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Apostle William Samoei Ruto
Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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http://www.nation.co.ke/...26512-o2lm1s/index.html
@maka, your services are needed here. We need to break this thing down. The moment I saw constitutional lawyer, wachira maina, is part of the defence team, I knew this will be interesting. I hear they intend to unleash the NIS dossier on PeV to pin wsr down.
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Rank: Member Joined: 2/24/2010 Posts: 637 Location: Nairobi
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FRM2011 wrote:http://www.nation.co.ke/news/case-against-activist-could-turn-fatal-/1056-3426512-o2lm1s/index.html
@maka, your services are needed here. We need to break this thing down. The moment I saw constitutional lawyer, wachira maina, is part of the defence team, I knew this will be interesting.
I hear they intend to unleash the NIS dossier on PeV to pin wsr down. On this his legal team misled him or rather he bit more than he can chew. The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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keraka wrote:FRM2011 wrote:http://www.nation.co.ke/news/case-against-activist-could-turn-fatal-/1056-3426512-o2lm1s/index.html
@maka, your services are needed here. We need to break this thing down. The moment I saw constitutional lawyer, wachira maina, is part of the defence team, I knew this will be interesting.
I hear they intend to unleash the NIS dossier on PeV to pin wsr down. On this his legal team misled him or rather he bit more than he can chew. You dont need to wait for maka. Ever heard of "Double Jeopardy"? So anything NIS dossier on PEV is purely garbage. Mwangi would only win IF Ruto threatened him. And he should prove that...hii ingine ni cinema tu. The law is clear. Wacha ma lawyer wakule pesa and as for Gitobu, the publicity is highly needed. He will be in the news for a while before running for some office in Meru. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/22/2010 Posts: 11,522 Location: Nairobi
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keraka wrote:FRM2011 wrote:http://www.nation.co.ke/news/case-against-activist-could-turn-fatal-/1056-3426512-o2lm1s/index.html
@maka, your services are needed here. We need to break this thing down. The moment I saw constitutional lawyer, wachira maina, is part of the defence team, I knew this will be interesting.
I hear they intend to unleash the NIS dossier on PeV to pin wsr down. On this his legal team misled him or rather he bit more than he can chew.  possunt quia posse videntur
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Rank: Member Joined: 10/23/2007 Posts: 604
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Mwangi has lost it. Hearsay is not admissible in court.
He has to prove Ruto killed Jacob Juma. Period. Issues of Muteshi, Langata School, KPA land is nonsense. The counter-suit is just a commercial-break.
Implicating someone in murder is a serious allegation, it is not the same as calling someone a chicken thief.
Wakili ni wale wale. They went to law school to earn money and any fool is a welcome client.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/1/2009 Posts: 1,884
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Coolbull wrote:Mwangi has lost it. Hearsay is not admissible in court.
He has to prove Ruto killed Jacob Juma. Period. Issues of Muteshi, Langata School, KPA land is nonsense. The counter-suit is just a commercial-break.
Implicating someone in murder is a serious allegation, it is not the same as calling someone a chicken thief.
Wakili ni wale wale. They went to law school to earn money and any fool is a welcome client. boniface mwangi probably knows exactly what he is doing. this is not a criminal case but a civil one. so what if ruto wins? i don't see the high awards for libel of days past being awarded to ruto here. but assuming he is awarded say kes 50m. so what? boniface mwangi would simply apply for bankruptcy and avoid paying. or go to civil jail for 3 months and come out. or use this to get a political asylum outside kenya. and this won't even deter others on social media from similar talks. apart from the above, the counter claim by boniface mwangi is not just a commercial-break. if indeed it is true then we have a case where both may succeed and would have an effect on the damages awarded to each - maybe even materially affect the same.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 9/19/2015 Posts: 2,871 Location: hapo
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mkenyan wrote:Coolbull wrote:Mwangi has lost it. Hearsay is not admissible in court.
He has to prove Ruto killed Jacob Juma. Period. Issues of Muteshi, Langata School, KPA land is nonsense. The counter-suit is just a commercial-break.
Implicating someone in murder is a serious allegation, it is not the same as calling someone a chicken thief.
Wakili ni wale wale. They went to law school to earn money and any fool is a welcome client. boniface mwangi probably knows exactly what he is doing. this is not a criminal case but a civil one. so what if ruto wins? i don't see the high awards for libel of days past being awarded to ruto here. but assuming he is awarded say kes 50m. so what? boniface mwangi would simply apply for bankruptcy and avoid paying. or go to civil jail for 3 months and come out. or use this to get a political asylum outside kenya. and this won't even deter others on social media from similar talks. apart from the above, the counter claim by boniface mwangi is not just a commercial-break. if indeed it is true then we have a case where both may succeed and would have an effect on the damages awarded to each - maybe even materially affect the same. I've seen the words double jeopardy and heresay being mentioned in a civil case. If these are the lawyers he has, I guess someone is about to be very disappointed. Mambo ingine kama Kibaki, una ignore. Now look, Boniface is about to be very very popular with front page news about him for the next few years. Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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keraka wrote:FRM2011 wrote:http://www.nation.co.ke/news/case-against-activist-could-turn-fatal-/1056-3426512-o2lm1s/index.html
@maka, your services are needed here. We need to break this thing down. The moment I saw constitutional lawyer, wachira maina, is part of the defence team, I knew this will be interesting.
I hear they intend to unleash the NIS dossier on PeV to pin wsr down. On this his legal team misled him or rather he bit more than he can chew. It's not about the legal battle at all. Ruto will win hands down. It's about trying wsr in the court of public opinion. Peeling off the mask if you will. Imagine if wsr takes the stand and he is being pushed to answer some very uncomfortable questions. Mr. Ruto you had to return the title of the land where procession way is built now to avoid prosecution ? Yes or no ? Wsr : yes, but the land had been allocated to me by the commisioner of lands... Lawyer : In short you had grabbed public land and were it not for the amnesty by the then govt you would have been prosecuted ? This will be the best afro cinema. What I would want to know is whether a judge would allow the defence to present evidence from NIS to link wsr to the grave charges of mass murder and forcible displacement of population.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/7/2010 Posts: 1,279 Location: nbi
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Mwangi has now asked to see wealth declaration forms  The Governor of Nyeri - 2017
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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FRM2011 wrote:keraka wrote:FRM2011 wrote:http://www.nation.co.ke/news/case-against-activist-could-turn-fatal-/1056-3426512-o2lm1s/index.html
@maka, your services are needed here. We need to break this thing down. The moment I saw constitutional lawyer, wachira maina, is part of the defence team, I knew this will be interesting.
I hear they intend to unleash the NIS dossier on PeV to pin wsr down. On this his legal team misled him or rather he bit more than he can chew. It's not about the legal battle at all. Ruto will win hands down. It's about trying wsr in the court of public opinion. Peeling off the mask if you will. Imagine if wsr takes the stand and he is being pushed to answer some very uncomfortable questions. Highly unlikely because he's not on trial. Mwangi's plea to have a case opened on WSR might be thrown out of courtMr. Ruto you had to return the title of the land where procession way is built now to avoid prosecution ? Yes or no ? Ruto is not on trialWsr : yes, but the land had been allocated to me by the commisioner of lands... Lawyer : In short you had grabbed public land and were it not for the amnesty by the then govt you would have been prosecuted ? This will be the best afro cinema. What I would want to know is whether a judge would allow the defence to present evidence from NIS to link wsr to the grave charges of mass murder and forcible displacement of population. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/4/2006 Posts: 13,822 Location: Nairobi
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I don't get this whole thing - Ruto is the accuser - he has to prove his case against Mwangi, ama Mwangi has taken WSR to court? ndio WSR akuwe na kesi ya kujibu? if you are on the dock you don't get to ask questions... just answer them. Wakitaka Ruto ajibu maswali - wampeleke kortini. All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/5/2010 Posts: 2,459
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Wa_ithaka wrote:Mwangi has now asked to see wealth declaration forms Seems like this was the plan all along. From here maybe the tax returns, land registry records. There is something about wrestling with a pig. Both of you will get dirty but one is enjoying.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/3/2014 Posts: 1,063
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masukuma wrote:I don't get this whole thing - Ruto is the accuser - he has to prove his case against Mwangi, ama Mwangi has taken WSR to court? ndio WSR akuwe na kesi ya kujibu? if you are on the dock you don't get to ask questions... just answer them. Wakitaka Ruto ajibu maswali - wampeleke kortini. Ruto sued Boni and then Boni counter sued.Popcorns!! Consistency is better than intensity
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Another onethe Star wrote:An activist has moved to court seeking orders compelling the DPP and the DCI to investigate and prosecute Boniface Mwangi for hate speech and breach of peace.
Victor Yegon also wants activist Mwangi stopped from publishing inciting comments on his social media pages.
Yegon accused Mwangi of using social media to fan ethnic violence and incite the public, contrary to the National Cohesion and Integration Act. "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/22/2010 Posts: 11,522 Location: Nairobi
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FRM2011 wrote:Wa_ithaka wrote:Mwangi has now asked to see wealth declaration forms Seems like this was the plan all along. From here maybe the tax returns, land registry records. There is something about wrestling with a pig. Both of you will get dirty but one is enjoying.  possunt quia posse videntur
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/22/2010 Posts: 11,522 Location: Nairobi
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Coolbull wrote:Mwangi has lost it. Hearsay is not admissible in court.
He has to prove Ruto killed Jacob Juma. Period. Issues of Muteshi, Langata School, KPA land is nonsense. The counter-suit is just a commercial-break.
Implicating someone in murder is a serious allegation, it is not the same as calling someone a chicken thief.
Wakili ni wale wale. They went to law school to earn money and any fool is a welcome client. Clever stretch of the concept but not quite. I think the rule on inadmissibility of hearsay evidence is totally misapplied in that situation. And besides, Mwangi isnt just relying on the defence of truth and justification only, but has thrown in those of privilege and fair comment too which are acceptable in defamation. possunt quia posse videntur
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/1/2009 Posts: 1,884
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alma1 wrote:mkenyan wrote:Coolbull wrote:Mwangi has lost it. Hearsay is not admissible in court.
He has to prove Ruto killed Jacob Juma. Period. Issues of Muteshi, Langata School, KPA land is nonsense. The counter-suit is just a commercial-break.
Implicating someone in murder is a serious allegation, it is not the same as calling someone a chicken thief.
Wakili ni wale wale. They went to law school to earn money and any fool is a welcome client. boniface mwangi probably knows exactly what he is doing. this is not a criminal case but a civil one. so what if ruto wins? i don't see the high awards for libel of days past being awarded to ruto here. but assuming he is awarded say kes 50m. so what? boniface mwangi would simply apply for bankruptcy and avoid paying. or go to civil jail for 3 months and come out. or use this to get a political asylum outside kenya. and this won't even deter others on social media from similar talks. apart from the above, the counter claim by boniface mwangi is not just a commercial-break. if indeed it is true then we have a case where both may succeed and would have an effect on the damages awarded to each - maybe even materially affect the same. I've seen the words double jeopardy and heresay being mentioned in a civil case. If these are the lawyers he has, I guess someone is about to be very disappointed. Mambo ingine kama Kibaki, una ignore. Now look, Boniface is about to be very very popular with front page news about him for the next few years. and now imagine boniface mwangi dragging this thing for about four more years or so (which is possible with constitutional petitions, adjournments, interlocutory applications, appeals etc) up to the time when ruto shall be campaigning for the top seat and targeting central votes...now imagine what the icc claims by boniface mwangi in the suit would do to his chances of votes from central...
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 9/19/2011 Posts: 1,694
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Quote:The law offers remedies to a person
aggrieved by reputational injury from defamatory publications. In this regard,the first and most important thing to note is that a suit for defamation in Kenya must be brought
within 12 months from the date on which the defamatory statement(s)is made.
Also note that the case of the aggrieved party is strengthened where a person aggrieved by defamatory statements prior to filing an action in court requires the maker of the statement complained of to retract the statement and apologise.Such retraction and or apology has to be made with the same prominence that the statement complained of was made.
The defences available where one is accused of defamation are justification,fair comment, public interest,and privilege/immunity.
For instance,lawmakers have the immunity from prosecution for statements made in the course of their legislative duties since they have to execute their mandate without fear of prosecution.
On the other hand publishers of statements
that maybe perceived to be defamatory have a
defence if publication was due to public interest or formed part of fair comment which
is also closely related to justification. Fair comment has to be made in utmost good faith and based on substantiated facts.
A person relying on the aforesaid grounds as defence for defamation has to prove the justification,good faith or fair comment. Am really trying to understand BM's end game here. I thought the onus is upon him to prove that indeed the DP was involved in any action that led to the demise of Juma. How do stories about being a "hustler" and the negative connotation that goes with that name among many other sideshows help his defence? How does a counter suit that is not even related come into play? How does it help BM's case to say that jirongo was not sued or even going after tax info while the case is substantially about the accusation on the death of Juma
“People will believe a big lie sooner than a little one, and if you repeat it frequently enough, people will sooner or later believe it.” ― Walter C. Langer
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 4/1/2009 Posts: 1,884
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masukuma wrote:I don't get this whole thing - Ruto is the accuser - he has to prove his case against Mwangi, ama Mwangi has taken WSR to court? ndio WSR akuwe na kesi ya kujibu? if you are on the dock you don't get to ask questions... just answer them. Wakitaka Ruto ajibu maswali - wampeleke kortini. to prove his case ruto would need to testify and mwangi shall be entitled to cross-examined him - it is mwangi who may decide not to testify in his defence (same situation applies to mwangi's counterclaim). now where it gets more interesting is the position by mwangi that ruto is 'libel proof'. if you thought that this is a far-fetched defence then consider the fact that the vice president and assistant general counsel for new york times took a somewhat similar defence in his response to trump stating among others that "...the essence of a libel claim, of course, is the protection of one's reputation...nothing in our article has had the slightest effect on the reputation that mr. trump, through his own words and actions, has already created for himself."
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/7/2012 Posts: 11,929
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maka wrote:FRM2011 wrote:Wa_ithaka wrote:Mwangi has now asked to see wealth declaration forms Seems like this was the plan all along. From here maybe the tax returns, land registry records. There is something about wrestling with a pig. Both of you will get dirty but one is enjoying. Now this is witch hunting  In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
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