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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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aemathenge wrote:FRM2011 wrote:Relief food bought with our tax money and some ugly b*#*h is threatening not to give the starving residents of mbeere until they first register as voters. CC. @Masukuma. Inherent or otherwise (let us not go there) possession of that piece of paper is a matter of life and death for the next thirty six days or so in the "strongholds". i am still wondering where i lost you! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/9/2006 Posts: 1,502
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I still maintain voting should be a privileged to only taxpayers. work to prosper
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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Tokyo wrote:I still maintain voting should be a privileged to only taxpayers. a meritocracy of sorts - sio? been there...done that! the current model we have is the best model EVER that gives great results in the long term. if you want quick results on shaky ground - go for meritocracies, oligocracies, aristocracies e.t.c. if you want sustainable growth - you know what to do! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/14/2006 Posts: 1,311
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Tokyo wrote:I still maintain voting should be a privileged to only taxpayers. What do you mean exactly? I thought everyone who buys products and services in Kenya pays some tax. E.g. VAT
How would you go about registering. People to vote? Should limited companies and parastatals also be allowed to vote if they pay taxes?
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Rank: Chief Joined: 5/9/2007 Posts: 13,095
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Now RAO says his number too has a companion. Manual backup tu ndio solution. #1 Posted :masukuma = Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:46:39 PM wrote: Anyang Nyongo is paranoid - he things each time something goes wrong its a scheme to rig the elections. the BVR machines have been preloaded with data from the old register - that's why old voters just need to confirm their details and have new data added (biodata and biometric). if your ID number returns someone else its not that the IEBC is scheming to disenfranchise you but rather that there are indeed individuals that have been allocated the same ID number and thus if both had registered last time there is no guarantee which will show up. Please note the existence of multiple persons sharing ID numbers is not the fault of the IEBC but rather the ministry of home affairs.
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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murchr wrote:Now RAO says his number too has a companion. Manual backup tu ndio solution. #1 Posted :masukuma = Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:46:39 PM wrote: Anyang Nyongo is paranoid - he things each time something goes wrong its a scheme to rig the elections. the BVR machines have been preloaded with data from the old register - that's why old voters just need to confirm their details and have new data added (biodata and biometric). if your ID number returns someone else its not that the IEBC is scheming to disenfranchise you but rather that there are indeed individuals that have been allocated the same ID number and thus if both had registered last time there is no guarantee which will show up. Please note the existence of multiple persons sharing ID numbers is not the fault of the IEBC but rather the ministry of home affairs.
ID number is not useful bwana!! why are people missing the point? it's a photo register! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/19/2015 Posts: 2,871 Location: hapo
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Now that's what we call a unique ID number Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?
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Rank: User Joined: 8/15/2013 Posts: 13,237 Location: Vacuum
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If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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@masukuma, your opinion on the new developments. What's the matter with shared IDs ? How did the database accept shared IDs ?
And why is the IEBC such a hopeless communicator ? It's an election year and we know how dicey things can get.
Why would KPMG dirty its hands in the voter register issues ? Now the only thing some folks are seeing is the ( ethnic) name of the CEO.
What's the best way to do a clean-up to everyone's satisfaction ?
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Rank: Member Joined: 9/2/2010 Posts: 563 Location: Embakasi
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FRM2011 wrote: @masukuma, your opinion on the new developments. What's the matter with shared IDs ? How did the database accept shared IDs ?
And why is the IEBC such a hopeless communicator ? It's an election year and we know how dicey things can get.
Why would KPMG dirty its hands in the voter register issues ? Now the only thing some folks are seeing is the ( ethnic) name of the CEO.
What's the best way to do a clean-up to everyone's satisfaction ?
I saw a picture of the system, it seems that IEBC have not used the ID number as the primary key in the database, this would reject duplicates. I suspect IEBC anticipated errors in data capture and avoided using it as the primary key in case it locked voters out due to the errors. What they should have done is integrate it with the national register so that IEBC clerks and voters can search in real-time and confirm the ID number matches the particulars of the one registering. In a place where thought is abandoned, freedom can become a curse.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/29/2008 Posts: 1,566
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FRM2011 wrote: @masukuma, your opinion on the new developments. What's the matter with shared IDs ? How did the database accept shared IDs ?
And why is the IEBC such a hopeless communicator ? It's an election year and we know how dicey things can get.
Why would KPMG dirty its hands in the voter register issues ? Now the only thing some folks are seeing is the ( ethnic) name of the CEO.
What's the best way to do a clean-up to everyone's satisfaction ?
Following that 'wisdom' IEBC Chair and CEO are from an opposition zone! So, is the allegation that IEBC is working with the Auditors to cheat the opposition!! I remain firmly of the opinion that key opposition politicians have their eyes on something else other than free and fair election! Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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grolut wrote:FRM2011 wrote: @masukuma, your opinion on the new developments. What's the matter with shared IDs ? How did the database accept shared IDs ?
And why is the IEBC such a hopeless communicator ? It's an election year and we know how dicey things can get.
Why would KPMG dirty its hands in the voter register issues ? Now the only thing some folks are seeing is the ( ethnic) name of the CEO.
What's the best way to do a clean-up to everyone's satisfaction ?
I saw a picture of the system, it seems that IEBC have not used the ID number as the primary key in the database, this would reject duplicates. I suspect IEBC anticipated errors in data capture and avoided using it as the primary key in case it locked voters out due to the errors. What they should have done is integrate it with the national register so that IEBC clerks and voters can search in real-time and confirm the ID number matches the particulars of the one registering. let me ask a basic question... anyone can answer!! WHO TOLD YOU THE ID NUMBER IS UNIQUE?anyone is free to answer!! secondly, IF THE ID NUMBER UNIQUELY IDENTIFIES YOU - WHY GO BUY A 9 BILLION SHILLING SYSTEM TO CAPTURE BIOMETRICS?Access could have handled it!! #MythBusting!! All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/3/2014 Posts: 1,063
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masukuma wrote:grolut wrote:FRM2011 wrote: @masukuma, your opinion on the new developments. What's the matter with shared IDs ? How did the database accept shared IDs ?
And why is the IEBC such a hopeless communicator ? It's an election year and we know how dicey things can get.
Why would KPMG dirty its hands in the voter register issues ? Now the only thing some folks are seeing is the ( ethnic) name of the CEO.
What's the best way to do a clean-up to everyone's satisfaction ?
I saw a picture of the system, it seems that IEBC have not used the ID number as the primary key in the database, this would reject duplicates. I suspect IEBC anticipated errors in data capture and avoided using it as the primary key in case it locked voters out due to the errors. What they should have done is integrate it with the national register so that IEBC clerks and voters can search in real-time and confirm the ID number matches the particulars of the one registering. let me ask a basic question... anyone can answer!! WHO TOLD YOU THE ID NUMBER IS UNIQUE?anyone is free to answer!! secondly, IF THE ID NUMBER UNIQUELY IDENTIFIES YOU - WHY GO BUY A 9 BILLION SHILLING SYSTEM TO CAPTURE BIOMETRICS?Access could have handled it!! #MythBusting!! Why is the 9B system failing to detect the dublication of the ID Numbers? Why not use a centralised database which checks if the ID number has been registered? How difficult is it to write a code that ensure the ID number is only used once?If you try to reenter gives an error. Why does immigration department issue IDs with similar numbers? Consistency is better than intensity
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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PeterReborn wrote:masukuma wrote:grolut wrote:FRM2011 wrote: @masukuma, your opinion on the new developments. What's the matter with shared IDs ? How did the database accept shared IDs ?
And why is the IEBC such a hopeless communicator ? It's an election year and we know how dicey things can get.
Why would KPMG dirty its hands in the voter register issues ? Now the only thing some folks are seeing is the ( ethnic) name of the CEO.
What's the best way to do a clean-up to everyone's satisfaction ?
I saw a picture of the system, it seems that IEBC have not used the ID number as the primary key in the database, this would reject duplicates. I suspect IEBC anticipated errors in data capture and avoided using it as the primary key in case it locked voters out due to the errors. What they should have done is integrate it with the national register so that IEBC clerks and voters can search in real-time and confirm the ID number matches the particulars of the one registering. let me ask a basic question... anyone can answer!! WHO TOLD YOU THE ID NUMBER IS UNIQUE?anyone is free to answer!! secondly, IF THE ID NUMBER UNIQUELY IDENTIFIES YOU - WHY GO BUY A 9 BILLION SHILLING SYSTEM TO CAPTURE BIOMETRICS?Access could have handled it!! #MythBusting!! Why is the 9B system failing to detect the dublication of the ID Numbers?Why not use a centralised database which checks if the ID number has been registered? How difficult is it to write a code that ensure the ID number is only used once?If you try to reenter gives an error. Why does immigration department issue IDs with similar numbers? What do you mean by saying "failing to detect dublication" The system knows ID numbers are not unique so its just returning a value that was entered in the system. If anything its the same system that tells you that you share a number with someone else and can tell how many people share the entity called ID numbers. Which is NOT a primary key in this database. The only unique variable in this database is the voter id number, so ID number here is as random as the your name. Lakini @masukush, hii database hamna foreign key? My peni mbili is to avoid this confusion, once someone attains the age of 18, the govt should issue them with an ID, voters card, and optional driving licence after test. The registrar of persons needs to get serious. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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PeterReborn wrote: Why is the 9B system failing to detect the dublication of the ID Numbers? Why not use a centralised database which checks if the ID number has been registered? How difficult is it to write a code that ensure the ID number is only used once?If you try to reenter gives an error. Why does NRB issue IDs with similar numbers?
that is the bigger question! everything else feeds from it!! you cannot refuse to register someone because NOTE THE TERMS HERE - his/her ID card has a number that has been issued to someone else. You refer those cases to the issuing authority! It's not IEBC's job to determine whether one number is shared UNTIL it gets told by the issuing authority that it's the case and my question was.... I REPEAT!! WHO TOLD YOU THE ID NUMBER IS UNIQUE?has the issuing authority (NRB) come out and said - YES, THEY ARE UNIQUE? and even if they do - IEBC cannot restrict data collection because "your ID number has been used" - what if it's the fraudster who registered first? the best way to handle this is - collect all the data and SEND IT to the ISSUING AUTHORITY and ask them... who between these two persons (or 3) is have you allocated the ID number to? sio mambo na primary keys, unqiue keys... those are database basics!! you apply technology to solve a problem. duplication is not a problem for an overwhelming majority of the cases but when it comes to elections and laws (private sector people listen up - you are the guys that always line up 'solutions' every 5 years to do BLAH BLAH BLAH) the thing you have has to work on 100% of the cases. if you decide to make ID numbers primary then - 1) you need written down assurances from the issuer of the document that they don't issue out duplicated ID Numbers 2) you need a process in place to determine which is valid in the case two occur. remember one can be a result of data capture errors... kwani? and so I go back to my question WHO TOLD YOU THE ID NUMBER IS UNIQUE?All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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by the way - no one says figuring out duplicates is a problem. that is trivial - the biggest question is WHAT TO DO WITH THEM? my point in all this is the notion that the ID Number on your ID card just belongs to you and is guaranteed to just belong to you is naive and actually a urban legend. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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masukuma wrote:by the way - no one says figuring out duplicates is a problem. that is trivial - the biggest question is WHAT TO DO WITH THEM? my point in all this is the notion that the ID Number on your ID card just belongs to you and is guaranteed to just belong to you is naive and actually a urban legend.
In a perfect world, your ID number should be unique since it is a citizens identifier. Look at it from the perspective of a database that contains the identities of the people of this republic. (Now this is my assumption) In creating a voters register the ID is only useful for the purposes of identification and can only be religiously useful if clean data is ported from the national registry that said, your ID is not really useful for voting as long as you have a voters card and your biometrics were/are captured. Now on a serious note, Kenya iko shida mingi sana ata data management kwa serikal iko na itilafu....pesa za wazee zina peanwa aje? "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore .
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
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murchr wrote:(Now this is my assumption) your ID is not really useful for voting as long as you have a voters card .... @Masukuma vehemently and categorically disagrees.
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