulitive total is displayed on real time basis.

Kenya Power to ensure stima iko!!
i.am.back!!!!
Impunity
#6 Posted : Wednesday, January 04, 2012 3:30:54 AM
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Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,330
Location: Masada
harrydre wrote:
Do it electronically such that once a vote is cast wherever, it hits a central database and a cumulitive total is displayed on real time basis.

Kenya Power to ensure stima iko!!


How will handle the computer hackers?
It will easy to double an entry of result by simply changing the program in the formula.
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

mukiha
#7 Posted : Wednesday, January 04, 2012 1:08:51 PM
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Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
harrydre wrote:
Do it electronically such that once a vote is cast wherever, it hits a central database and a cumulitive total is displayed on real time basis.

Kenya Power to ensure stima iko!!


Experience shows that countries that vote electronically are generally slower in getting results than those who do it manually!

Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
harrydre
#8 Posted : Wednesday, January 04, 2012 10:47:00 PM
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Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 9,131
Location: Kanjo
mukiha wrote:
harrydre wrote:
Do it electronically such that once a vote is cast wherever, it hits a central database and a cumulitive total is displayed on real time basis.

Kenya Power to ensure stima iko!!


Experience shows that countries that vote electronically are generally slower in getting results than those who do it manually!



You have any examples?
i.am.back!!!!
harrydre
#9 Posted : Wednesday, January 04, 2012 11:06:23 PM
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Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 9,131
Location: Kanjo
Impunity wrote:
harrydre wrote:
Do it electronically such that once a vote is cast wherever, it hits a central database and a cumulitive total is displayed on real time basis.

Kenya Power to ensure stima iko!!


How will handle the computer hackers?
It will easy to double an entry of result by simply changing the program in the formula.


of course it has to be a secure system
i.am.back!!!!
Impunity
#10 Posted : Wednesday, January 04, 2012 11:29:17 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,330
Location: Masada
No more midnight swearing in, any party past 4 pm will be treated as being held at midnight.
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You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

nostoppingthis
#11 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 6:11:30 AM
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Joined: 8/24/2009
Posts: 5,909
Location: Nairobi
we can avoid the culture of stealing ...
masukuma
#12 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 8:21:00 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,822
Location: Nairobi
harrydre wrote:
Impunity wrote:
harrydre wrote:
Do it electronically such that once a vote is cast wherever, it hits a central database and a cumulitive total is displayed on real time basis.

Kenya Power to ensure stima iko!!


How will handle the computer hackers?
It will easy to double an entry of result by simply changing the program in the formula.


of course it has to be a secure system


Let me categorically say...e-Voting will not be there in 2012 and while there is a push for it to occur in 2017 - it may not be an e-voting solution but a counting solution similar to what is found in the Philippines.

While taking about e-Voting or other forms of election technology, we are quick to point out countries that have implemented it with success but fail to understand why they did it. Elections are political problems and not technical problems, the tenets of a free and fair election are:
Quote:
Fair Elections (without any distinctions) – Elections should be conducted so as to ensure equal conditions for participation in the electoral process for all eligible candidates and voters, Irrespective of gender, religion, ethnicity, political affiliation, language, literacy or disability. Elections must not only be fair – they must be seen to be fair.
Genuine Elections – Elections must be held for institutions which have authority, must be conducted in a credible manner and must present voters with real choices between candidates for election, with the results of elections representing the will of the people.
Periodic Elections – Elections must be held frequently enough to ensure that governmental authority continues to reflect the will of the people and that there is regular opportunity for the voters to change government.
Universal Suffrage – Legal and operational limitations on access to candidacy or the right to vote must be minimized and must not be discriminatory in nature, except where such limitations are reasonable or necessary.
Equal Suffrage – Voters should each be provided the same number of votes in each election being conducted and electoral districts should be reasonably equal in size so that each vote cast has a similar weight.
Secret Ballot – In order that voters are able to freely express their electoral preferences in the absence of intimidation, the ballot should be completed in private and it must not be possible to link a voter to a voting preference.



Any technology that is seen to be contravening any of those tenets should be thrown out. Since as was done in Germany and the Netherlands – it may be thrown out for potentially being “hackable”. Remember any technology that sacrifices transparency to the masses on the altar of efficiency is wrong in the same breath any technology that removes the power of control and administration from the masses to into the hands of a select few practitioners is also undemocratic from the onset. This is because elections are not technical exercises but political exercises and any Election Management body is advised to treat it as such.

has anyone thought about the cost of e-voting? cost (Fixed, Variable and Integrity costs) of e-voting or counting are high. very high! when looked at from an objective standpoint - a state-of-the-art e-voting device will only be used for a maximum of 3 elections (10 years) when the device due to Moorse's law will have become what a 586 machine is today (hardware) and its software will have been what windows Millennium was back then and no one will be supporting it.

How to approach the use of e-voting

While it seems obvious to many on this forum, the use of computers or electronic devices is not an easy thing to a huge number of people in our republic this is due to the fact that we have a large number of people that are illiterate in the traditional form (i.e. reading and writing) and digitally illiterate individuals as well so a solution needs to take this into consideration.

As mentioned by Mukiha, e-voting is generally a slower voting experience for individuals as compared to familiar paper ballot voting unless solutions that mimic the ballot paper (physical buttons) are implemented and not DRE (Direct Recording Electronics).

Finally, the use of Voter verifiable paper audit trails (VVPAT) is becoming a standard, the VVPAT is a physical piece of paper that can be verified by the voter and physically cast on to a physical ballot box for recounting if need arises. Remember that in our case this piece of paper has to be available and legible for at least 6 months (constitutionally setout election dispute period) so thermal printed super market type VVPATs are out.

I would also wrap up categorically saying that, in elections High Tech is not necessarily "Better" Tech.

I am an internationally recognized Election Technology expert and author of many pieces of election software that include an e-voting solution.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
dossy7
#13 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 10:29:30 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 1,492
Location: Nairobi
Be the change and make sure u vote n educate as many people as possible to vote wisely
Kenya ni yetu sisi sote
2012
#14 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 12:15:30 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
Impunity wrote:
How will handle the computer hackers?


I'm totally opposed to an electronic voting system. It will be very easy to manipulate since very few people will have the technical knowledge and we know the level of computer illiteracy in the govt. With that system you won't even need hackers, just a malicious or well compromised official.

Anyway what I'd do differently in 2012 is vote for candidates who I can hold accountable to his/her promise. ie give believable details what he/she will accomplish within the first term then I'll give him/her another term after.

BBI will solve it
:)
eboomerang
#15 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 3:37:54 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 6/27/2011
Posts: 301
Location: Nairobi
2012 wrote:
...

Anyway what I'd do differently in 2012 is vote for candidates who I can hold accountable to his/her promise. ie give believable details what he/she will accomplish within the first term then I'll give him/her another term after.

We may not be able to control whom people elect to office(s). Change in that area will occur rather naturally in due time as more people get educated and exposed to what is expected of leaders -who should be servants and not superstars of sorts.

What we can change in the short-term are processes.Applying good processes would signifantly reduce the kind of mess we are about to get into.
Jus Blazin
#16 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 4:51:04 PM
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Joined: 10/23/2008
Posts: 3,966
What can we do differently? Tupendane. No matter who occupies the house on the hill, for the rest of us kupendana itakuwa muhimu. One Country.
Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity. ~ Lucius Annaeus Seneca
masukuma
#17 Posted : Thursday, January 05, 2012 7:59:00 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,822
Location: Nairobi
as opposed to what people think, the reason the elections were considered a failure in 2007 was because we did not receive results fast enough and when results were reported they changed the picture. while considered a failure the elections of 2007 have been established as the most well conducted of all elections kenya has done. the problem was simply that
- the elections were too close to call and the opposition lost
- the ECK did not implement an Election results reporting system from the Polling Centres so this created a vacuum that media houses took up and started transmitting results (from God knows where)

these two reasons conspired and created the melee that was PEV.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
eboomerang
#18 Posted : Thursday, January 12, 2012 11:24:49 PM
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Joined: 6/27/2011
Posts: 301
Location: Nairobi
masukuma wrote:
as opposed to what people think, the reason the elections were considered a failure in 2007 was because we did not receive results fast enough and when results were reported they changed the picture. while considered a failure the elections of 2007 have been established as the most well conducted of all elections kenya has done. the problem was simply that
- the elections were too close to call and the opposition lost
- the ECK did not implement an Election results reporting system from the Polling Centres so this created a vacuum that media houses took up and started transmitting results (from God knows where)

these two reasons conspired and created the melee that was PEV.

Interesting view...

We can only hope they iron out those systemic issues.
Impunity
#19 Posted : Friday, January 13, 2012 12:36:17 AM
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Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,330
Location: Masada
We should also avoid accepting handouts.
Or rather we accept the handouts and eat with our mouth closed and vote for the leader we want, not the highest donor!
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Jamhuri2030
#20 Posted : Friday, January 13, 2012 5:38:31 AM
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Joined: 1/13/2012
Posts: 1
We need to make these critical 2012 elections about the real issues we as a country are facing. Since we have borrowed so much from the US constitution why not make the Candidates’ debate the issues and how they intend to solve them like they do in the US? Make these debates live on TV and Radio so that the people can familiarize themselves with the candidates and their positions. There will be no hiding under tribal cloaks when answers to issues are gibberish!
Wisdom is not what you know, it's what you help others understand!
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