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SGR Progress thus far
Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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UpcomingPaperChaser wrote:I have 2 issues here:
1. It is not true that Mariakani handles 2500 trucks daily. 2500 trucks daily translate to 2 trucks every minute. This is not practically possible in Kenya, in fact at the weighbridge, one truck always takes about 5 to 10 minutes.
2. SGR will greatly ease traffic congestion on our roads. Roads are usually destryoed by heavy cargo. We will incurr less in road repairs and maintenance.
3. It might not seem feasible to make profits right now with SGR but wait till the train reaches Busia border. I can assure you, all those ugandans, rwandans, burundians and congolese will never use lorries from mombasa to busia as they will prefer SGR due to speed and cheaper costs. @Upcoming. This is how the weighbridge works. Basically there are two lights. Green & Red. For light cargo, the truck gets green and they just drive through. They don't have to weigh at the main weighbridge. If a truck gets red, they weigh all the axles proper. Two things then happen; 1. If all axles check,then the truck is cleared. Takes less than 3 minutes. 2. In case of overload, then they wait at the detention bay clearing way for others to continue weighing. So it's true. The weighbridge can handle over 2,000 containers per day. By your calculation, it would seem the weighbridge handles 284 trucks only, per day. About easing congestion, we are all for that. If it makes business sense. On Congo , Uganda and the rest, it would be a shame to burden Kenyans with such an expensive project just to benefit others directly and not ourselves.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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murchr wrote:FRM2011 wrote:mkeiy wrote:murchr wrote:FRM2011 wrote:mkeiy wrote:FRM2011 wrote:https://www.businessdail...9844-lyshtkz/index.html
Speaking to the Business Daily Wednesday, Kenya Railways managing director Atanas Maina said the locomotive will instead arrive on Thursday because it’s not filled to capacity.
“The second cargo train which was expected to arrive in Nairobi today from Mombasa will arrive tomorrow because it is not full,” said Mr Maina."
The above scenario had been predicted by one of our own members here called @kysse. She is an insider in logistics. I suspect she is with one of the top logistics firms. Either DHL, Bollore or Kuehne+Nagel. Madam @kysse, if you are there. Now is the time to guide the discourse on this forum with an insider view. Why on earth would the SGR lack cargo on the second day of operations ? @FRM2011. I am not @kysse,but we spoke then and no one would listen. When we raised the issues, the sycophants were on our case. Thing is, most of us importers based in Nairobi, we indicate on the Bill of Lading that our shipments' final destination is Mombasa. With that simple act, those shipments cannot be loaded on the SGR. Until that changes,only the big firms/orgs whose shipments may have their final destination as Nairobi will have their shipments loaded on SGR for Nairobi. Until we(small importers but the majority) know what's in for us, not so many will change shipping instructions on their BLs, for reasons we raised when SGR passenger was launched. Why would I pay more and have to wait for longer? Thank you. I was hoping someone like you would speak up. An insider with a very clear understanding of the dynamics in the logistics sector. Glad too that @mkimwa has weighed in. An actual player in the industry. If we removed our political goggles briefly, we would all agree that they day SGR makes business sense to the importers and exporters, trucking will die a natural death. Until then........ Do any of you think the Lunatic express made any business sense on the first month of operation? Nasarites need to relax and prepare to swear the President and Vice President of NASA or is it NRM? @Murchr. Acha siasa. Hii ni biashara. You got to do better than that. Address the issues economically and wait to politick come 2022. Do you honestly think if the issues raised are not addressed, with passage of TIME ONLY,we'll all start using a more expensive & slower alternative? HOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If so,sing some more about your political masters. In business, we'll have our say.  Its funny the standard response to any critic of the SGR is always that we are NASA supporters. Business people are the most pragmatic of all creatures. Even an ardent supporter of Jubilee will only use SGR when it makes business sense. Your analysis are always wrong, and its true you are Nasarites. The same way you naysayers were complaining about Thika rd. @Murchr & @FRM2011. Tuache siasa kwa hii SGR Cargo. Have you guys seen this? SGR struggles for cargo.The struggle is real. The sooner they address the issues, the better for all.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,330 Location: Masada
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Why must it weight to fill up the entire train? It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo. Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers. Nkt Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/8/2008 Posts: 1,575
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mkeiy wrote:Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc. Which business breaks even on the second day? I care!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/2/2009 Posts: 26,330 Location: Masada
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mkeiy wrote:Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc. Let them bring goods kidogo kidogo as they arrive. We will make profit later Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.
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Rank: Member Joined: 10/26/2008 Posts: 380
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mkeiy wrote:UpcomingPaperChaser wrote:I have 2 issues here:
1. It is not true that Mariakani handles 2500 trucks daily. 2500 trucks daily translate to 2 trucks every minute. This is not practically possible in Kenya, in fact at the weighbridge, one truck always takes about 5 to 10 minutes.
2. SGR will greatly ease traffic congestion on our roads. Roads are usually destryoed by heavy cargo. We will incurr less in road repairs and maintenance.
3. It might not seem feasible to make profits right now with SGR but wait till the train reaches Busia border. I can assure you, all those ugandans, rwandans, burundians and congolese will never use lorries from mombasa to busia as they will prefer SGR due to speed and cheaper costs. @Upcoming. This is how the weighbridge works. Basically there are two lights. Green & Red. For light cargo, the truck gets green and they just drive through. They don't have to weigh at the main weighbridge. If a truck gets red, they weigh all the axles proper. Two things then happen; 1. If all axles check,then the truck is cleared. Takes less than 3 minutes. 2. In case of overload, then they wait at the detention bay clearing way for others to continue weighing. So it's true. The weighbridge can handle over 2,000 containers per day. By your calculation, it would seem the weighbridge handles 284 trucks only, per day. About easing congestion, we are all for that. If it makes business sense. On Congo , Uganda and the rest, it would be a shame to burden Kenyans with such an expensive project just to benefit others directly and not ourselves. With the automatic weighing-in-Motion scales deployed at Mariakani, Mlolongo, Gilgil and Webuye weighbridges, the vehicle is weighed on the move on the road. If its fully compliant with the axle load regulations, a green light is shown with its number plates, and it proceeds with the journey, without even entering the weighbridge. If its not compliant, either on the gross vehicle weight or per axle weight regulations, then a red light is shown and the vehicle enters the weighbridge for manual weight verification - and the process mkeiy described above applies. The percentage of vehicles that need to go into the weighbridge, is normally less than 20%. This process is the same for all vehicles over 3 tonnes, light-cargo or heavy-cargo ones. Overall, the process is faster than a truck going over a bump. I think Mlolongo weighbridge has over 9000 trucks per day at times.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/29/2011 Posts: 2,242
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mkeiy wrote:Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc. Public enterprises like railways, water works, sewers etc are not motivated by profit but public good. What the cargo rail cab best do is develop a schedule and move whatever is available. No trader will wait for the train to get full to transport his container whereas there is a truck waiting to deliver same day at a marginal cost difference "Things that matter most must never be at the mercy of things that matter least." Goethe
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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Gathige wrote:mkeiy wrote:Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc. Public enterprises like railways, water works, sewers etc are not motivated by profit but public good. What the cargo rail cab best do is develop a schedule and move whatever is available. No trader will wait for the train to get full to transport his container whereas there is a truck waiting to deliver same day at a marginal cost difference Railway is unlike the others you have mentioned. It's not a basic amenity hence it must sustain itself by making money.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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SGR has released the new subsidized rates. 64K for 20-foot and 84K for 40-foot. https://www.the-star.co....onth-flat-rate_c1694702
@mkeiy and @mkimwa. Kindly explain to Wazuans how those figures compare with the truckers. Factor in last mile trip as we.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/26/2007 Posts: 6,514
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The whole premise for SGR was cargo, not passengers. If cargo doesn't work...SGR has failed. Current rate is 80k from Mombasa to Nairobi door to door, return is extra. This rate of 64k may work, since return is included. Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 3/27/2009 Posts: 1,437
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KulaRaha wrote:The whole premise for SGR was cargo, not passengers. If cargo doesn't work...SGR has failed.
Current rate is 80k from Mombasa to Nairobi door to door, return is extra.
This rate of 64k may work, since return is included. This is the subsidized rate according to KR. When does the commercial rate kick in?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/29/2011 Posts: 2,242
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mkeiy wrote:Gathige wrote:mkeiy wrote:Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc. Public enterprises like railways, water works, sewers etc are not motivated by profit but public good. What the cargo rail cab best do is develop a schedule and move whatever is available. No trader will wait for the train to get full to transport his container whereas there is a truck waiting to deliver same day at a marginal cost difference Railway is unlike the others you have mentioned. It's not a basic amenity hence it must sustain itself by making money. The ones that make money are the operators who run wagons/Cabins on the tracks owned by states. "Things that matter most must never be at the mercy of things that matter least." Goethe
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/28/2015 Posts: 9,562 Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
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https://www.businessdail...56176-9kjspy/index.html
Quote:The first consignment of 52 export containers ferried on the standard gauge railway (SGR) arrived at the Mombasa port on Monday.
Kenya Railways managing director Atanas Maina said most of the containers were exports by logistics firm Bolore Africa.
“Bolore has 48 containers loaded with coffee and French beans while the others belong to three companies and contain wood carvings and animal skins,” he told the Business Daily in a telephone interview.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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FRM2011 wrote:SGR has released the new subsidized rates. 64K for 20-foot and 84K for 40-foot. https://www.the-star.co....onth-flat-rate_c1694702
@mkeiy and @mkimwa. Kindly explain to Wazuans how those figures compare with the truckers. Factor in last mile trip as we. @FRM. Poorly. Truckers charge about 90k for a 40ft,return. The 84k rate from SGR means you top another 20k or so to get the container at your door. A total of about 104k.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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hardwood wrote:https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/news/First-52-export-containers-of-SGR-cargo-arrive-at-port/539546-4256176-9kjspy/index.html Quote:The first consignment of 52 export containers ferried on the standard gauge railway (SGR) arrived at the Mombasa port on Monday.
Kenya Railways managing director Atanas Maina said most of the containers were exports by logistics firm Bolore Africa.
“Bolore has 48 containers loaded with coffee and French beans while the others belong to three companies and contain wood carvings and animal skins,” he told the Business Daily in a telephone interview. A good start. However,in order to taste the broth, get hold of Bolore or DHL and get a quote for a 40ft container from Msa to Nai(door step) and report back here. All in all, some positive progress.
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Rank: Member Joined: 1/27/2012 Posts: 851 Location: Nairobi
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Gathige wrote:mkeiy wrote:Gathige wrote:mkeiy wrote:Impunity wrote:Why must it weight to fill up the entire train?
It should bring home whatever it gets and the volume will build up mdogo mdogo.
Let the train come to Nairobi even with 30 containers...no need to wait for 104 plus containers.
Nkt It will be a loss-making trip in that case. It's like driving a bus from Msa to Nai with only 20 or so passengers and 40 empty seats. Kwani ni charity? Moving on. Can you imagine the agony of the importers whose shipments have been lying on the tracks all that long and have no idea how long it will take before they get their goods? Lost business, demurrage, penalties, loss of exporters' trust,etc,etc. Public enterprises like railways, water works, sewers etc are not motivated by profit but public good. What the cargo rail cab best do is develop a schedule and move whatever is available. No trader will wait for the train to get full to transport his container whereas there is a truck waiting to deliver same day at a marginal cost difference Railway is unlike the others you have mentioned. It's not a basic amenity hence it must sustain itself by making money. The ones that make money are the operators who run wagons/Cabins on the tracks owned by states. Which operators then? Isn't the contracted Chinese the operator in our case? The one you are saying should bring empty wagons and not have to wait? If I may ask you, why is SGR more expensive than tracking on the road? In my thinking, it should be cheaper.
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 326 Location: Nairobi
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UpcomingPaperChaser wrote:Was involved in this project sometime back.
1. The route had already been decided on...the only challenge that existed was Maxwell along Magadi Road..... it was re-aligned.
2. Work is ongoing in Tuala, Rangau, Kandisi, Tunnel, Mai Mahiu
3. Its different companies tasked with different sections, so every team sorts its matters independently. Who can help out with precise location of 'intermediate freight exchange and passenger stations' especially in Ngong and Ongata Rongai? Upcoming....?
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/15/2010 Posts: 455 Location: Nairobi
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wa P wrote:UpcomingPaperChaser wrote:Was involved in this project sometime back.
1. The route had already been decided on...the only challenge that existed was Maxwell along Magadi Road..... it was re-aligned.
2. Work is ongoing in Tuala, Rangau, Kandisi, Tunnel, Mai Mahiu
3. Its different companies tasked with different sections, so every team sorts its matters independently. Who can help out with precise location of 'intermediate freight exchange and passenger stations' especially in Ngong and Ongata Rongai? Upcoming....? @Wa P. In Ongata Rongai, there will be two stations, 1. Tuala area ( not sure about exact location). 2. Kambi Moto (Accessed via Rimpa - Ole Kasasi Rd, 4 Km from Magadi road or a shortcut road which is opposite Fatima Hosp, joining Ole Kasasi Rd, 2 Km from Magadi road). ....He who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion..
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Rank: Member Joined: 5/26/2009 Posts: 326 Location: Nairobi
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tinker wrote:wa P wrote:UpcomingPaperChaser wrote:Was involved in this project sometime back.
1. The route had already been decided on...the only challenge that existed was Maxwell along Magadi Road..... it was re-aligned.
2. Work is ongoing in Tuala, Rangau, Kandisi, Tunnel, Mai Mahiu
3. Its different companies tasked with different sections, so every team sorts its matters independently. Who can help out with precise location of 'intermediate freight exchange and passenger stations' especially in Ngong and Ongata Rongai? Upcoming....? @Wa P. In Ongata Rongai, there will be two stations, 1. Tuala area ( not sure about exact location). 2. Kambi Moto (Accessed via Rimpa - Ole Kasasi Rd, 4 Km from Magadi road or a shortcut road which is opposite Fatima Hosp, joining Ole Kasasi Rd, 2 Km from Magadi road). Thank you, @tinker. Wondering if the stations will be separate for passenger and freight/ cargo; and what are the upsides in having a freight terminal in O.Rongai. Some investors wish to put up a export-centric plant for light technical products best freighted to port by train (low volume, high value); proximity to freight terminal is desired. Also proximity to Nairobi city, the urban labor pool and access to airport are key drivers(Suswa/ Naivasha/ Mai Mahiu not desired).
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