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Patel Dam in Nakuru
Rank: Elder Joined: 9/19/2015 Posts: 2,871 Location: hapo
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2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? Peasants don't matter in Kenya. They will be given a few buckets of maize and told to accept and move on. Till the next calamity in time for selfies and photo ops. However, the gov't acts swiftly when it comes to Miguna Miguna. So it's balanced. Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/9/2009 Posts: 6,592 Location: Nairobi
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alma1 wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? Peasants don't matter in Kenya. They will be given a few buckets of maize and told to accept and move on. Till the next calamity in time for selfies and photo ops. However, the gov't acts swiftly when it comes to Miguna Miguna. So it's balanced. I think the biggest problem in Kenya is that we have too much hope. The line between hope and hopelessness is non-existant. We have a failed law enforcement system from the enforcers to the 'justice' halls and I'm convinced it's deliberate. How many buildings, bridges, roads etc have collapsed due to poor construction and not one engineer, contractor or owner has been held to account? I think the society needs to find a better way of naming and shaming this evil people as we await for justice to come by boat or something... In a nation that is ran on the backs of the hopes of the poor, politics is the first opium of the masses but one day they will get tired of these camouflage 'handshakes' intrigues. The inbalance between the poor and the rest is to high, estimated at 70%. BBI will solve it :)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2012 Posts: 5,222
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2012 wrote:alma1 wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? Peasants don't matter in Kenya. They will be given a few buckets of maize and told to accept and move on. Till the next calamity in time for selfies and photo ops. However, the gov't acts swiftly when it comes to Miguna Miguna. So it's balanced. I think the biggest problem in Kenya is that we have too much hope. The line between hope and hopelessness is non-existant. We have a failed law enforcement system from the enforcers to the 'justice' halls and I'm convinced it's deliberate. How many buildings, bridges, roads etc have collapsed due to poor construction and not one engineer, contractor or owner has been held to account? I think the society needs to find a better way of naming and shaming this evil people as we await for justice to come by boat or something... In a nation that is ran on the backs of the hopes of the poor, politics is the first opium of the masses but one day they will get tired of these camouflage 'handshakes' intrigues. The inbalance between the poor and the rest is to high, estimated at 70%. I doubt. Kenyans are both docile and illiterate. They are of humble means and can make do with whatever little there is. Couple that with the fact that they are hardworking with little or no time to spare to think. They work hard, as opposed to working smart. All these facts are evident even from the Kenyans who go abroad. Our only hope is a change in our education system. Our colonial masters still govern us through the education system they left. One that we haven't changed. We churn out slaves (job seekers) as opposed to educated entrepreneurs (job creators). When the change takes effect, it is evident. Moreso from people who've enjoyed international exposure. Little revolts do take place, under the guise of tribalism, politics etc. More often than not, its the poor, acting out on their frustrations, that take to violence. These however are inconsequential, the reasons given up above render them null.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,499 Location: nairobi
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hardwood wrote:The killer dam.....looks very jua kali no wonder it caved in. May God rest the souls of the departed. But this country needs God to intervene and soon, so many things are going wrong daily with no one seeming to care HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? If you hire an engineer and contractor to build you a dam, then it collapses, who should take the blame? The engineer and contractor of course. They should even compensate you for the millions you poured on the project. Infact the contractor is required to have insurance to cover any damages emanating from his works. In this case the contractor should pay Patel and all those killed or injured. The engineer and contractor should also be de-registered from their professional bodies. http://www.markham-group...tractor-have-insurance/
In the old days (ancient times) architects, engineers and contractors who built bridges were forced to stand under the bridge when it was being used for the first time so that they could pay with their lives if it collapsed. For domestic houses, an architect was required to surrender his son to be hanged if a clients house collapsed injuring his family. These measures ensured quality workmanship by professionals.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/9/2009 Posts: 6,592 Location: Nairobi
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hardwood wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? If you hire an engineer and contractor to build you a dam, then it collapses, who should take the blame? The engineer and contractor of course. They should even compensate you for the millions you poured on the project. Infact the contractor is required to have insurance to cover any damages emanating from his works. In this case the contractor should pay Patel and all those killed or injured. The engineer and contractor should also be de-registered from their professional bodies. http://www.markham-group...tractor-have-insurance/
In the old days (ancient times) architects, engineers and contractors who built bridges were forced to stand under the bridge when it was being used for the first time so that they could pay with their lives if it collapsed. For domestic houses, an architect was required to surrender his son to be hanged if a clients house collapsed injuring his family. These measures ensured quality workmanship by professionals. Not always. Sometimes there's nothing wrong with the engineering but negligence by the owner after and who knows if they even used a certified engineer or quarks? So let's go the Kenyan way and commission 'speedy investigations' and dump the files in the dust pile. BBI will solve it :)
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/19/2015 Posts: 2,871 Location: hapo
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2012 wrote:hardwood wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? If you hire an engineer and contractor to build you a dam, then it collapses, who should take the blame? The engineer and contractor of course. They should even compensate you for the millions you poured on the project. Infact the contractor is required to have insurance to cover any damages emanating from his works. In this case the contractor should pay Patel and all those killed or injured. The engineer and contractor should also be de-registered from their professional bodies. http://www.markham-group...tractor-have-insurance/
In the old days (ancient times) architects, engineers and contractors who built bridges were forced to stand under the bridge when it was being used for the first time so that they could pay with their lives if it collapsed. For domestic houses, an architect was required to surrender his son to be hanged if a clients house collapsed injuring his family. These measures ensured quality workmanship by professionals. Not always. Sometimes there's nothing wrong with the engineering but negligence by the owner after and who knows if they even used a certified engineer or quarks? So let's go the Kenyan way and commission 'speedy investigations' and dump the files in the dust pile. Patel probably has each and every politician in Nakuru in their pockets. And I mean all of them. I saw all of them on TV talking about "natural disaster" due to heavy rains. So you know where those "investigations" are going to end. What is shocking is that the very people who were harmed by Patel will be same ones who will "kumira kumira, mundu witu" in 2022. Patel builds 6 dams denying them water for years. They are the ones who will tell you that Patel is good since he gives them "free" piped water. Why should you feel sorry for such people? They seem to love the cookie that's been handed to them. Masukuma's model of voting for one's own interest is what these people need. But they will corrupt their need. They will end up "needing", charo nefa mbe. Their true needs are right there. They will instead see the needs of some miraculous fella who shall save all of them together. Sad..But...that's things work in Kenya. Anyway, whats the latest on Miguna? We need to move on from this story chap chap...Too much misery affecting these poor people. Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Many were in their homes watching 7pm news and having supper with their families when the tsunami came. They didn't stand a chance. The force was too much and dig up giant gullies.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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alma1 wrote: What is shocking is that the very people who were harmed by Patel will be same ones who will "kumira kumira, mundu witu" in 2022.
Patel builds 6 dams denying them water for years. They are the ones who will tell you that Patel is good since he gives them "free" piped water.
Why should you feel sorry for such people? They seem to love the cookie that's been handed to them.
Anyway, whats the latest on Miguna? We need to move on from this story chap chap...Too much misery affecting these poor people.
Why bring politics into this? Why do you see politics in everything. Anyway not all the victims may have been kumira-kumira. The flower farm is a magnet for jobs, and the people living in the area are of diverse backgrounds. Quote:Veronica Wanjiku Ngigi, 67, told Reuters that said she was at home brewing tea yesterday evening when her son’s wife rushed in to say the dam had burst and they needed to get to higher ground immediately. Quote:On the fateful Wednesday night, Pius Mzee was chatting with his wife and four children after supper when raging waters stormed into his house. Quote:For 25-year-old George Wanjala, it was a normal evening with his young family. The father of three said he heard a bang but before he could find out what was going on, the water was already filling his house. Quote:Roselyn, 22, was watching television with her husband Gordon Odhiambo, 32, when disaster struck. “We were just watching when we heard a big bang from hills behind our house,” the mother-of-three said. Luckily they survived. https://www.theguardian....?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
https://www.nation.co.ke...526-138hb66z/index.html
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/13/2015 Posts: 1,588
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For the kind of misery visited by the current floods GoK has a really don't care attitude. During El nino floods in 98 Moi looked genuinely concerned compared to the current apathy. Poleni to the people of Solai but let's face it there is simply no dignity in poverty.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Patel was not spared......all the greenhouses have been swept clean.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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What was left of people's homes. Sad. Maji kweli sio mchezo.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/22/2008 Posts: 2,702
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murchr wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? What should happen and why? Kiulizo tu? What happemed to Kengen - Garissa residents when kiambere released its water? For something to happen someone needs to do some leg work. One way of doing this is to follow the legal channels but it takes a lot of work. If there are real lawyers who care about justice this would be a perfect case. Collect all media coverage of the events both print and digital.. I would even go further and collect all raw footage that never made it on air. Send a few people to Solai to interview all people affected. Relatives who lost loved ones, people injured and in hospital, people who lost properties. Well written sworn affidavits. Start collecting local information on everything about that dam. Contractors, engineers, interview everybody who ever worked on that dam or on the farm. Go to any government office and all information from everyone who ever made any communication with the owners about the dam. There is talk that the owner was advised to legalise the dams but he ignored. All these correspondence from any government agency must be collected. All reports by the local people either to police or to whatever authority that made any reports should be collected. When you have all this information you need to retreat for a very long time as you build your case. Wait until things have cooled down for even one year. When you have all your facts and a mountain of evidence look for Judge Odunga and start suing: you will be suing Patel and all government agencies involved. The details may not be exactly as outlined above but the point is you can never make a case effectively without evidence. Kenyans are the laziest people when it comes to gathering evidence because it is a lot of work. If you do your homework and put in the hours there are judges in Kenya now who will be willing to hear you.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Kusadikika wrote:murchr wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? What should happen and why? Kiulizo tu? What happemed to Kengen - Garissa residents when kiambere released its water? For something to happen someone needs to do some leg work. One way of doing this is to follow the legal channels but it takes a lot of work. If there are real lawyers who care about justice this would be a perfect case. Collect all media coverage of the events both print and digital.. I would even go further and collect all raw footage that never made it on air. Send a few people to Solai to interview all people affected. Relatives who lost loved ones, people injured and in hospital, people who lost properties. Well written sworn affidavits. Start collecting local information on everything about that dam. Contractors, engineers, interview everybody who ever worked on that dam or on the farm. Go to any government office and all information from everyone who ever made any communication with the owners about the dam. There is talk that the owner was advised to legalise the dams but he ignored. All these correspondence from any government agency must be collected. All reports by the local people either to police or to whatever authority that made any reports should be collected. When you have all this information you need to retreat for a very long time as you build your case. Wait until things have cooled down for even one year. When you have all your facts and a mountain of evidence look for Judge Odunga and start suing: you will be suing Patel and all government agencies involved. The details may not be exactly as outlined above but the point is you can never make a case effectively without evidence. Kenyans are the laziest people when it comes to gathering evidence because it is a lot of work. If you do your homework and put in the hours there are judges in Kenya now who will be willing to hear you. What is to legalize a dam? And why would you go to the high court in Machakos and not Nakuru? The body that can approve or disapprove an existence of such a dam is Nema, if they approved knowing there are issues with it they and only they can be sued, otherwise even Patel is innocent, he was solving an environmental problem "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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"Patel" blames the weather, nature........eti the heavy rain in ndundori forest carried boulders and trees stumps that were swept into the dam and broke the wall. He says dam was > 20yrs and other dams on the farm are 60yr old. He has been farming there for 70yrs.
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Rank: Member Joined: 7/13/2006 Posts: 94 Location: Nairobi
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Someone at the relevant ministry is sleeping on the job and my guess is as good as yours. Knock hard and it will be opened. Ask and you will be answered. Seek and you shall find.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Murenju wrote:Someone at the relevant ministry is sleeping on the job and my guess is as good as yours.
The ministry guys would have given it "a clean bill of health" if they had inspected before it collapsed.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,499 Location: nairobi
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murchr wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? What should happen and why? Kiulizo tu? What happemed to Kengen - Garissa residents when kiambere released its water? Even the Pipeline flame victims were never compensated. Hapa Kenya ni wewe na mungu wako, though Matiangi directive to controlled emptying of the other dams is in order, for regularization purposes HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/9/2009 Posts: 6,592 Location: Nairobi
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alma1 wrote:2012 wrote:hardwood wrote:2012 wrote:Who wants to bet that nothing will happen to Patel? Who will bet against? If you hire an engineer and contractor to build you a dam, then it collapses, who should take the blame? The engineer and contractor of course. They should even compensate you for the millions you poured on the project. Infact the contractor is required to have insurance to cover any damages emanating from his works. In this case the contractor should pay Patel and all those killed or injured. The engineer and contractor should also be de-registered from their professional bodies. http://www.markham-group...tractor-have-insurance/
In the old days (ancient times) architects, engineers and contractors who built bridges were forced to stand under the bridge when it was being used for the first time so that they could pay with their lives if it collapsed. For domestic houses, an architect was required to surrender his son to be hanged if a clients house collapsed injuring his family. These measures ensured quality workmanship by professionals. Not always. Sometimes there's nothing wrong with the engineering but negligence by the owner after and who knows if they even used a certified engineer or quarks? So let's go the Kenyan way and commission 'speedy investigations' and dump the files in the dust pile. Patel probably has each and every politician in Nakuru in their pockets. And I mean all of them. I saw all of them on TV talking about "natural disaster" due to heavy rains. So you know where those "investigations" are going to end. What is shocking is that the very people who were harmed by Patel will be same ones who will "kumira kumira, mundu witu" in 2022. Patel builds 6 dams denying them water for years. They are the ones who will tell you that Patel is good since he gives them "free" piped water. Why should you feel sorry for such people? They seem to love the cookie that's been handed to them.Masukuma's model of voting for one's own interest is what these people need. But they will corrupt their need. They will end up "needing", charo nefa mbe. Their true needs are right there. They will instead see the needs of some miraculous fella who shall save all of them together. Sad..But...that's things work in Kenya. Anyway, whats the latest on Miguna? We need to move on from this story chap chap...Too much misery affecting these poor people. I feel sorry for them because they don't know better. The system has always worked to keep them poor and desperate for hand outs. I hope they are educating their children because that's the only hope they have. BBI will solve it :)
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