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Cytonn looks to list on GEMS
Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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Angelica _ann wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Chaka wrote:Forgive my ignorance..if a firm joins the NSE via GEMS ,is there a leeway to "upgrade" to a "better" segment later or they will be stuck with GEMS?(choices have consequences)... whiteowl wrote:
Very risky segment You're better off investing in cryptocurrency.At least those goes up and down.The only direction for GEMS is down.
Yap better segment of Directors' bank account!!! @fyatu will give you a first hand experience of GEMS nastiness Wale misungu   I was burnt to recognition after diving head-first into Atlas Development Support Services(ADSS), later known as Atlas Africa Industries. I learn't the hard way that buying the hype(e.g., Chancho project) is for lack of a better word Speculating. Nowadays, my strategy is to evaluate a firm's past earnings first and then do what long-termers call subjective/qualitative analysis with an aim of predicting future earnings and evaluating risk.This involves a lot of research like visiting supermarkets and malls, standing at a shelf where the product is displayed and chatting with supermarket attendants etc. For example, if i wanted to invest in Deacons today i will visit a couple of malls where they have shops e.g., during Easter, Xmas, Endmonth, or any other day when they have a sale and observe foot traffick to the cashier...not foot traffic through the door. I will then ask myself questions about Kenyans future ability to purchase goods from deacons, who the competitors are, who the management is, look at balance sheets for the previous 5 years and also evaluate the macro economics of the country(KE) going forward. Sometimes I also find myself visiting hardware stores, mjengos and even major infrastructure projects and asking schoolboy questions like "where do you buy the cement?". After my experiences with Atlas and Tranny, i have become very serious with where i put my money. Another example is, If Simba cement was to list the same day as Cytonn, i would invest in Simba cement just for the mere fact that i see truckfulls being loaded with Simba cement everyday and my rough guess-timate that the demand of cement will grow at a modest estimate of 6% per annum for the next ten years and also that there is evidence that Simba is well placed in reaping from this demand because they control the value chain from clinker to power production, to finished product. My decision will also be influenced by the NAV, ROE,gross profit margins and other ratios etc. Again, i have to look for the final year reports and find these ratios for myself and then try predict the future earnings.Cytonn seems to be selling the dream. As @VVS has posited, they will hire a firm who will use kizungu mingi to hype their projects which are yet to be launched or yet to start making money(Think home Africa).If you are not careful you will be naswad hook, line and sinker in golden handcuffs forever if you are lucky, but for my case the wakora at Atlas even brought down their website and disappeared without a trace. DISCLAIMER: Nobody can predict the future Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,508 Location: nairobi
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Fyatu wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Chaka wrote:Forgive my ignorance..if a firm joins the NSE via GEMS ,is there a leeway to "upgrade" to a "better" segment later or they will be stuck with GEMS?(choices have consequences)... whiteowl wrote:
Very risky segment You're better off investing in cryptocurrency.At least those goes up and down.The only direction for GEMS is down.
Yap better segment of Directors' bank account!!! @fyatu will give you a first hand experience of GEMS nastiness Wale misungu I was burnt to recognition after diving head-first into Atlas Development Support Services(ADSS), later known as Atlas Africa Industries. I learn't the hard way that buying the hype(e.g., Chancho project) is for lack of a better word Speculating. Nowadays, my strategy is to evaluate a firm's past earnings first and then do what long-termers call subjective/qualitative analysis with an aim of predicting future earnings and evaluating risk.This involves a lot of research like visiting supermarkets and malls, standing at a shelf where the product is displayed and chatting with supermarket attendants etc. For example, if i wanted to invest in Deacons today i will visit a couple of malls where they have shops e.g., during Easter, Xmas, Endmonth, or any other day when they have a sale and observe foot traffick to the cashier...not foot traffic through the door. I will then ask myself questions about Kenyans future ability to purchase goods from deacons, who the competitors are, who the management is, look at balance sheets for the previous 5 years and also evaluate the macro economics of the country(KE) going forward. Sometimes I also find myself visiting hardware stores, mjengos and even major infrastructure projects and asking schoolboy questions like "where do you buy the cement?". After my experiences with Atlas and Tranny, i have become very serious with where i put my money. Another example is, If Simba cement was to list the same day as Cytonn, i would invest in Simba cement just for the mere fact that i see truckfulls being loaded with Simba cement everyday and my rough guess-timate that the demand of cement will grow at a modest estimate of 6% per annum for the next ten years and also that there is evidence that Simba is well placed in reaping from this demand because they control the value chain from clinker to power production, to finished product. My decision will also be influenced by the NAV, ROE,gross profit margins and other ratios etc. Again, i have to look for the final year reports and find these ratios for myself and then try predict the future earnings.Cytonn seems to be selling the dream. As @VVS has posited, they will hire a firm who will use kizungu mingi to hype their projects which are yet to be launched or yet to start making money(Think home Africa).If you are not careful you will be naswad hook, line and sinker in golden handcuffs forever if you are lucky, but for my case the wakora at Atlas even brought down their website and disappeared without a trace. DISCLAIMER: Nobody can predict the future @Fyatu I have read every line of your statement and I feel like framing it in my office under a large plaque, as continued guidance to investors that lack of information is the main difference between the poverty and wealth
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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obiero wrote:Fyatu wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:obiero wrote:Angelica _ann wrote:Chaka wrote:Forgive my ignorance..if a firm joins the NSE via GEMS ,is there a leeway to "upgrade" to a "better" segment later or they will be stuck with GEMS?(choices have consequences)... whiteowl wrote:
Very risky segment You're better off investing in cryptocurrency.At least those goes up and down.The only direction for GEMS is down.
Yap better segment of Directors' bank account!!! @fyatu will give you a first hand experience of GEMS nastiness Wale misungu I was burnt to recognition after diving head-first into Atlas Development Support Services(ADSS), later known as Atlas Africa Industries. I learn't the hard way that buying the hype(e.g., Chancho project) is for lack of a better word Speculating. Nowadays, my strategy is to evaluate a firm's past earnings first and then do what long-termers call subjective/qualitative analysis with an aim of predicting future earnings and evaluating risk.This involves a lot of research like visiting supermarkets and malls, standing at a shelf where the product is displayed and chatting with supermarket attendants etc. For example, if i wanted to invest in Deacons today i will visit a couple of malls where they have shops e.g., during Easter, Xmas, Endmonth, or any other day when they have a sale and observe foot traffick to the cashier...not foot traffic through the door. I will then ask myself questions about Kenyans future ability to purchase goods from deacons, who the competitors are, who the management is, look at balance sheets for the previous 5 years and also evaluate the macro economics of the country(KE) going forward. Sometimes I also find myself visiting hardware stores, mjengos and even major infrastructure projects and asking schoolboy questions like "where do you buy the cement?". After my experiences with Atlas and Tranny, i have become very serious with where i put my money. Another example is, If Simba cement was to list the same day as Cytonn, i would invest in Simba cement just for the mere fact that i see truckfulls being loaded with Simba cement everyday and my rough guess-timate that the demand of cement will grow at a modest estimate of 6% per annum for the next ten years and also that there is evidence that Simba is well placed in reaping from this demand because they control the value chain from clinker to power production, to finished product. My decision will also be influenced by the NAV, ROE,gross profit margins and other ratios etc. Again, i have to look for the final year reports and find these ratios for myself and then try predict the future earnings.Cytonn seems to be selling the dream. As @VVS has posited, they will hire a firm who will use kizungu mingi to hype their projects which are yet to be launched or yet to start making money(Think home Africa).If you are not careful you will be naswad hook, line and sinker in golden handcuffs forever if you are lucky, but for my case the wakora at Atlas even brought down their website and disappeared without a trace. DISCLAIMER: Nobody can predict the future @Fyatu I have read every line of your statement and I feel like framing it in my office under a large plaque, as continued guidance to investors that lack of information is the main difference between the poverty and wealth As they say, experience is the best teacher Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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With wild anticipation and batted breath, I await @Horton's rebuttal to the hereinbelow sentiments by @Fyatu. Fyatu wrote:
I was burnt to (beyond) recognition after diving head-first into Atlas Development Support Services(ADSS), later known as Atlas Africa Industries.
I learn't the hard way that buying the hype (e.g., Chancho project) is for lack of a better word Speculating.
Nowadays, my strategy is to evaluate a firm's past earnings first and then do what long-termers call subjective/qualitative analysis with an aim of predicting future earnings and evaluating risk.
This involves a lot of research like visiting supermarkets and malls, standing at a shelf where the product is displayed and chatting with supermarket attendants etc.
For example, if i wanted to invest in Deacons today i will visit a couple of malls where they have shops e.g., during Easter, Xmas, Endmonth, or any other day when they have a sale and observe foot traffick to the cashier...not foot traffic through the door.
I will then ask myself questions:
about Kenyans future ability to purchase goods from deacons,
who the competitors are,
who the management is,
look at balance sheets for the previous 5 years
and also evaluate the macro economics of the country(KE) going forward.
Sometimes I also find myself visiting hardware stores, mjengos and even major infrastructure projects and asking schoolboy questions like "where do you buy the cement?".
After my experiences with Atlas and Tranny, i have become very serious with where i put my money.
Another example is,
If Simba cement was to list the same day as Cytonn, i would invest in Simba cement just for:
The mere fact that i see truckfulls being loaded with Simba cement everyday
And my rough guess-timate that the demand of cement will grow at a modest estimate of 6% per annum for the next ten years
And also that there is evidence that Simba is well placed in reaping from this demand because they control the value chain from clinker to power production, to finished product.
My decision will also be influenced by the NAV, ROE, gross profit margins and other ratios etc.
Again, i have to look for the final year reports and find these ratios for myself and then try predict the future earnings.
Cytonn seems to be selling the dream.
As @VVS has posited, they will hire a firm who will use kizungu mingi to:
hype their projects which are yet to be launched
or yet to start making money(Think home Africa.
If you are not careful you will be naswad hook, line and sinker in golden handcuffs forever if you are lucky,
(but) for my case the wakora at Atlas even brought down their website and disappeared without a trace.
DISCLAIMER: Nobody can predict the future
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/7/2012 Posts: 11,908
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aemathenge wrote:With wild anticipation and batted breath, I await @Horton's rebuttal to the hereinbelow sentiments by @Fyatu. Fyatu wrote:
I was burnt to (beyond) recognition after diving head-first into Atlas Development Support Services(ADSS), later known as Atlas Africa Industries.
I learn't the hard way that buying the hype (e.g., Chancho project) is for lack of a better word Speculating.
Nowadays, my strategy is to evaluate a firm's past earnings first and then do what long-termers call subjective/qualitative analysis with an aim of predicting future earnings and evaluating risk.
This involves a lot of research like visiting supermarkets and malls, standing at a shelf where the product is displayed and chatting with supermarket attendants etc.
For example, if i wanted to invest in Deacons today i will visit a couple of malls where they have shops e.g., during Easter, Xmas, Endmonth, or any other day when they have a sale and observe foot traffick to the cashier...not foot traffic through the door.
I will then ask myself questions:
about Kenyans future ability to purchase goods from deacons,
who the competitors are,
who the management is,
look at balance sheets for the previous 5 years
and also evaluate the macro economics of the country(KE) going forward.
Sometimes I also find myself visiting hardware stores, mjengos and even major infrastructure projects and asking schoolboy questions like "where do you buy the cement?".
After my experiences with Atlas and Tranny, i have become very serious with where i put my money.
Another example is,
If Simba cement was to list the same day as Cytonn, i would invest in Simba cement just for:
The mere fact that i see truckfulls being loaded with Simba cement everyday
And my rough guess-timate that the demand of cement will grow at a modest estimate of 6% per annum for the next ten years
And also that there is evidence that Simba is well placed in reaping from this demand because they control the value chain from clinker to power production, to finished product.
My decision will also be influenced by the NAV, ROE, gross profit margins and other ratios etc.
Again, i have to look for the final year reports and find these ratios for myself and then try predict the future earnings.
Cytonn seems to be selling the dream.
As @VVS has posited, they will hire a firm who will use kizungu mingi to:
hype their projects which are yet to be launched
or yet to start making money(Think home Africa.
If you are not careful you will be naswad hook, line and sinker in golden handcuffs forever if you are lucky,
(but) for my case the wakora at Atlas even brought down their website and disappeared without a trace.
DISCLAIMER: Nobody can predict the future
Me too  In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2010 Posts: 5,040
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I'm among those surprised that cytonn has survived this long. To me, this rush to list on the stock market is a red flag. What is the hurry, the firm is very new. I feel like they like being visible and letting everyone know that they are there, instead of working quietly and letting their results speak for you. I just dont buy it. For those who are in, i would sell on the listing rally and wait for the dust to settle. we've seen this with home Afrika just recently The investor's chief problem - and even his worst enemy - is likely to be himself
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,508 Location: nairobi
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Aguytrying wrote:I'm among those surprised that cytonn has survived this long. To me, this rush to list on the stock market is a red flag. What is the hurry, the firm is very new. I feel like they like being visible and letting everyone know that they are there, instead of working quietly and letting their results speak for you. I just dont buy it. For those who are in, i would sell on the listing rally and wait for the dust to settle. we've seen this with home Afrika just recently @Aguytrying soo true. its odd that any other person would see it differently. this thing will tank on the first day of listing.. KES 60 is too dear a price
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
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obiero wrote:Aguytrying wrote:I'm among those surprised that cytonn has survived this long. To me, this rush to list on the stock market is a red flag. What is the hurry, the firm is very new. I feel like they like being visible and letting everyone know that they are there, instead of working quietly and letting their results speak for you. I just dont buy it. For those who are in, i would sell on the listing rally and wait for the dust to settle. we've seen this with home Afrika just recently @Aguytrying soo true. its odd that any other person would see it differently. this thing will tank on the first day of listing.. KES 60 is too dear a price Boss we have seen how your shares are doing respectively. Mine are doing well I do good diligent research, not rely on Kahawa tundu 🤣🤣 If it’s not worth your time, move on to other stocks wacheni Kelele ya bure with no facts to back you up
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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Horton wrote:Boss we have seen how your shares are doing respectively. Mine are doing well I do good diligent research, not rely on Kahawa tundu 🤣🤣
If it’s not worth your time, move on to other stocks wacheni Kelele ya bure with no facts to back you up Coward.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,508 Location: nairobi
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aemathenge wrote:Horton wrote:Boss we have seen how your shares are doing respectively. Mine are doing well I do good diligent research, not rely on Kahawa tundu 🤣🤣
If it’s not worth your time, move on to other stocks wacheni Kelele ya bure with no facts to back you up Coward. Tupunguze pressure. All views are welcome.. This is the wazua way of open critique, tukinusa nyani tunasema uvundo upo!
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,102 Location: Nairobi
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@Fyatu  Hard work. Reminds me of what Peter Lynch and Mark Mobius did. On the ground research. Not easy. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: User Joined: 8/15/2013 Posts: 13,237 Location: Vacuum
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aemathenge wrote:Horton wrote:Boss we have seen how your shares are doing respectively. Mine are doing well I do good diligent research, not rely on Kahawa tundu 🤣🤣
If it’s not worth your time, move on to other stocks wacheni Kelele ya bure with no facts to back you up Coward.  If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
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aemathenge wrote:Horton wrote:Boss we have seen how your shares are doing respectively. Mine are doing well I do good diligent research, not rely on Kahawa tundu 🤣🤣
If it’s not worth your time, move on to other stocks wacheni Kelele ya bure with no facts to back you up Coward. NKT
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Rank: User Joined: 8/15/2013 Posts: 13,237 Location: Vacuum
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Aguytrying wrote:I'm among those surprised that cytonn has survived this long. To me, this rush to list on the stock market is a red flag. What is the hurry, the firm is very new. I feel like they like being visible and letting everyone know that they are there, instead of working quietly and letting their results speak for you. I just dont buy it. For those who are in, i would sell on the listing rally and wait for the dust to settle. we've seen this with home Afrika just recently Mimi nko ready kuchomeka na Cytonn...My only regret is not being a cytonnaire earlier enough....It's been close to 3 years since guys here started predicting that the sky was about to fall. If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
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Swenani wrote:Aguytrying wrote:I'm among those surprised that cytonn has survived this long. To me, this rush to list on the stock market is a red flag. What is the hurry, the firm is very new. I feel like they like being visible and letting everyone know that they are there, instead of working quietly and letting their results speak for you. I just dont buy it. For those who are in, i would sell on the listing rally and wait for the dust to settle. we've seen this with home Afrika just recently Mimi nko ready kuchomeka na Cytonn...My only regret is not being a cytonnaire earlier enough....It's been close to 3 years since guys here started predicting that the sky was about to fall. Better late than never. Some of these guys here have been sitting and waiting for Kenya re to ride to the stars 😁😁. I have made 6 times my initial investment in Cytonn. Most watawachwa wakimeza mate!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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VituVingiSana wrote:@Fyatu Hard work. Reminds me of what Peter Lynch and Mark Mobius did. On the ground research. Not easy. Ground research is key. Starting Friday last week 27th April - yesterday 1st May), i have done considerable ground research on FTGH. I was happy to see kids buying Happy's potato crisps for their back to school shopping albeit on a lower scale compared to Tropical heat brands. Haco still dominates hair with Miadi. Heck, even my housegirl from home(ushago...all due respect to my peoples wa ushago) prefers Miadi over Zoe. This is not to say that Zoe was not moving. Next was Longhorn. I visited textbook center in the city and noticed some of their titles were quite popular. I also visited the National Library and noticed a number of shiny(new) longhorn titles. The risk with Longhorn though lies with the future of the book as we know it today(paper form). Do we anticipate a future with no paper books? I don't know how i would be received if for example i went to Baba dogo and requested to meet with Heril Bagera(CEO FTGH) to ask questions about how my business is doing(just like they do in the States).Examples of questions i wish to ask are (1) why do most hardware stores in Githurai and Mlolongo stock Kentank tanks instead of Rino tanks? Are those localities not the market niche for water tanks?...and (2)how the play ground toys business is doing with the mushrooming of Kindergartens built on less than 1/2 acre plots everywhere in the city Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
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Fyatu wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:@Fyatu Hard work. Reminds me of what Peter Lynch and Mark Mobius did. On the ground research. Not easy. Ground research is key. Starting Friday last week 27th April - yesterday 1st May), i have done considerable ground research on FTGH. I was happy to see kids buying Happy's potato crisps for their back to school shopping albeit on a lower scale compared to Tropical heat brands. Haco still dominates hair with Miadi. Heck, even my housegirl from home(ushago...all due respect to my peoples wa ushago) prefers Miadi over Zoe. This is not to say that Zoe was not moving. Next was Longhorn. I visited textbook center in the city and noticed some of their titles were quite popular. I also visited the National Library and noticed a number of shiny(new) longhorn titles. The risk with Longhorn though lies with the future of the book as we know it today(paper form). Do we anticipate a future with no paper books? I don't know how i would be received if for example i went to Baba dogo and requested to meet with Heril Bagera(CEO FTGH) to ask questions about how my business is doing(just like they do in the States). Examples of questions i wish to ask are (1) why do most hardware stores in Githurai and Mlolongo stock Kentank tanks instead of Rino tanks? Are those localities not the market niche for water tanks?...and (2)how the play ground toys business is doing with the mushrooming of Kindergartens built on less than 1/2 acre plots everywhere in the city Way ahead of u sir. I did this with Edwin Dande and the CFO before I bought my shares
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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Horton wrote:aemathenge wrote:Horton wrote:Boss we have seen how your shares are doing respectively. Mine are doing well I do good diligent research, not rely on Kahawa tundu 🤣🤣
If it’s not worth your time, move on to other stocks wacheni Kelele ya bure with no facts to back you up Coward. NKT This is the virtual Republic of Wazua: Serious Talk About Wealth is what this site is about. Cytonn is about to offer their shares to the public. Their reputation, their brand, and their investment is on a pedestal from which they are about to fall from or ascend to a higher one. @Horton is a brand as well as a reputation on this our Virtual Republic from which He/She/It is also about to ascend to a higher pedestal or descend forever into ignominy. @Fyatu, in his infinite wisdom, has shown us the basis upon which this ascent or fall from Grace shall be judged by, not only the Citizens of this Our Virtual Republic, but also the investing public out there. I (We) can understand if @Horton in, his/her/its condescending immaturity, decides to descend into the cesspool of ignominious Citizens who inhabit this Our Virtual Republic. In any case @Impunity, the Resident Male Chauvinist Pig, still trolls the Republic. However, the men and women who toil day and night to make Cytonn a worthy investment do not need to be associated with such ignominy. As such, @Horton, give us a reason to honour, respect, and place your brand on a pedestal respectable investors would admire. Give us tit for tat response to @Fyatu’s view point. Or forever swim in the festering cesspool of cowardly monikers hiding behind a keyboard. So what will it be?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,508 Location: nairobi
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Horton wrote:Fyatu wrote:VituVingiSana wrote:@Fyatu Hard work. Reminds me of what Peter Lynch and Mark Mobius did. On the ground research. Not easy. Ground research is key. Starting Friday last week 27th April - yesterday 1st May), i have done considerable ground research on FTGH. I was happy to see kids buying Happy's potato crisps for their back to school shopping albeit on a lower scale compared to Tropical heat brands. Haco still dominates hair with Miadi. Heck, even my housegirl from home(ushago...all due respect to my peoples wa ushago) prefers Miadi over Zoe. This is not to say that Zoe was not moving. Next was Longhorn. I visited textbook center in the city and noticed some of their titles were quite popular. I also visited the National Library and noticed a number of shiny(new) longhorn titles. The risk with Longhorn though lies with the future of the book as we know it today(paper form). Do we anticipate a future with no paper books? I don't know how i would be received if for example i went to Baba dogo and requested to meet with Heril Bagera(CEO FTGH) to ask questions about how my business is doing(just like they do in the States). Examples of questions i wish to ask are (1) why do most hardware stores in Githurai and Mlolongo stock Kentank tanks instead of Rino tanks? Are those localities not the market niche for water tanks?...and (2)how the play ground toys business is doing with the mushrooming of Kindergartens built on less than 1/2 acre plots everywhere in the city Way ahead of u sir. I did this with Edwin Dande and the CFO before I bought my shares So a goat asks the owner when it will be eaten? How can you honestly seek an objective answer from the quoted individuals
HF 90,000 ABP 3.83; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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obiero wrote:Horton wrote:Way ahead of u sir. I did this with Edwin Dande and the CFO before I bought my shares
So a goat asks the owner when it will be eaten? How can you honestly seek an objective answer from the quoted individuals He fell for a trick we had perfected at FEP. Whenever we encountered a Chairman/ChairLady of a well endowed Chama, we would arrange a meeting with FEP Founder who would proceed to sweet talk him/her into "investing" all their funds with FEP. Worked like a charm.
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