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SGR Progress thus far
Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Impunity wrote:hardwood wrote:Musimo wrote:FRM2011 wrote:Impunity wrote:And now freight charge is halved to only kes.35K for 20 TEU.
Tough times! The latest strategy is to force importers to use SGR. The clearing agents are up in arms. Will most likely end in court. Someone is really trying to paint this white elephant black. One month in operation and the reality is sinking in. David Ndii saw it four years ago. David ndii also told us that upgrading the old line would cure everything (World bank went to the extent of granting one of the companies some loans which are now due and equipment is being sold). Now, remind me how many companies have taken up RVR/old KR from Mombasa to Kampala, and why they never met their end of the deal.... How was govt going to upgrade this one. When your shirt is torn due to age, the best thing is to buy a new one, not more virakas.  It has been done elsewhere and succeeded very well That is what I call a shithole mentality. The cost of fixing that $hit would have been higher than building a brand new sgr.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Fyatu wrote:Impunity wrote:hardwood wrote:Iganamagana wrote:Fyatu wrote:Iganamagana wrote:Fyatu wrote:I am inside(now..yaani sahii) the SGR train towards Mombasa. I must confess that today was a nightmare for most passengers especially the ones that booked online due to the following reasons.
1. There were double bookings for sits(This is totally unacceptable).
2. There was a peculiar ticket printing method whereby you have to queue on for your ticket to be printed by a teller.(lA teller like those in banking halls).IMHO, Kenya railways should let kenyans do this for themselves rather than those moody/hormone overdosed women tellers. 5 minutes to check-in time and Kenyans were still queuing waiting to be served.
3. The washrooms were a disaster. Kinyesi was all over the walls in the toilets. No tissue paper etc. Someone tell Ole itumbi or Alai to tweet/SMS this to Uhuru himself. Choo ni kama public toilets za Nairobi county council...Shame Shame..Someone tell the President that his railway is being mismanaged.
4. The attitude of the train hostess and those people serving food on the train leaves alot to be desired. Wafanyi kazi huko wako na attitude mbaya which stinks of nepotism...They are very rude and arrogant these staff members. Imagine a young lady with two tois told to mop the floor coz one of her kids have poured yoghurt on the floor
5. An elderly mzee i am sitting with says that he thinks that these trains are overstaffed and he believes this is the reason for the inefficiencies. It seems that SGR has become an employment agency for our unqualified/undeserving relathieves who have refused to clean the toilets at the terminus and clean the yogho that kids spill on the train floor.
5.Raising the fare will surely reduce the number of travelers. As @Alma has noted, why should i pay 100 bob to syoks, 1200 to Mombasa, 200 to Mombasa CBD and buy an over priced breakfast (chai na mandazi moja stale) for 200 bob when i can eat my chapati madondo at 100 bob and pay 1200 in Dreamline bus or Simba coach that drops me in Mwembe.
If @Ole itumbi reads this then he should let the powers that be that this is happening to save the situation ASAP otherwise it will be billions down the drain I used the SGR twice last November and did not witness this. The staff were courteous and the only hiccup I faced was that lunch was never served (I was accompanied by children). Of course the snacks were expensive but this was expected and second time travellers were armed with their own. When you buy viazi on the highway, they tend to be more expensive than your local mama mboga. Things must have moved south very fast! Simba couch for me is a no no when there is a flight or SGR option. The accident scenes I have witnessed on that highway coupled with the antics of truck drivers can lead to a heart attack. I have used it today and have just arrived in my rented apartment. I use it at least twice a month to and fro Mombasa. I am talking about what i have observed this month(twice). Something needs to be done soon. The situation needs to be arrested before the situation gets worse. If this is happening under chinese management, what will happen when it is handed in a few yrs time to kiprotich to run? That kinyesi bit in the terminal buildings is sickening if true. How are the toilets onboard the train?Are they clean themselves ?
The kinyesi bit is true story. Some shady Kenyans signed off "I was here" on the walls. On board the train, the toilets are fairly clean but once in a while the uvundo sneaks-in into the coaches.However,during my trip yesterday, a middle-class Kenyan lady warned her 8-10 yrs old daughter not to seat on the toilet seat when the daughter announced she was heading there, suggesting the daughter squatted on the sit and hence high chances of missing and spoiling things for other users. Kenyans are just so uncouth. There's no limit to bad habits, I can bet whoever must have been very proud of themselves. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Q & A from the KR I am a retired citizen. While I congratulate you and indeed the government for the inception of the Standard Gauge Railway (SGR), I would like to know what plans are in place for the resumption of service of the ‘Lunatic Express’ (old railway) that some of us grew up travelling in throughout East Africa. Many people would wish to travel fast on SGR, but many more, including tourists, would like to have the pleasure of travelling in the old slow train after a day’s work as it is a great experience.
Grace Minja, NairobiA: ......... As for the resumption of the “Lunatic Express” service, we have received very many requests like yours from our customers.
We terminated the service on May 2017 since the same had deteriorated to levels that we found to be untenable on account of safety.
The line requires significant investments for it to operate sustainably and safely.
Long distance passenger services have always been subsidised by freight services.
Admittedly, a tourist, or luxury service on “Lunatic Express”, would be very popular and we are keeping that in view as we make the decisions on the assets that have been returned following the collapse of the concession.Q: When should we expect the SGR to reach Kisumu?
Wilson Ouko, NairobiA: The SGR Phase 2A, Nairobi, Naivasha, Narok (Enoosupukia) will be completed by June 2019.
Narok–Kisumu (262kms, Phase 2B) is at financing stage.
The project can be concluded in five years from commencement of construction.
China Exim Bank has expressed its willingness to finance SGR development all the way to Malaba.Q: What happened to the 9am Syokimau Nairobi Commuter Train service? Could it be that SGR is being given priority over city customers?
Mutio Muthoka, Nairobi
A: As observed above, this service was until September 2017 operated by RVR.
The KR has taken over the service and the masterplan is already under way.
Financing identification will be undertaken after the study is completed before the end of 2018.
Further, studies for the extension of the line to JKIA in order to serve airport users and Madaraka Express passengers are complete.
We intend to revamp this service in order to inform further developments of commuter rail services in the city.https://www.nation.co.ke...99876-fu47p8z/index.html"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517
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SHALL WE TELL THE PRESIDENT?WHO WILL BELL THE CAT ?"😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Siringi wrote:SHALL WE TELL THE PRESIDENT?
WHO WILL BELL THE CAT ? Now what nonsence is this "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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Siringi wrote:SHALL WE TELL THE PRESIDENT?
WHO WILL BELL THE CAT ? What is?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517
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Forced use of new railway raises queries among importershttps://www.businessdailyafrica....92980-11r6yg1/index.html"😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517
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murchr wrote:Siringi wrote:SHALL WE TELL THE PRESIDENT?
WHO WILL BELL THE CAT ? Now what nonsence is this @murchr How is the SGR Holding thus far?? Are those around Ouru Telling to him the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth ? Stop the emotions pwana ...tuongelee tu facts and figures... "😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/26/2007 Posts: 6,514
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SGR will happen, at any cost. Fragile egos are at stake, coupled with billions embezzled. Currently, the discounted pricing of a 40 footer to Nairobi with return of empty is $700 by SGR, $950 by road. How long the price concession will last is anyone's guess, but even if they match the price to road, it will survive. Issue is process and max volume. Process is a mess....typical GoK project run by incompetents who got their jobs based on tribe. If process is sorted, I'd risk saying they can charge more than road and still get volumes. Process can be fixed....someday. However, max volume is another story. That conundrum should have been solved before investing, not now after billions have been spent and eaten. Max volume will not allow SGR to be commercially viable. But who says GoK needs return on investment? We can keep paying loans with new loans for projects with zero return and bootlickers call that progress. We're on a road to nowhere
Come on inside
Taking that ride to nowhere
We'll take that ride
I'm feeling okay this morning
And you know
We're on the road to paradise
Here we go, here we goBusiness opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/29/2008 Posts: 1,566
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Siringi wrote:murchr wrote:Siringi wrote:SHALL WE TELL THE PRESIDENT?
WHO WILL BELL THE CAT ? Now what nonsence is this @murchr How is the SGR Holding thus far?? Are those around Ouru Telling to him the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth ? Stop the emotions pwana ...tuongelee tu facts and figures... It's been about.... a year,yeah! Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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KulaRaha wrote:SGR will happen, at any cost. Fragile egos are at stake, coupled with billions embezzled.
Currently, the discounted pricing of a 40 footer to Nairobi with return of empty is $700 by SGR, $950 by road.
How long the price concession will last is anyone's guess, but even if they match the price to road, it will survive.
Issue is process and max volume.
Process is a mess....typical GoK project run by incompetents who got their jobs based on tribe. If process is sorted, I'd risk saying they can charge more than road and still get volumes. Process can be fixed....someday.
However, max volume is another story. That conundrum should have been solved before investing, not now after billions have been spent and eaten. Max volume will not allow SGR to be commercially viable.
But who says GoK needs return on investment? We can keep paying loans with new loans for projects with zero return and bootlickers call that progress.
We're on a road to nowhere
Come on inside
Taking that ride to nowhere
We'll take that ride
I'm feeling okay this morning
And you know
We're on the road to paradise
Here we go, here we go We need roads, railways, airports to move people and goods. It's never about a profit or return on investment. It's basic infrastructure and its the governments job to build infrastructure, from highways, railways to dirt roads in the villages. Also its interesting how everyone was complaining that the kenya govt has never built even an inch of railway since independence. And now after building a modern reli everyone is complaining. Mpaka importers would rather use expensive road and be stuck in 3-day jams on mombasa road than use the cheap reli. Infact the govt should declare that all cargo be hauled by sgr to save billions in mombasa road maintenance. Just like oil is transported via pipeline.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/13/2015 Posts: 1,590
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Siringi wrote:SHALL WE TELL THE PRESIDENT?
WHO WILL BELL THE CAT ? The problem with business plans they rarely survive the first day of contact with market forces  Quote:At the outset, the country had planned to haul 4,000 tonnes per trip, peaking at 16,000 tonnes daily; 106,000 tonnes weekly and 5.5 million tonnes annually to break even and repay its construction and operational costs.
But, at the current 12,452 tonnes per week, the SGR will have hauled on average, a mere 647,504 tonnes by the end of the year, casting doubt on the viability of the project. http://www.theeastafrica...27638-k1o6ya/index.html
Quote:Here are the highlights of the loans Kenya borrowed from China to build the SGR.
There was a commercial loan of $1.633 billion and a concessionary loan of $1.6 billion. These two were signed and committed in May 2014. Another $1.6 billion for the Nairobi-Naivasha section of the SGR was committed in December 2015.
And we are in the middle of negotiating $4.8 billion to take the line from Naivasha to Kisumu and on to Malaba.
What are the terms?
First, a fixed term of 15 years, inclusive of a grace period of five years. Second, interest of six months of the London Inter-Bank Offered Rate (Libor) plus 360 basis points. This comes to about four per cent of principal.
Third, a management fee of 0.75 per cent payable up-front plus a commitment fee of 0.75 per cent of the undisbursed amount. Finally, insurance from the China Export and Credit Insurance Corporation (Sinosure) at a premium of 6.93 per cent, payable in two instalments.
INTEREST RATE
Therefore, the all-inclusive cost of servicing the Chinese loans comes to an effective interest rate of 12.5 per cent.
When they tell you that Chinese loans are cheap, they are engaged in utter deception. https://www.nation.co.ke...31090-evmdvfz/index.html
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517
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LINK: LONG ON PROMISE SHORT ON DELIVERY - SGR MAKES LITTLE IMPACT ON COUNTIES IT TRAVERSES
Is it too early or are critics being too harsh or were we sold a sick monkey ?
"😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Writer of article is very myopic. So he wanted people to build kiosks along the reli and have hawkers selling to sgr travelers like they do to bus passengers? What madness is that?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/20/2011 Posts: 1,820 Location: Nakuru
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I think it is too early. Lets wait and see when it reaches the other side of Nairobi(Naivasha, Narok, Kisumu) or what i call the real bara(i.e., Bara for upcountry) where population is big and communities a bit aggresive and where travel to and from ushago is very important as opposed to leisure travel to mombasa. Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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Cartels are working hard to discredit the sgr. So importers wouldn't use the sgr even if it was free, they would rather pay 80k by road? It started with the bus owner cartels discrediting the sgr, now we have truck and CFS cartels doing the same. http://www.theeastafrica...27638-k1o6ya/index.html
Quote:
William Ojonyo, chairman of the Kenya International Freight and Warehousing Association told The East African in Mombasa that achieving the requisite (cargo volume) numbers will be a tough task “even if they decide to offer the freight services for free.”
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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The cartels are really complaining....very selfish. http://www.theeastafrica...27638-k1o6ya/index.html
Quote:But the Kenya government last month directed that all imports coming in through the Mombasa port be transported by the SGR, setting off a round of protests from businesses.
“We arrived at this decision after consulting with other players, including container freight station (CFS) owners, and agreed to have goods moved by train,” said Kenya Railways managing director, Atanas Maina.
At the port, CFS owners and the clearing and forwarding agents, say such orders will kill their business, as importers will have to liaise with new service providers to access the Embakasi ICD.
“Initially, we agreed to have the Nairobi CFS mainly handle such cargo as raw materials and industrial inputs. Now that they have ordered all un-nominated cargo to be transported by the rail, thereby putting our businesses at risk,” said James Rarieya, the chairman of the CFS Association.
The CFS came into operation a decade ago in a bid to ease congestion at Mombasa port, which saw ships charged for delayed cargo deliveries, and these costs passed on to clients.
“Our business is made on volumes moved from port to customers’ premises and that is why the government directive is hitting our bottom line hard. We attract clients by not only charging less on storage but also giving incentives. It is seamless when we work with clearing agents and it is this wholesome package that endears us to clients,” Mr Rarieya said.
But Kenya Railways deny intending to kill this element of logistics services, saying that they are only shifting a point of cargo handling.
“The Nairobi ICD cannot handle the 28 million tonnes. We still have a lot of opportunities for them to do business and I am certain that the CFS owners have identified opportunities at the Nairobi facility too,” Mr Maina said.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/26/2007 Posts: 6,514
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hardwood wrote:KulaRaha wrote:SGR will happen, at any cost. Fragile egos are at stake, coupled with billions embezzled.
Currently, the discounted pricing of a 40 footer to Nairobi with return of empty is $700 by SGR, $950 by road.
How long the price concession will last is anyone's guess, but even if they match the price to road, it will survive.
Issue is process and max volume.
Process is a mess....typical GoK project run by incompetents who got their jobs based on tribe. If process is sorted, I'd risk saying they can charge more than road and still get volumes. Process can be fixed....someday.
However, max volume is another story. That conundrum should have been solved before investing, not now after billions have been spent and eaten. Max volume will not allow SGR to be commercially viable.
But who says GoK needs return on investment? We can keep paying loans with new loans for projects with zero return and bootlickers call that progress.
We're on a road to nowhere
Come on inside
Taking that ride to nowhere
We'll take that ride
I'm feeling okay this morning
And you know
We're on the road to paradise
Here we go, here we go We need roads, railways, airports to move people and goods. It's never about a profit or return on investment. It's basic infrastructure and its the governments job to build infrastructure, from highways, railways to dirt roads in the villages. Also its interesting how everyone was complaining that the kenya govt has never built even an inch of railway since independence. And now after building a modern reli everyone is complaining. Mpaka importers would rather use expensive road and be stuck in 3-day jams on mombasa road than use the cheap reli. Infact the govt should declare that all cargo be hauled by sgr to save billions in mombasa road maintenance. Just like oil is transported via pipeline. 5 year grace period, and 15 year tenor. That means we should be handing over the port to China sometime in 2022? Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/8/2013 Posts: 2,517
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HOUSTON WE HAVE A PROBLEM ==>SGR-cargo-volumes-cast-doubt-on-its-viability"😖😡KQ makes money for everyone except the shareholder 😏😏 " overheard in Wazua
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Is this what you were trying to say with your font 50 post? Yes the Cargo uptake has been slow actually in its first 3months I saw a Nairobi bound train virtually empty on Sat while trucks were spewing diesel fumes on the msa road traffic. Kenya has a big problem - Cartels, its not easy to fight with the likes of Joho and govt employees who are hell bent on frastrating everything. Kuna watu wameamua kukula wata kula but lets see how that battle ends up. So if you are not part of the eating club you should not be celebrating. You will pay for the rail and every additional "tax" imposed by cartels. Reli inafika Uganda like it or not.   The biggest saboteurs of GOK efforts are guys sitting at Times tower. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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