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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,634
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The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/2/2006 Posts: 1,206 Location: Nairobi
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So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. Formally employed people often live their employers' dream & forget about their own.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,634
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bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. When colonial banks were kicking us out of their banking halls in the 90's, because we didn't earn enough, Mwangi stepped in and demonstrated there was money to be made by banking the poor - through volume banking and building relationships with customers. Of course he has since lost this vision but I believe an 'Equity Bank' of mass lending is on the horizon. I predict it will be driven by smart technology, likely humanised by the same close touch relationship banking that Equity pioneered. Kenyans have one of the highest debt repayment rates anywhere, as many Coops and MF's can attest. What they lack is trust and easy credit access to apply this spirit to drive their entrepreneurship. There is a market here if only Banks stop focusing on useless pissing contests with politicians. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/23/2009 Posts: 8,083 Location: Enk are Nyirobi
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bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. We borrow from Saccos at 12% and also pool funds as Chammas. The banks can bank the low risk corporates and paysliped employees. Life is short. Live passionately.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/9/2009 Posts: 2,003
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Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,501 Location: nairobi
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radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/4/2009 Posts: 10,678 Location: NAIROBI
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obiero wrote:radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time For the MPs its personal gain and looking for bribes from bankers Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,501 Location: nairobi
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Ericsson wrote:obiero wrote:radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time For the MPs its personal gain and looking for bribes from bankers You are not making sense. If they were looking for bribes then the motion would not have been tabled in its current form HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,501 Location: nairobi
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Ericsson wrote:obiero wrote:radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time For the MPs its personal gain and looking for bribes from bankers You are not making sense. If they were looking for bribes then the motion would not have been tabled in its current form HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/10/2014 Posts: 969 Location: Kenya
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bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. Treasury bonds rate are at 12.6%, lending to the government will continue. I would also deploy that 10bn capital to other subsidiaries outside Kenya.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2010 Posts: 3,504 Location: Uganda
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Ericsson wrote:obiero wrote:radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time For the MPs its personal gain and looking for bribes from bankers uongo..I support the mps this time.. rate cap iendelee.if everyone watched their credit history, no one would be complaining punda amecheka
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,501 Location: nairobi
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newfarer wrote:Ericsson wrote:obiero wrote:radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time For the MPs its personal gain and looking for bribes from bankers uongo..I support the mps this time.. rate cap iendelee.if everyone watched their credit history, no one would be complaining True HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/23/2014 Posts: 909
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newfarer wrote:Ericsson wrote:obiero wrote:radio wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:The Banks KBA talking points are so lame that most of them no longer bother. It is hard to sustain a victim narrative (poor banks, we are being hurt so bad) when you are on the way to declaring supernormal profits. The new line, which only JM seems to bother spouting is: 'poor Wanjiku, (aside: whom we love to shaft) she will be thrown under a bus unless you remove the Cap' (translation: you have to let us shaft Wanjiku again, please, please, please). For now the MP's, bless them, seem to be seeing right through the BS. I doubt they are that visionary. It must be the loans they have from the banks. Which is good for me too. May they take more loans. Most of the legislative members are learned folk. It's not personal gain at stake but the soul of Kenya. Banks were profiteering for a long time For the MPs its personal gain and looking for bribes from bankers uongo..I support the mps this time.. rate cap iendelee.if everyone watched their credit history, no one would be complaining Once upon a time when banks shafted us with 35% interest, they claimed it was inflation and they needed to clean up the excesses money in the market, now I wonder what lame reason they'll have for withholding lending, considering they have to pay interest on the existing fixed deposits and cover overheads. “You can get in way more trouble with a good idea than a bad idea, because you forget that the good idea has limits.” - Ben Graham
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/23/2008 Posts: 3,017
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bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. What's your problem here, I don't get it. As things stand now, banks are making supernormal profits, no other industry is even close to competing (save for Safaricom). Mark you banks don't even require much in terms of fixed capital outlay, they simply just pay wages (to non specialised employment pools), no other longterm investment is needed, compare this with say KQ that needs to buy 15B aeroplanes, or a cement company that needs to set up capital intensive factory or even a power generation plants that cost 100Bn in initial capital outlay. They have it easy, they should be quietely enjoying their loot and hoping new entrants don't join and share their pie? "The purpose of bureaucracy is to compensate for incompetence and lack of discipline." James Collins
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Rank: Member Joined: 2/20/2007 Posts: 767
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. What's your problem here, I don't get it. As things stand now, banks are making supernormal profits, no other industry is even close to competing (save for Safaricom). Mark you banks don't even require much in terms of fixed capital outlay, they simply just pay wages (to non specialised employment pools), no other longterm investment is needed, compare this with say KQ that needs to buy 15B aeroplanes, or a cement company that needs to set up capital intensive factory or even a power generation plants that cost 100Bn in initial capital outlay. They have it easy, they should be quietely enjoying their loot and hoping new entrants don't join and share their pie? I am just loving this. I remember being castigated here for supporting rate cap using river road economic theory. I just love the proposal that 20% of lending be channelled to sme's and micro businesses. They must find it difficult....... those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority. -G. Massey.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,501 Location: nairobi
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. What's your problem here, I don't get it. As things stand now, banks are making supernormal profits, no other industry is even close to competing (save for Safaricom). Mark you banks don't even require much in terms of fixed capital outlay, they simply just pay wages (to non specialised employment pools), no other longterm investment is needed, compare this with say KQ that needs to buy 15B aeroplanes, or a cement company that needs to set up capital intensive factory or even a power generation plants that cost 100Bn in initial capital outlay. They have it easy, they should be quietely enjoying their loot and hoping new entrants don't join and share their pie? Spot on. Actually if you combine the banking sector profits. They are way larger than the telco.. The fact is banks are reporting profits that should be reported in the SME space. A transfer of reporting in some sort. E.g instead of Shiko Spares reporting a profit, its sent to losses by high interest rates and her car is repossessed and auctioned, the bank books the gain. Wafs Hardware defaults on a secured loan, his land in Vihiga is sold and bank reports it as a profit! Shindwe!! HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/13/2015 Posts: 1,589
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tom_boy wrote:Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. What's your problem here, I don't get it. As things stand now, banks are making supernormal profits, no other industry is even close to competing (save for Safaricom). Mark you banks don't even require much in terms of fixed capital outlay, they simply just pay wages (to non specialised employment pools), no other longterm investment is needed, compare this with say KQ that needs to buy 15B aeroplanes, or a cement company that needs to set up capital intensive factory or even a power generation plants that cost 100Bn in initial capital outlay. They have it easy, they should be quietely enjoying their loot and hoping new entrants don't join and share their pie? I am just loving this. I remember being castigated here for supporting rate cap using river road economic theory. I just love the proposal that 20% of lending be channelled to sme's and micro businesses. Try find out how Zambia is fairing on after their experiment. You cannot repeal the laws of economics Anyway we have discussed this topic ad nauseam.... wacha katambe bora uhai
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/23/2008 Posts: 3,017
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wukan wrote:tom_boy wrote:Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. What's your problem here, I don't get it. As things stand now, banks are making supernormal profits, no other industry is even close to competing (save for Safaricom). Mark you banks don't even require much in terms of fixed capital outlay, they simply just pay wages (to non specialised employment pools), no other longterm investment is needed, compare this with say KQ that needs to buy 15B aeroplanes, or a cement company that needs to set up capital intensive factory or even a power generation plants that cost 100Bn in initial capital outlay. They have it easy, they should be quietely enjoying their loot and hoping new entrants don't join and share their pie? I am just loving this. I remember being castigated here for supporting rate cap using river road economic theory. I just love the proposal that 20% of lending be channelled to sme's and micro businesses. Try find out how Zambia is fairing on after their experiment. You cannot repeal the laws of economics Anyway we have discussed this topic ad nauseam.... wacha katambe bora uhai Firstly, I don't think Zambia's banking sector is comparable to Kenya's. Its quite small and secondly, the health of Zambia's economy is mainly influenced by commodity prices (read minerals) and not their financial sector. I am sure any negative impact to their economy has nothing to do with interest caps. Worth knowing, the restrictions placed on the banking sector as a result of interest rate caps are way less stringent than what the west have on the financial sectors, they may not call such restrictions controls, but in all but name, such are controls, please check the levels of disclosure and compliance banks are required to have with regards to lending and charging of fees, check how they are required by law to price loans. As a result Mainstreet baking in the west make very marginal profits. Here in Kenya, banks are making super-normal profits. Take for instance KCB, they made a PBT of 29B in 2017 from shareholders equity of 106B, note that the SE is inclusive of retained earnings so actual capital outlay would be way less. I am willing to bet less than the PBT for that year. Their net interest margin was 9.1% in 2017. that's a very large gap. We need to squeeze this banks abit more, they still have alot of wiggle room. "The purpose of bureaucracy is to compensate for incompetence and lack of discipline." James Collins
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,501 Location: nairobi
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:wukan wrote:tom_boy wrote:Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:bird_man wrote:So loans at 13% and savings interest at 9%? If you were James Mwangi, would you deploy your 10 Billion capital to earn 4%pa? I have not even included cost of production. What's your problem here, I don't get it. As things stand now, banks are making supernormal profits, no other industry is even close to competing (save for Safaricom). Mark you banks don't even require much in terms of fixed capital outlay, they simply just pay wages (to non specialised employment pools), no other longterm investment is needed, compare this with say KQ that needs to buy 15B aeroplanes, or a cement company that needs to set up capital intensive factory or even a power generation plants that cost 100Bn in initial capital outlay. They have it easy, they should be quietely enjoying their loot and hoping new entrants don't join and share their pie? I am just loving this. I remember being castigated here for supporting rate cap using river road economic theory. I just love the proposal that 20% of lending be channelled to sme's and micro businesses. Try find out how Zambia is fairing on after their experiment. You cannot repeal the laws of economics Anyway we have discussed this topic ad nauseam.... wacha katambe bora uhai Firstly, I don't think Zambia's banking sector is comparable to Kenya's. Its quite small and secondly, the health of Zambia's economy is mainly influenced by commodity prices (read minerals) and not their financial sector. I am sure any negative impact to their economy has nothing to do with interest caps. Worth knowing, the restrictions placed on the banking sector as a result of interest rate caps are way less stringent than what the west have on the financial sectors, they may not call such restrictions controls, but in all but name, such are controls, please check the levels of disclosure and compliance banks are required to have with regards to lending and charging of fees, check how they are required by law to price loans. As a result Mainstreet baking in the west make very marginal profits. Here in Kenya, banks are making super-normal profits. Take for instance KCB, they made a PBT of 29B in 2017 from shareholders equity of 106B, note that the SE is inclusive of retained earnings so actual capital outlay would be way less. I am willing to bet less than the PBT for that year. Their net interest margin was 9.1% in 2017. that's a very large gap. We need to squeeze this banks abit more, they still have alot of wiggle room. Well said HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/13/2015 Posts: 1,589
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote: Firstly, I don't think Zambia's banking sector is comparable to Kenya's. Its quite small and secondly, the health of Zambia's economy is mainly influenced by commodity prices (read minerals) and not their financial sector. I am sure any negative impact to their economy has nothing to do with interest caps.
Worth knowing, the restrictions placed on the banking sector as a result of interest rate caps are way less stringent than what the west have on the financial sectors, they may not call such restrictions controls, but in all but name, such are controls, please check the levels of disclosure and compliance banks are required to have with regards to lending and charging of fees, check how they are required by law to price loans. As a result Mainstreet baking in the west make very marginal profits.
Here in Kenya, banks are making super-normal profits. Take for instance KCB, they made a PBT of 29B in 2017 from shareholders equity of 106B, note that the SE is inclusive of retained earnings so actual capital outlay would be way less. I am willing to bet less than the PBT for that year.
Their net interest margin was 9.1% in 2017. that's a very large gap.
We need to squeeze this banks abit more, they still have alot of wiggle room.
I also want to see this experiment to run its full course. Let's wait and see
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