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ICC+RAO - NO BWANA
Nandwa
#1 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 11:38:55 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/17/2009
Posts: 1,049

Nauliza swali nijibiwe

All those 'Kenyans' who are vigorously supporting the ICC trials at the moment.

In the event that kina Ruto implicate RAO and ICC is convinced and moves to summon him, will they remain consistent!

Will the tune change!!!!
Your guess as good as mine.

'Kenyans'!
Just as absolute power corrupts leaders, so does absolute fanaticism blind the people from logic
McReggae
#2 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 11:51:20 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/17/2008
Posts: 23,365
Location: Nairobi
Nandwa wrote:

Nauliza swali nijibiwe

All those 'Kenyans' who are vigorously supporting the ICC trials at the moment.

In the event that kina Ruto implicate RAO and ICC is convinced and moves to summon him, will they remain consistent!

Will the tune change!!!!
Your guess as good as mine.

'Kenyans'!


...In essence implying that you don't support the ICC coz Raila is not on the list.....umejinyonga hapo!!!!
..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
ecstacy
#3 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 11:57:45 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/26/2008
Posts: 4,449
Nandwa wrote:

Nauliza swali nijibiwe

All those 'Kenyans' who are vigorously supporting the ICC trials at the moment.

In the event that kina Ruto implicate RAO and ICC is convinced and moves to summon him, will they remain consistent!

Will the tune change!!!!
Your guess as good as mine.

'Kenyans'!


Valid question given the ICC has since been reduced to a PNU vs ODM[half of the 'maisha bora'] affair at the leadership level. It's good to see some pro-'PNU' supporters support the Hague process. As you ask, will the same hold if RAO or his field marshall Nyong'o is implicated?...
Surealligator
#4 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 12:42:48 PM
Rank: User

Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 709
Location: Velayat-e Faryab
ecstacy wrote:
Nandwa wrote:

Nauliza swali nijibiwe

All those 'Kenyans' who are vigorously supporting the ICC trials at the moment.

In the event that kina Ruto implicate RAO and ICC is convinced and moves to summon him, will they remain consistent!

Will the tune change!!!!
Your guess as good as mine.

'Kenyans'!


Valid question given the ICC has since been reduced to a PNU vs ODM[half of the 'maisha bora'] affair at the leadership level. It's good to see some pro-'PNU' supporters support the Hague process. As you ask, will the same hold if RAO or his field marshall Nyong'o is implicated?...


@Ecstacy

Am surprised you know that Nyong'o was initially in the Waki envelop but be careful here as guys tend to get very emotional when you touch their own.

Am still asking questions and digging and learning.

A passage from some serious review column

"What this illustrates is that accusations of neocolonial intent on the part of the ICC are misguided. The Court’s selections are not informed by nefarious intentions.

Rather they are indicative of its shrewd political calculus (or lack of it). The ICC does not have the legitimacy or backing at this point to go to politically sensitive places—places where a major power might object (Talk of a Judiciary system where a select few cannot be charged). This is especially true of the Court’s dealings with American interests. The attitude of the United States toward the Court during the Bush administration was one of acrimonious dismissal at best.

Therefore, these early cases for the ICC must not only be supported by strong evidence; they also must not obtrude on major power interests.

The Court knows that it must build its legitimacy on the edges of international politics and grow slowly in stature and legitimacy. The Court is aware that it is too weak to challenge a P5 country directly, so it avoids Iraq and Georgia.

It is cognizant too of challenging a country that enjoys a major power’s alliance (Israel), and so it does not open an investigation in Palestine.

The ICC knows that it must carve out its place in the larger realm of international institutions. But it can only do so where interests of the powerful do not collide.

So it goes to Africa.

A case of crucify the man on the street and protecting the elite = the other definition of impunity.

http://www.iar-gwu.org/node/87


Italicized words are mine.
Go overdrive in purchasing the goods when there's blood on the streets, expecially if the blood is your own
simonkabz
#5 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 12:56:56 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
@intel, fm that excerpt, its a pointer to the naivete of kenyans n consistently self-screwing, making noise left right centre up n dwn.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
McReggae
#6 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 1:00:23 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/17/2008
Posts: 23,365
Location: Nairobi
eih thimioni, hii ICC is a thorn in the flesh for you, if only you could have it banned!!!....
..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
Ngalaka
#7 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 1:20:32 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,566
simonkabz wrote:
@intel, fm that excerpt, its a pointer to the naivete of kenyans n consistently self-screwing, making noise left right centre up n dwn.


Ditto!


Sometimes we choose not to analyse matters out for ourselves - leaving the Politicos to think for us!

Can anybody even begin to imagine Ocampo posturing to indict Putin/Medvedev?

But Ocampo blinks not as he announces that he/ICC have indicted a sitting president in Africa.

Let them try Israel kama hawata lipuliwa siku hiyo hiyo!!
Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
ecstacy
#8 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 1:38:42 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/26/2008
Posts: 4,449
Surealligator wrote:
ecstacy wrote:
Nandwa wrote:

Nauliza swali nijibiwe

All those 'Kenyans' who are vigorously supporting the ICC trials at the moment.

In the event that kina Ruto implicate RAO and ICC is convinced and moves to summon him, will they remain consistent!

Will the tune change!!!!
Your guess as good as mine.

'Kenyans'!


Valid question given the ICC has since been reduced to a PNU vs ODM[half of the 'maisha bora'] affair at the leadership level. It's good to see some pro-'PNU' supporters support the Hague process. As you ask, will the same hold if RAO or his field marshall Nyong'o is implicated?...


@Ecstacy

Am surprised you know that Nyong'o was initially in the Waki envelop but be careful here as guys tend to get very emotional when you touch their own.

Am still asking questions and digging and learning.

A passage from some serious review column

"What this illustrates is that accusations of neocolonial intent on the part of the ICC are misguided. The Court’s selections are not informed by nefarious intentions.

Rather they are indicative of its shrewd political calculus (or lack of it). The ICC does not have the legitimacy or backing at this point to go to politically sensitive places—places where a major power might object (Talk of a Judiciary system where a select few cannot be charged). This is especially true of the Court’s dealings with American interests. The attitude of the United States toward the Court during the Bush administration was one of acrimonious dismissal at best.

Therefore, these early cases for the ICC must not only be supported by strong evidence; they also must not obtrude on major power interests.

The Court knows that it must build its legitimacy on the edges of international politics and grow slowly in stature and legitimacy. The Court is aware that it is too weak to challenge a P5 country directly, so it avoids Iraq and Georgia.

It is cognizant too of challenging a country that enjoys a major power’s alliance (Israel), and so it does not open an investigation in Palestine.

The ICC knows that it must carve out its place in the larger realm of international institutions. But it can only do so where interests of the powerful do not collide.

So it goes to Africa.

A case of crucify the man on the street and protecting the elite = the other definition of impunity.

http://www.iar-gwu.org/node/87


Italicized words are mine.

@surealligator, nice analysis. need I say more? Unfortunately for Kenya, addressing impunity as wielded against the governed by the leadership cannot be led by the incumbent who are beneficiaries of the same. The obvious is playing out and you can be sure it wouldn't be better if coalition positions were actually shifted. It remains remarkable that a ruling head of state in africa can help pass a constitution that trims his executive powers even in the transition period [some will still choose to start debating this] Kenyans don't beat yourselves too much...However the day Kibs or RAO can be indicted (possibly post-2012) and the railway is still intact, Kenya will have moved a step forward. Until then, as Kenyan politics 'matures', veiled propagandism combined with economic sticks & carrots will be the weapon of choice for the West to unseat the ruling pigs.
kadonye
#9 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 1:48:36 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 5/30/2009
Posts: 1,390
Of course if Amolo or Peter were in the list their supporters would have been against ICC. For many, its not a matter of principle, its politics. Thats why uhurus men are against Den Haag
What a wicked man I am!The things I want to do,I don't do.The things I don't want to do I find myself doing
simonkabz
#10 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2011 6:16:35 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
@kadosh, i once suggested that Luos shouldnt even comment on the ICC issue n lo! Karibu jahman wapige mimi mawe yawa! If RAO or Nyosh were in the list, jahman kangekuwa ICU walai lol! Am I controversial? No. Just HONEST.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
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