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mpobiz
#1711 Posted : Monday, May 11, 2020 12:20:37 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 2,264
masukuma wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
masukuma wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
masukuma wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
Doktari just reminding us about a similar case


Measures put in place are not the same.
US was not testing at that point
US has not implemented contact tracing
US was quarantining/isolating people at home



What do you mean that the US was not testing? Where did they get the 500 confirmed cases and the 22 deaths?
So the more you test the more people get infected?
Does it mean that if their testing capabilities was like ours here there could be no deaths or people sick in hospitals?
Their only form of contact Tracing Is in form of an app they are trying to introduce. How do you conduct Kenyan style of contact Tracing from 1m confirmed cases?. The app is meant to warn someone if one of your close contact has tested positive and keep off.

I have also noticed just like HIV truck drivers have been discovered as the number one spreaders. But I foresee the disruptions that will occur will be like the government shooting its own foot.



My post is a past tense thing - this was the situation BACK THEN.
Correction - mass testing. They were only testing symptomatic people and it wasn’t even being done well as many people went to the ER during that time and were not tested. They had massive problems getting testing going. The US wasted valuable time at the beginning doing nothing but politics.


Your statement is purely political. You sound like useless democrats. What was the government supposed to do that the UK. France, Italy did that averted their own catastrophe.
What was mass testing supposed to achieve by then apart from a lot of negative cases thus wasting a lot of time? This is an invisible enemy trump said. You can't know which direction the enemy was going to take. You also know that the Chinese were hiding a lot of information about the infection which put a lot of this wazungu at risk. You also know that the Chinese were hiding a lot of information about the infection which put a lot of this wazungu at risk


Trump had his version of 'mnataka nifanye nini?'. Small actions early in the game avert the need of drastic actions later in the game. It appears that most people don't understand this until now - which is sad. simple measures in place during the first week of an epidemic saves you from lots of problems. But each country has it's own route to follow on this one. P.S. it's not the Democrats fault -its Trump's fault... he is the president. Not Obama... Not Pelosi.

On the efficacy of Mass-Testing - aren't you the one who is critical about Kenya's response?
mpobiz wrote:
Testing of people from contact tracing is just an excuse for our very very very low testing capabilities.
In the western world there are massive testing sites all over the country that allow everybody to have access to be tested. Also the government has not stigmatized positive cases by throwing them into quarantine. You are just asked to stay home untill the situation worsens. So in General everbody is happy to be tested. Here even the few testing sites that we have are Generally empty.



mpobiz wrote:

It's called Mass testing. Not target testing. Let them try the same here. The outcome will make Some of you to move to turbi desert.


Lastly - Kindly decide whether it's a disease worth our time or not. it's either a consequential disease that China should have shared more information with us on and that's why it has killed many People OR it's such a useless disease that we are all panicking about - a disease that kills those who are dying anyway and is not worth all this drama. it cannot be both


If you read my posts .I have been very consistent. I have been against mass testing from day one because I see that it doesn't achieve anything.
some measures to combat infections should not be applied universally when you understand the nature of an infection.
This infection is very contagious just like common flu. It's likely going to be with us for a very long time. When will you stop counting the number of the infected?
The magnitude of previous pandemics is measured by the dead not the number it infected. We are told that 50m people died of Spanish flu. Do we know the number of people infected? Does it really matter?

If you read the context of my posts you will see that I was telling you that you were basing your statistics on a very small number of people who have been tested here in this country.I was enlightening you that in order for you to be a little bit accurate you needed mass testing like the one done in the UK or the USA.

This disease affects different people difrently. I don't understand why you can't see it has treated us differently.
I hope you understand what it means when a country or a city records 1000 deaths in 24 hrs. And to produce 1000 deaths In my understanding we need about 100k hospitalized cases. Do we have any of that here?
For such to occur here in this continent we wouldn't need Facebook ot Twitter to show you what's happening. You would just look outside your window.

@alma. I can see you are already ahead of me in the race to beat hardwood.
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
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masukuma
#1712 Posted : Monday, May 11, 2020 2:42:19 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
mpobiz wrote:
masukuma wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
masukuma wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
masukuma wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
Doktari just reminding us about a similar case


Measures put in place are not the same.
US was not testing at that point
US has not implemented contact tracing
US was quarantining/isolating people at home



What do you mean that the US was not testing? Where did they get the 500 confirmed cases and the 22 deaths?
So the more you test the more people get infected?
Does it mean that if their testing capabilities was like ours here there could be no deaths or people sick in hospitals?
Their only form of contact Tracing Is in form of an app they are trying to introduce. How do you conduct Kenyan style of contact Tracing from 1m confirmed cases?. The app is meant to warn someone if one of your close contact has tested positive and keep off.

I have also noticed just like HIV truck drivers have been discovered as the number one spreaders. But I foresee the disruptions that will occur will be like the government shooting its own foot.



My post is a past tense thing - this was the situation BACK THEN.
Correction - mass testing. They were only testing symptomatic people and it wasn’t even being done well as many people went to the ER during that time and were not tested. They had massive problems getting testing going. The US wasted valuable time at the beginning doing nothing but politics.


Your statement is purely political. You sound like useless democrats. What was the government supposed to do that the UK. France, Italy did that averted their own catastrophe.
What was mass testing supposed to achieve by then apart from a lot of negative cases thus wasting a lot of time? This is an invisible enemy trump said. You can't know which direction the enemy was going to take. You also know that the Chinese were hiding a lot of information about the infection which put a lot of this wazungu at risk. You also know that the Chinese were hiding a lot of information about the infection which put a lot of this wazungu at risk


Trump had his version of 'mnataka nifanye nini?'. Small actions early in the game avert the need of drastic actions later in the game. It appears that most people don't understand this until now - which is sad. simple measures in place during the first week of an epidemic saves you from lots of problems. But each country has it's own route to follow on this one. P.S. it's not the Democrats fault -its Trump's fault... he is the president. Not Obama... Not Pelosi.

On the efficacy of Mass-Testing - aren't you the one who is critical about Kenya's response?
mpobiz wrote:
Testing of people from contact tracing is just an excuse for our very very very low testing capabilities.
In the western world there are massive testing sites all over the country that allow everybody to have access to be tested. Also the government has not stigmatized positive cases by throwing them into quarantine. You are just asked to stay home untill the situation worsens. So in General everbody is happy to be tested. Here even the few testing sites that we have are Generally empty.



mpobiz wrote:

It's called Mass testing. Not target testing. Let them try the same here. The outcome will make Some of you to move to turbi desert.


Lastly - Kindly decide whether it's a disease worth our time or not. it's either a consequential disease that China should have shared more information with us on and that's why it has killed many People OR it's such a useless disease that we are all panicking about - a disease that kills those who are dying anyway and is not worth all this drama. it cannot be both


If you read my posts .I have been very consistent. I have been against mass testing from day one because I see that it doesn't achieve anything.
some measures to combat infections should not be applied universally when you understand the nature of an infection.
This infection is very contagious just like common flu. It's likely going to be with us for a very long time. When will you stop counting the number of the infected?
The magnitude of previous pandemics is measured by the dead not the number it infected. We are told that 50m people died of Spanish flu. Do we know the number of people infected? Does it really matter?

If you read the context of my posts you will see that I was telling you that you were basing your statistics on a very small number of people who have been tested here in this country.I was enlightening you that in order for you to be a little bit accurate you needed mass testing like the one done in the UK or the USA.

This disease affects different people difrently. I don't understand why you can't see it has treated us differently.
I hope you understand what it means when a country or a city records 1000 deaths in 24 hrs. And to produce 1000 deaths In my understanding we need about 100k hospitalized cases. Do we have any of that here?
For such to occur here in this continent we wouldn't need Facebook ot Twitter to show you what's happening. You would just look outside your window.

@alma. I can see you are already ahead of me in the race to beat hardwood.



I understand your point on testing - My understanding is that testing on it's own is not too useful - you need to tag it to something ONCE you find someone who is positive ESPECIALLY early in the disease's curve. Do you isolate them? What do you do? what type of intervention needs to be in place once you receive a positive case.
The US squandered that opportunity by being provincial and deciding to conjure their own tests that failed and thus lost valuable time. It's already too late for that type of intervention. But Kenya is not where the US is within the cycle of the disease - we can have tangiable interventions based on mass testing.

mpobiz wrote:

This disease affects different people differently
1) BASED THE FLOW OF THE DISEASE WITHIN THESE PEOPLE - WHO HAS IT FIRST AND HOW DOES IT SPREAD;
2 BASED ON THE THE BEHAVIOURS OF THE SAID PEOPLE INFECTED AND THOSE AROUND THE INFECTED PEOPLE;
2) BASED ON THE INTERVENTIONS AND MEASURES IN PLACE AND THEIR ADHERENCE ESPECIALLY BY THE SAID PEOPLE WHO HAVE THE DISEASE AND THE PEOPLE INFECTED


the disease is a product of spontaneous generation within groups of people - it comes from somewhere and measures put in place to limit its movement matter. That is why Uganda has had 0 community spread cases for weeks.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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  | | Edit by user: Monday, May 11, 2020 2:50 PM | Reason: Not specified
sqft
#1713 Posted : Monday, May 11, 2020 3:12:39 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/10/2015
Posts: 961
Location: Kenya
https://nairobinews.nati...f-covid-19-191-infected

Quote:
23 Kenyans in diaspora have died of Covid-19, 191 infected

Ten of the 23 deaths were reported in the United States, six in the United Kingdom, two in Italy and one each in Switzerland, Saudi Arabia, Sweden, South Africa and France.
Proverbs 13:11 Dishonest money dwindles away, but whoever gathers money little by little makes it grow.
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murchr
#1714 Posted : Monday, May 11, 2020 8:41:49 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
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Lolest!
#1715 Posted : Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:23:38 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
whiteowl wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
Tough new measures by MoH on truck drivers.

Drivers will have to be tested & carry with them proof of that test for clearance in subsequent roadblocks all the way from Mombasa

Trucks stopping points have been reduced as a containment measure


What is testing people in motion set to achieve considering this disease can stay undetected for a couple of days?

Truck drivers have been an agent of spreading the virus in the region. Govt says a driver has to have tested 48hrs before starting a trip. If I have the virus & I'm doing Mombasa-Uganda, I wont be allowed to proceed; I'm taken to quarantine
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
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kimanimsc
#1716 Posted : Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:49:11 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/4/2015
Posts: 241
Location: Kahno
sqft wrote:
https://nairobinews.nation.co.ke/general/23-kenyans-in-diaspora-have-died-of-covid-19-191-infected

Quote:
23 Kenyans in diaspora have died of Covid-19, 191 infected

Ten of the 23 deaths were reported in the United States, six in the United Kingdom, two in Italy and one each in Switzerland, Saudi Arabia, Sweden, South Africa and France.



South Sudan is not reporting. A former classmate at University died of the same in S/Sudan. Yet to be buried/repatriated.
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Intelligentsia
#1717 Posted : Tuesday, May 12, 2020 12:08:56 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/1/2009
Posts: 2,436
MoH is definitely under-testing, someone tell me why pris?
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aemathenge
#1718 Posted : Tuesday, May 12, 2020 12:45:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/18/2008
Posts: 3,434
Location: Kerugoya
Intelligentsia wrote:
MoH is definitely under-testing, someone tell me why pris?

Bureaucratic Red Tape.
Lethargic Civil Service.
Distracted Political Machinery.
Fiscal Indiscipline and Insufficiency.
Health Personnel Inadequacy.
Distrust Of Anything Government On The Ground.
Lack of appropriate equipment, and where available, lack of operation, repairs, and maintenance technician level personnel.
(All Cadre of Public Health Personnel Have Given A Strike Notice.)
A Distracted Political Leadership.
I could on all day but this is really depressing.
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mpobiz
#1719 Posted : Tuesday, May 12, 2020 4:47:55 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 2,264
aemathenge wrote:
Intelligentsia wrote:
MoH is definitely under-testing, someone tell me why pris?

Bureaucratic Red Tape.
Lethargic Civil Service.
Distracted Political Machinery.
Fiscal Indiscipline and Insufficiency.
Health Personnel Inadequacy.
Distrust Of Anything Government On The Ground.
Lack of appropriate equipment, and where available, lack of operation, repairs, and maintenance technician level personnel.
(All Cadre of Public Health Personnel Have Given A Strike Notice.)
A Distracted Political Leadership.
I could on all day but this is really depressing.


I think the government has also discovered it doesn't want to participate in a futile exercise. Better put the resources elsewhere.
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
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alma1
#1720 Posted : Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:48:54 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/19/2015
Posts: 2,871
Location: hapo
aemathenge wrote:
Intelligentsia wrote:
MoH is definitely under-testing, someone tell me why pris?

Bureaucratic Red Tape.
Lethargic Civil Service.
Distracted Political Machinery.
Fiscal Indiscipline and Insufficiency.
Health Personnel Inadequacy.
Distrust Of Anything Government On The Ground.
Lack of appropriate equipment, and where available, lack of operation, repairs, and maintenance technician level personnel.
(All Cadre of Public Health Personnel Have Given A Strike Notice.)
A Distracted Political Leadership.
I could on all day but this is really depressing.


All this may be true....or not.

But if you are going to make what seems like a reasonable argument, please include all the possible parameters

Kenyans are stupid
Kenyans have been scared to not test

most important

Maybe, just maybe the MOH is working within it's current limitations, including you personally one day saying here on wazua that medics should not be funded

Maybe, we went wrong with devolution of health care....

many many reasons

I on my part believe in the technical team in this pandemic issue.

Using the resources they have to maximum results. We know we can't test 100k a day like the US. So we rely on contact tracing which has worked before even for Ebola.

I will tell you without a shadow of a doubt. What the East African countries have done will be tought in Medical School on how to deal with pandemics.

We have an opposite scenario just 200km away in TZ. Trust me, you do not want to be in TZ right now.

Celebrate our MOH team from our nurses to the policy makers. Only TZ knows what kind of shit we would be right now.
Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?
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