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Voluntary Colonialism a cure for underdevelopment?
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wukan
#11 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 1:09:09 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,654
masukuma wrote:
Talk shop... of course hakuna kitu kama hii. Why not do it close by in asia as well.



From history you can see Europe(barbarians) benefited from being colonized by the Romans. Most of the developed European urban centres are along the roman built trading routes. Even Londinium started off as a roman fort.

Colonialism is not bad thing it's only the racist way Europe went about it in Africa that made it bad. If the other person has a superior way of working then you learn and adopt. The Swahili city states were basically colonies which learnt and adapted from the Arabs.

The German minister is right the way we are building cities is really over-glorified villages.
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masukuma
#12 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 1:20:00 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
wukan wrote:
masukuma wrote:
Talk shop... of course hakuna kitu kama hii. Why not do it close by in asia as well.



From history you can see Europe(barbarians) benefited from being colonized by the Romans. Most of the developed European urban centres are along the roman built trading routes. Even Londinium started off as a roman fort.

Colonialism is not bad thing it's only the racist way Europe went about it in Africa that made it bad. If the other person has a superior way of working then you learn and adopt. The Swahili city states were basically colonies which learnt and adapted from the Arabs.

The German minister is right the way we are building cities is really over-glorified villages.

People don't know what 'Colonialism' was... it was an extension of their nations/states/countries into ours... which is fine... they came and started creating systems... which was fine... but the best of the system was for themselves.... which is fine! we parted ways and they went back to their small countries. we are figuring this thing out and they want to come back...We are not interested in what they have to offer! if we wanted we would have been begging them to come back but we are not! We will figure this one out. 50 years is a such a short time in human history... such a short time when it comes to a country with 42 small nations in it. Show me a western country that ever marched forward with so many nations within it's borders.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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wukan
#13 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 1:41:04 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,654
masukuma wrote:
wukan wrote:
masukuma wrote:
Talk shop... of course hakuna kitu kama hii. Why not do it close by in asia as well.



From history you can see Europe(barbarians) benefited from being colonized by the Romans. Most of the developed European urban centres are along the roman built trading routes. Even Londinium started off as a roman fort.

Colonialism is not bad thing it's only the racist way Europe went about it in Africa that made it bad. If the other person has a superior way of working then you learn and adopt. The Swahili city states were basically colonies which learnt and adapted from the Arabs.

The German minister is right the way we are building cities is really over-glorified villages.

People don't know what 'Colonialism' was... it was an extension of their nations/states/countries into ours... which is fine... they came and started creating systems... which was fine... but the best of the system was for themselves.... which is fine! we parted ways and they went back to their small countries. we are figuring this thing out and they want to come back...We are not interested in what they have to offer! if we wanted we would have been begging them to come back but we are not! We will figure this one out. 50 years is a such a short time in human history... such a short time when it comes to a country with 42 small nations in it. Show me a western country that ever marched forward with so many nations within it's borders.


Figure it out but at what cost? African population is very young avg 16-18 years. When Europe was that young it was very militarized. Europe is full of old people and China is heading that way in 20 years. If the Europeans don't take care of Africa then Africans will just go and sack Europe same way the Gauls and Visgoths did under King Alaric.

Europeans fear that what they did to Rome is what Africans and Middle East guys will do to them. The trade off is to build the industrial supply chains in Africa and keep the young africans within the continent. The 42 small nations is the European way of keeping Africans in check.
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2012
#14 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 1:51:24 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
Lolest! wrote:
Germany's Minister for African affairs believes African countries should lease out land to bodies like EU and World Bank for 50 yrs. These bodies will then build new cities and run them in order to boost economic growth and create jobs. These cities will not be under host country's laws but will have their own independent ones

The idea is to create Hong Kong like enclaves. Hong Kong was under British rule up to 1997 when it was reverted to China.

AU has rejected this idea. Its envoy for infrastructure believes Africa will experience an economic miracle by 2063
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-46017551


Why don't we lease them the uninhabitable parts of Noth Eastern?

But this whole argument means they know what to do with the land and we don't yet information is freely available and we have Kenyans and Africans who have schooled in those developed nations but can't bring the knowledge back. It also means our governments are a joke.

BBI will solve it :)
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hardwood
#15 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 2:00:40 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Colonialism meant Africans being rounded up from their lands and being locked up in colonial native villages where they would provide slave labor to European farms. Nairobi was a no go zone for africans unless you had evidence that you were employed in the city and even they you could not live with your family in the city. Basically you needed a permit/visa to move from your village. Africans couldn't grow cash crops, couldn't buy land or even take tusker beer. For anyone to say that colonialism was a good thing it shows the level of ignorance about matters colonialism.
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masukuma
#16 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 2:13:24 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
hardwood wrote:
Colonialism meant Africans being rounded up from their lands and being locked up in colonial native villages where they would provide slave labor to European farms. Nairobi was a no go zone for africans unless you had evidence that you were employed in the city and even they you could not live with your family in the city. Basically you needed a permit/visa to move from your village. Africans couldn't grow cash crops, couldn't buy land or even take tusker beer. For anyone to say that colonialism was a good thing it shows the level of ignorance about matters colonialism.






@hardwood, Wachana na hawa watu! they would be locked in their mashambani smoky wooden houses huko kwao. Wazungu came and did what they did and we are happy they went... People never protested Mzunguz coz they thought they would do a better job than them - no! it was for liberty and freedom. What idiocy is this that we are ceding this for some shiny toys? Ati we give them some dry parts of the country - waende kwao... let them look for dry parts of their own countries and do what they want to do. We should not allow them to try and create an Orania here... Africans... who bewitched you? To worship economics and cede freedom?
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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hardwood
#17 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 2:23:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,562
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
2012 wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
Germany's Minister for African affairs believes African countries should lease out land to bodies like EU and World Bank for 50 yrs. These bodies will then build new cities and run them in order to boost economic growth and create jobs. These cities will not be under host country's laws but will have their own independent ones

The idea is to create Hong Kong like enclaves. Hong Kong was under British rule up to 1997 when it was reverted to China.

AU has rejected this idea. Its envoy for infrastructure believes Africa will experience an economic miracle by 2063
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-46017551


Why don't we lease them the uninhabitable parts of Noth Eastern?

But this whole argument means they know what to do with the land and we don't yet information is freely available and we have Kenyans and Africans who have schooled in those developed nations but can't bring the knowledge back. It also means our governments are a joke.


FYI 75% of the beef (and goats) you consume in nairobi comes from north eastern. Those lands mint billions each year via the cattle industry. The lands have their owners and are not "uninhabitable".
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wukan
#18 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 2:50:28 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,654
hardwood wrote:
Colonialism meant Africans being rounded up from their lands and being locked up in colonial native villages where they would provide slave labor to European farms. Colonialism also meant that missionaries came established schools and hospitals, systems of governance, land tenure, the modern economy, it meant infant mortality went down. Why are africans risking everything to travel to Europe? Why are Africans held and auctioned like slaves in Libya? Why did you go to Trumpland?

Nairobi was a no go zone for africans unless you had evidence that you were employed in the city and even they you could not live with your family in the city.Basically you needed a permit/visa to move from your village. There are other parts of Africa other than Nairobi where Africans lived comfortably? Why didn't the native village blossom into cities? Why did Lagos end up as slum city?

Africans couldn't grow cash crops(why produce crops that you don't consume?), couldn't buy land(wrong-Africans bought and sold land) or even take tusker beer(what is special about tusker beer? why not muratina or busaa?). For anyone to say that colonialism was a good thing it shows the level of ignorance about matters colonialism(Don't worry some of us come from strong mau mau heritage and trust me we know the good and bad of colonialism).
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Lolest!
#19 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 4:11:06 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
@Mathokoma, @hardestwoord, what if, in our negotiation with EU, we establish laws in those enclaves encouraging equality but guaranteeing host country citizens of jobs?

Let's prosecute the idea from the point of view of a good humanitarian developer of a new city like Konza not a racist overlord like the Brits were.

From a political point of view, the President who approves this will lose power.
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
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radiomast
#20 Posted : Wednesday, November 28, 2018 5:35:19 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 2/15/2018
Posts: 428
I can't waste time with that bogus post from conquestador. He actually denies that kenyatta was a land grabber or that kenyatta killed his political opponents. He even denies that Nairobi is an infrastructural disaster. I can't discuss with people who chose to deny the obvious.
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