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2017 PEV Orchestration
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Njung'e
#21 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 11:51:36 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/7/2007
Posts: 11,935
Location: Nairobi
Use of live ammunition on citizens is wrong and unacceptable even at times when the said protesters are quite unreasonable. I think the police have other civil and reasonable ways of handling the protesters. How about locking down the affected slums and man the roads to and from with roadblocks? Allow only peaceful residents in and out. The rest of the town dwellers will go about their business as usual. If the slum dwellers decide to destroy and burn down their infrastructure like they have done with Olympic Primary School, allow them to.
Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
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tycho
#22 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 12:08:45 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Nandwa wrote:
Mubebelezano uishe.
Let RAO be told the naked truth.
The people who are dying as a result of the ill advised chaotic protests are squarely due to him - RAO.

Why is it taboo to tell RAO the hard truth!


And what is this truth? That Raila lost 'fairly'? How much do we know about this?

Consider this other 'truth'. The courts are the best suited to determine the truth.

But what happens in instances where 'truth' threatens the status quo and the imminent change is deemed too costly, even by some of those who are to determine the truth?

I'd like to use the example of the ICC cases against the now president elect and his deputy. Considering the lobbying and jockeying that was evident, the ICC had to consider the threat to its existence and it's probable that this was an influence in how the court decided to deal with the cases.

The big question now is how we can negotiate truth in a pluralist society, and also how and whether this truth can be enforced or effected.

We lose it when we define the problem simply as, 'Raila'.
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tycho
#23 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 12:13:48 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Njung'e wrote:
Use of live ammunition on citizens is wrong and unacceptable even at times when the said protesters are quite unreasonable. I think the police have other civil and reasonable ways of handling the protesters. How about locking down the affected slums and man the roads to and from with roadblocks? Allow only peaceful residents in and out. The rest of the town dwellers will go about their business as usual. If the slum dwellers decide to destroy and burn down their infrastructure like they have done with Olympic Primary School, allow them to.


Like in say, 'Gaza'?

Try and find out whether there are areas referred to as 'Gaza' here in Kenya, and why those places are given those names.

So far, many of us seem to be okay with reasoning out what's happening, but when can we start thinking?
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AlphDoti
#24 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 12:32:06 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
Bigchick wrote:
When Orengo says 100+killed, ask him for evidence. When he says rigging ask for evidence? When he says go to the streets ask where are his kids and family in the line up. Only you can stop the madness.

As long as they stone cops then a bullet will fly back.

To see someone who claim to be enlightened talk like this know we're doomed.

Reporters arrested. Police block other journalists from covering protests. The you have the guts to ask for evidence? Are you serious when you ask that?

And FYI, before you ask, I am not a Luo. Why does it matter the tribe anyway. Tribalism in your heart again?
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AlphDoti
#25 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 12:34:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
@Bigchick and the rest of the like...

The most crucial part of stealing/killing is to erase evidence that can incriminate you in court. But to God, our hearts, the evidence will not be erased.
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Wakanyugi
#26 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 12:50:21 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 7/3/2007
Posts: 1,635
tycho wrote:
Nandwa wrote:
Mubebelezano uishe.
Let RAO be told the naked truth.
The people who are dying as a result of the ill advised chaotic protests are squarely due to him - RAO.

Why is it taboo to tell RAO the hard truth!


And what is this truth? That Raila lost 'fairly'? How much do we know about this?

Consider this other 'truth'. The courts are the best suited to determine the truth.

But what happens in instances where 'truth' threatens the status quo and the imminent change is deemed too costly, even by some of those who are to determine the truth?

I'd like to use the example of the ICC cases against the now president elect and his deputy. Considering the lobbying and jockeying that was evident, the ICC had to consider the threat to its existence and it's probable that this was an influence in how the court decided to deal with the cases.

The big question now is how we can negotiate truth in a pluralist society, and also how and whether this truth can be enforced or effected.

We lose it when we define the problem simply as, 'Raila'.



Sorry Tycho but you and I part ways here.

A true leader is known when things are going bad, not just when sycophants are massaging his ego.

If Raila can convince 6 million Kenyans to vote for him, he can convince a few misled youth not to die for him, as many of them are deluded into thinking. So far he has done no such thing. Granted he will lose face in doing so, but are the lives of our young people less important than his ego?

Our country will get now where if we can not hold those we apoint to lead us to account.
"The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
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Mtu Biz
#27 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 12:58:13 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 1/16/2007
Posts: 1,320

If we can all step back from reacting to each other's comments maybe some light can be shed for both the 'winners' and 'losers'.

Is it fair or just to ask.. on what is the assertion that 'the election was stolen' based on?

Can the basis of that assertion be interrogated?

Yes or No?




Sola Scriptura
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majimaji
#28 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 1:02:14 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 4/4/2007
Posts: 1,162
Mtu Biz wrote:

If we can all step back from reacting to each other's comments maybe some light can be shed for both the 'winners' and 'losers'.

Is it fair or just to ask.. on what is the assertion that 'the election was stolen' based on?

Can the basis of that assertion be interrogated?

Yes or No?






No. And that is why the man says the courts are not an option. In my view, he missed the ICC bus last time but this time round he is very insistent on boarding. Where is Bensouda when you need her?
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Nandwa
#29 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 1:10:04 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/17/2009
Posts: 1,049
Mtu Biz wrote:

If we can all step back from reacting to each other's comments maybe some light can be shed for both the 'winners' and 'losers'.

Is it fair or just to ask.. on what is the assertion that 'the election was stolen' based on?

Can the basis of that assertion be interrogated?

Yes or No?





'Njaa mingi' - 5yrs waitLaughing out loudly
You are not likely to hear any cogent rationale!
Its a nusu mkate zero game - dont introduce logic here!
Just as absolute power corrupts leaders, so does absolute fanaticism blind the people from logic
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Bigchick
#30 Posted : Monday, August 14, 2017 1:12:32 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/8/2013
Posts: 4,068
Location: At Large.
AlphDoti wrote:
Bigchick wrote:
When Orengo says 100+killed, ask him for evidence. When he says rigging ask for evidence? When he says go to the streets ask where are his kids and family in the line up. Only you can stop the madness.

As long as they stone cops then a bullet will fly back.

To see someone who claim to be enlightened talk like this know we're doomed.

Reporters arrested. Police block other journalists from covering protests. The you have the guts to ask for evidence? Are you serious when you ask that?

And FYI, before you ask, I am not a Luo. Why does it matter the tribe anyway. Tribalism in your heart again?



So evidence is only from reporters and journalists.Evidence is required for us to get the truth.How come KNHRC have 24.

Please read the context with which the "Luo tribe question"came in.
Love is beautiful and so are those who share it.With Love, Marriage is an amazing event in ones life time, the foundation of joy, happiness and success.
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