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Fresh PORK elections in 60 days – as ordered by SCORK.
Ngalaka
#1 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 12:34:28 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,566
Lets consider the ramifications.

We have 59 days within which to prepare and hold a fresh election following Supreme Court orders of yesterday as they nullified 8817 presidential election results.

Subsequently, as a nation we got issues!

Time is of the essence.

At this stage, we are working with very limited details as given/not given by the Supreme Court in regard to the whys, hows and the whats exactly contributed to the wanting integrity of the process that are significant enough to cause doubt to the overall integrity of the final result.

In view of the above, regardless of our individual political persuasions we have some homework to deal with.

As patriotic and responsible citizens we need to ask ourselves;

- Is it reasonable to expect an overhaul of IEBC before the election inside 59 days.

- Is calling for removal of IEBC commissioners, the CEO and other high ranking Secretariat staff justifiable at this stage!

- Did Uhuru’s utterances of yesterday - during his impromptu public rally - amount to a direct threat, to unleash political pressure on SCORK if he is re-elected!

- Will the procurement process for ballot paper result in endless contestations and acrimony!

- Are we likely to be faced with multiple law suits filed by politicians and or their cohorts, targeted at IEBC in relation to preparations for this poll – bogging the electoral body down!

- Arising from time constraints, the IEBC should start the preparations for the poll immediately, but in the absence of the detailed ruling, they are essentially groping in the dark. Once that detailed ruling is out, possibly in 20 days, the IEBC might have to re-set their preparations – a possible further loss of time!

- Since IEBC has to hire a multitude of new staff every time there is a countrywide poll, does it mean that a few mistakes by ‘some’ presiding officers (PO) - the persons handling forms 34A,- might result to nullification of Presidential elections!

- What happens if one of the major coalitions sticks to the demand that the IEBC commissioners, the CEO, the head of ICT dept etc, must be removed or otherwise not be involved in this fresh poll. Suppose those officers in return refuse to go and demand to be removed as per law established!

- Is there a chance that the outcome of the fresh election might end up being even messier in similar or even more varied ways than the nullified one!

- If that be so, what position would the Supreme Court take after someone places a petition before them seeking a nullification of the fresh poll they ordered!! Would it be tenable for them to call for a further! What an awkward position would that be for them and by extension, the Country!

- Suppose all goes as per plan, do we expect a fundamentally different result from what was declared by IEBC on 11th Aug 2017, and is SCORK reputation unwittingly predicated on that!
...
...
And so on and so forth.





Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
Lolest!
#2 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 1:09:08 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Add something that impacts Kenyans more directly

KCSE and KCPE and schools calendar
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Ryko
#3 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 2:01:11 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/27/2016
Posts: 274
Location: Pub
Since the November elections will not be perfect will Orengo go back to court? Yes (i suspect it will be messier). Will Uhuru again lose (i suspect yes)

Hopeless Democratic Kenyans
I work so I can afford the amount of alcohol required to continue going to work
freiks
#4 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 2:32:34 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 6/8/2010
Posts: 1,732
On 8817 mountainers and the valleyors came out to vote with fear when kaloozer said they will have to lie low like envelope. NASAlites have gone to court and what kaloozer said has been vindicated and we have lied low like envelopes, when we wake up from that slumber in the next 59 days something will have to give in
Life is an endless adventure
limanika
#5 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 3:26:42 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 2,032
Ryko wrote:
Since the November elections will not be perfect will Orengo go back to court? Yes (i suspect it will be messier). Will Uhuru again lose (i suspect yes)

Hopeless Democratic Kenyans

Now, that is ridiculous, or were all fools. If democracy can't work are there options
murchr
#6 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 3:46:52 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
Wakoracourts
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
limanika
#7 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 8:07:27 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 2,032
That the SC can annul an election without giving the reasons, or summary of the same, and yet everyone is supposed to obey the order without questions asked, shows theres something wrong in our laws. Parliament is squarely at fault here for failing to enact supportive n comprehensive legislation to guide conduct of presidential election petitions
safariant
#8 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 9:05:03 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 9/9/2010
Posts: 784
Location: ant hill - red hill
limanApplause ika wrote:
That the SC can annul an election without giving the reasons, or summary of the same, and yet everyone is supposed to obey the order without questions asked, shows theres something wrong in our laws. Parliament is squarely at fault here for failing to enact supportive n comprehensive legislation to guide conduct of presidential election petitions


Applause Applause Applause
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alma1
#9 Posted : Saturday, September 02, 2017 9:11:56 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/19/2015
Posts: 2,871
Location: hapo
limanika wrote:
That the SC can annul an election without giving the reasons, or summary of the same, and yet everyone is supposed to obey the order without questions asked, shows theres something wrong in our laws. Parliament is squarely at fault here for failing to enact supportive n comprehensive legislation to guide conduct of presidential election petitions


This is the reason Jubilee is insisting on free education in secondary school. Obviously many of us fell through the cracks.

Ati what?
Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?

Rahatupu
#10 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 12:25:07 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 1,982
Location: matano manne
limanika wrote:
That the SC can annul an election without giving the reasons, or summary of the same, and yet everyone is supposed to obey the order without questions asked, shows theres something wrong in our laws. Parliament is squarely at fault here for failing to enact supportive n comprehensive legislation to guide conduct of presidential election petitions


They gave a 2 minutes decision and say comprehensive ruling will be out after 21 days. Yet second respondent who is severely reprimanded is expected to oversee the repeat elections with new directions per the court corrections. Doesn't add up
Ngalaka
#11 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 12:36:52 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,566
We are where we are.

Both Jubilee and NASA must now draw their budget to fund their campaigns for the new poll.
What outlook do we have for each!

There is expected some defections back and forth, by politicians who lost in 8817 elections. Who is likely to be the net gainer!

In mind here I have Khalwale, Musila, Munya, Isaac Rutto, Kidero, Chirau Makwere, Kabogo and the caboodle.

There is also the question of regions reviewing their positions – Ukambani, Kisii, Western etc.
I wonder if the declared results of 8817 elections as a whole (presidential, Gubernatorial, Senatorial MPs etc) might influence voters’ choices including apathy.
Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
kiash
#12 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 1:38:14 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/27/2010
Posts: 951
Location: Nyumbani
My worry is seeing how Uhunye was angry and how he talked, "tungewaonyesha cha mtema kuni" i wonder what would happen if he looses in the new election. He would not give away the power considering he won the first election.
So the best option will be for Raila to loose, even if he does, people in Kisumu and Mbasa + Mathare and Kibera will burn tyres and fall down as a result of "stray bullets"
and then after sometime cool down. Why, the economic effect. Anza na mboga na nyanya and then move to Unga. Then they will discover that their people up there will still go back to their homes in Karen and Runda after the street struggle.
If that does not happen, then a rough time is ahead.
Cv254K
#13 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 4:07:13 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 9/2/2017
Posts: 31
Hard to understand Jubilee's "SCORK-attack" strategy. What is the upside? Many downsides.
a) Strongholds' voter turnout? - Can be achieved by their other strategy - that voters wao (even if a misquotation) waliitwa vifaranga. Vifaranga strategy can achieve same effect without alienating supporters in battlegrounds. Has already been tested in Nakuru.
b) Timing - If the SCORK majority were not to show how flawed process obliterated the "lead" in their scheduled comprehensive judgment, I am sure they will now show how. With a conclusion and errors in the process, you can show anything. A better timing for the SCORK-attack strategy would be after the comprehensive ruling. In that case they would only need to dig for errors in NASA areas and then craft the propaganda that SCORK colluded with NASA to rule on process because NASA sabotaged the process.
c) They lose the usual "respect institutions" retort.


Euge
#14 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 4:25:16 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 8/4/2008
Posts: 2,849
Location: Rupi
Cv254K wrote:
Hard to understand Jubilee's "SCORK-attack" strategy. What is the upside? Many downsides.
a) Strongholds' voter turnout? - Can be achieved by their other strategy - that voters wao (even if a misquotation) waliitwa vifaranga. Vifaranga strategy can achieve same effect without alienating supporters in battlegrounds. Has already been tested in Nakuru.
b) Timing - If the SCORK majority were not to show how flawed process obliterated the "lead" in their scheduled comprehensive judgment, I am sure they will now show how. With a conclusion and errors in the process, you can show anything. A better timing for the SCORK-attack strategy would be after the comprehensive ruling. In that case they would only need to dig for errors in NASA areas and then craft the propaganda that SCORK colluded with NASA to rule on process because NASA sabotaged the process.
c) They lose the usual "respect institutions" retort.



I think they are shocked at the outcome and are throwing tantrums. Its unnecessary. From where I sit, they will win this thing. They just need to get people to turn out and vote. They have the tyranny
Lord, thank you!
sitaki.kujulikana
#15 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 4:35:30 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/25/2012
Posts: 1,826
Euge wrote:
Cv254K wrote:
Hard to understand Jubilee's "SCORK-attack" strategy. What is the upside? Many downsides.
a) Strongholds' voter turnout? - Can be achieved by their other strategy - that voters wao (even if a misquotation) waliitwa vifaranga. Vifaranga strategy can achieve same effect without alienating supporters in battlegrounds. Has already been tested in Nakuru.
b) Timing - If the SCORK majority were not to show how flawed process obliterated the "lead" in their scheduled comprehensive judgment, I am sure they will now show how. With a conclusion and errors in the process, you can show anything. A better timing for the SCORK-attack strategy would be after the comprehensive ruling. In that case they would only need to dig for errors in NASA areas and then craft the propaganda that SCORK colluded with NASA to rule on process because NASA sabotaged the process.
c) They lose the usual "respect institutions" retort.



I think they are shocked at the outcome and are throwing tantrums. Its unnecessary. From where I sit, they will win this thing. They just need to get people to turn out and vote. They have the tyranny

of course we are assuming and this being a forum for just discussing stuff, my take is that they know what they are doing, and I don't think the anti maranga rhetoric will stop, they are basically trying to push a narrative that maranga does not regard their vote and hoping people will come back to prove maranga wrong.

Remember they just need the same people who voted for them to come out again, and the maranga story might be used for that.
Njung'e
#16 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 4:43:49 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/7/2007
Posts: 11,935
Location: Nairobi
Uhuru awache hasira ndogo ndogo. The ruling is in the past and there is not much he can do. He must also understand that the supreme court, just like all other independent bodies,are ours and the only ones we have and they should be respected regardless. He should also know that there are many Kenyans who drink, including myself, but are disciplined enough to know when to hit the bottle and what to do thereafter. Like old man Atwoli, I support the call for Uhuru to sober up. It's very annoying to see him in that stateSad Sad Sad

http://nairobinews.natio...-up-atwoli-tells-uhuru/
Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
ForSport2
#17 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 4:49:14 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 12/9/2015
Posts: 47
Location: +254
safariant wrote:
limanApplause ika wrote:
That the SC can annul an election without giving the reasons, or summary of the same, and yet everyone is supposed to obey the order without questions asked, shows theres something wrong in our laws. Parliament is squarely at fault here for failing to enact supportive n comprehensive legislation to guide conduct of presidential election petitions


Applause Applause Applause


This is provided for in the in the law.
Look at Rule 23 of the Supreme Court (Presidential Petition) Rules 2017

The court in 2013 also provided the full reasoned judgement later. The summary reasons for both the outcome and dissents were given. Their order I think is simply follow the standards which are set out in the law.
Ngalaka
#18 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 5:47:09 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,566
ForSport2 wrote:
safariant wrote:
limanApplause ika wrote:
That the SC can annul an election without giving the reasons, or summary of the same, and yet everyone is supposed to obey the order without questions asked, shows theres something wrong in our laws. Parliament is squarely at fault here for failing to enact supportive n comprehensive legislation to guide conduct of presidential election petitions


Applause Applause Applause


This is provided for in the in the law.
Look at Rule 23 of the Supreme Court (Presidential Petition) Rules 2017

The court in 2013 also provided the full reasoned judgement later. The summary reasons for both the outcome and dissents were given. Their order I think is simply follow the standards which are set out in the law.

Given the import of their decision, there was need to clarify this.
Hope they will do the clarification in their full judgement which should come asap.
Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
wukan
#19 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 6:09:26 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,633
Cv254K wrote:
Hard to understand Jubilee's "SCORK-attack" strategy. What is the upside? Many downsides.
a) Strongholds' voter turnout? - Can be achieved by their other strategy - that voters wao (even if a misquotation) waliitwa vifaranga. Vifaranga strategy can achieve same effect without alienating supporters in battlegrounds. Has already been tested in Nakuru.
b) Timing - If the SCORK majority were not to show how flawed process obliterated the "lead" in their scheduled comprehensive judgment, I am sure they will now show how. With a conclusion and errors in the process, you can show anything. A better timing for the SCORK-attack strategy would be after the comprehensive ruling. In that case they would only need to dig for errors in NASA areas and then craft the propaganda that SCORK colluded with NASA to rule on process because NASA sabotaged the process.
c) They lose the usual "respect institutions" retort.




I think the aim is to create a frenzy in the strongholds, raise the tension so high that the only option on the table for the loser is a concession speech for the sake of peace. Picture this Oct 31st and Baba calls pressie and says once again for the 5th time kimeibiwo.Pray Pray Pray

As for SCORK they need to learn from the Us supreme court during Roosevelt era. There were 4 judges who decided to scuttle the new deal and kept declaring all legislation under the new deal unconstitutional. Roosevelt went on a campaign again the supreme court. The 4 judges were labeled "four horsemen of the apocalypse". With a clear majority in senate and congress, Roosevelt came up with the court-packing bill to appoint new judges to replace the 4 old ones. Eventually it's the supreme court that backed down. That's the reason in the US before appointment the judges are thoroughly vetted for ideological leanings.

The worst thing is even parliament is unconstitutional because of 2/3 gender rule. I don't see how judiciary wants to take on the executive and legislature. At least with the politicians we can get rid off them every five years. Our judiciary also needs to back down on the activism angle. They are over-reaching here.
Ngalaka
#20 Posted : Sunday, September 03, 2017 6:44:39 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,566
One thing seems certain if Uhuru or is it when Uhuru is re-elected he will call for a referendum to fix certain clauses in the Constitution.

For instance, were it not for the constraints of stringent timelines that left SCORK no leeway at all, the Judges would have otherwise ordered a recount of the ballot and spared the Country the agony of having to go through an electioneering period with the attendant inconveniences, cost issues, tensions, disruptions, etc.

He might also be tempted to use the referendum to target the judiciary as he has been threatening which would be unfortunate.
Someone needs to give him some sound advice in this area.
Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
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