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So called Cyclic "P" election violence
masukuma
#1 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 1:40:19 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
I have heard people crying and saying the root causes of our post/pre election violence episodes have not been addressed. Perhaps someone could remind me - what was the cause of the Land clashes of Timboroa, Mau summit, Molo and elburgon in 1992 and to some extent in 1997? how does this relate to the post EV of 2007? can someone also remind me why we never had these land clashes in all elections since independence until 1992? and why 2002 and 2013 were exempt?
My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
sitaki.kujulikana
#2 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 5:26:32 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 8/25/2012
Posts: 1,826
masukuma wrote:
I have heard people crying and saying the root causes of our post/pre election violence episodes have not been addressed. Perhaps someone could remind me - what was the cause of the Land clashes of Timboroa, Mau summit, Molo and elburgon in 1992 and to some extent in 1997? how does this relate to the post EV of 2007? can someone also remind me why we never had these land clashes in all elections since independence until 1992? and why 2002 and 2013 were exempt?
My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.

and when the rift coughs everybody gets the cold
alma1
#3 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 5:56:58 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/19/2015
Posts: 2,871
Location: hapo
masukuma wrote:
I have heard people crying and saying the root causes of our post/pre election violence episodes have not been addressed. Perhaps someone could remind me - what was the cause of the Land clashes of Timboroa, Mau summit, Molo and elburgon in 1992 and to some extent in 1997? how does this relate to the post EV of 2007? can someone also remind me why we never had these land clashes in all elections since independence until 1992? and why 2002 and 2013 were exempt?
My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.


That statement is what I call blackmail.

Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?

masukuma
#4 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 6:18:01 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
alma1 wrote:
masukuma wrote:
I have heard people crying and saying the root causes of our post/pre election violence episodes have not been addressed. Perhaps someone could remind me - what was the cause of the Land clashes of Timboroa, Mau summit, Molo and elburgon in 1992 and to some extent in 1997? how does this relate to the post EV of 2007? can someone also remind me why we never had these land clashes in all elections since independence until 1992? and why 2002 and 2013 were exempt?
My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.


That statement is what I call blackmail.


Ehe! But it's the reality - right?
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
alma1
#5 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 6:41:24 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/19/2015
Posts: 2,871
Location: hapo
masukuma wrote:
alma1 wrote:
masukuma wrote:
I have heard people crying and saying the root causes of our post/pre election violence episodes have not been addressed. Perhaps someone could remind me - what was the cause of the Land clashes of Timboroa, Mau summit, Molo and elburgon in 1992 and to some extent in 1997? how does this relate to the post EV of 2007? can someone also remind me why we never had these land clashes in all elections since independence until 1992? and why 2002 and 2013 were exempt?
My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.


That statement is what I call blackmail.


Ehe! But it's the reality - right?


Your reality not mine. Just try blackmail me for a second. Ati put my pics on chocho media. I'll put all the other ones before you do.

Now even the voters there have been led to believe that they can only live in peace if they take a singh on board.

That is not wise. And someday somehow since you are a scientist, you know the pressure shall be too much.
Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?

Alba
#6 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 8:58:26 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
masukuma wrote:

My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.


So according to this analysis, Kiuks betta support Ruto even after 2017. If / when kaleos find out that they were just being used then another kiambaa happens inevitably.

Perhaps even soon after the 2017 election when Ruto becomes dispensable.

If this analysis is true, Then No wonder Kenya is a black hole
masukuma
#7 Posted : Wednesday, April 06, 2016 9:03:15 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
Alba wrote:
masukuma wrote:

My analysis... is that if Kyuks and Kaleos are on one side - we don't burn. as soon as these two are separated rift valley kinaumana.


So according to this analysis, Kiuks betta support Ruto even after 2017. If / when kaleos find out that they were just being used then another kiambaa happens inevitably.

Perhaps even soon after the 2017 election when Ruto becomes dispensable.

If this analysis is true, Then No wonder Kenya is a black hole

Exactly!! But I suspect it may not be a clear support us Rift valley Kyuks know where our bread is buttered... I foresee a schism if some people decide not to "tow the line"
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Alba
#8 Posted : Thursday, April 07, 2016 12:46:00 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
Then either way Kenyans are screwed. For that matter kikuyus specifically are screwed

If Ruto must be elected in 2022, you risk the resurgence of land clashes whether you supported Ruto or not because kaleos could be emboldened by being in power just as they were when way Moi was in power. And land is still a very emotive issue in RVP

And like Moi, Ruto may not need kikuyu votes once he is in power so he can restart the land clashes if thats the direction political winds are blowing. he can restart the process of kicking kiuks out of RVP because like Moi, he will build a new bloc. remember power corrupts people. Moi also started out very well but after 3 years he became power drunk.

So whether Kikuyus support Ruto or not, there could be another kiambaa or another molo.

And yet some people have been brainwashed into thinking that Africans do not ICC. Supposedly we can govern ourselves. smile

And as far as supporting Ruto, beyond 2022, I have my doubts since Kikuyus have never deigned to vote for anyone outside central province.

As for Kenyans, they will have to live with a president who is incredibly corrupt and who is relentless when it comes to grabbing land from schools or water towers or whatever. If Ruto could be a relentless land grabber when he was in the opposition, I shudder to think what he will do when he ascends to power.

So what you are telling us is that because of the Kikuyu-Kalenjin dynamic, the country is screwed and we must live in a state of perpetual dysfunction. A state where the average kikuyu businessman is not sure if he can open a business in a non-kikuyu area because our tribal elections are such that his business could be burned to the ground depending on the election result or depending on who feels betrayed.

On top of that, we must live with corrupt public servants. For example, UK cannot tackle corruption boldly if the corrupt person is a kaleo because such an action would offend kaleos and threaten the alliance.

Men we Kenyans have really entangled ourselves with our tribal voting.

So again if tribal alliances are a must in order to keep peace then Kenya is screwed.
masukuma
#9 Posted : Thursday, April 07, 2016 9:26:35 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
Alba wrote:
Then either way Kenyans are screwed. For that matter kikuyus specifically are screwed

If Ruto must be elected in 2022, you risk the resurgence of land clashes whether you supported Ruto or not because kaleos could be emboldened by being in power just as they were when way Moi was in power. And land is still a very emotive issue in RVP

And like Moi, Ruto may not need kikuyu votes once he is in power so he can restart the land clashes if thats the direction political winds are blowing. he can restart the process of kicking kiuks out of RVP because like Moi, he will build a new bloc. remember power corrupts people. Moi also started out very well but after 3 years he became power drunk.

So whether Kikuyus support Ruto or not, there could be another kiambaa or another molo.

And yet some people have been brainwashed into thinking that Africans do not ICC. Supposedly we can govern ourselves. smile

And as far as supporting Ruto, beyond 2022, I have my doubts since Kikuyus have never deigned to vote for anyone outside central province.

As for Kenyans, they will have to live with a president who is incredibly corrupt and who is relentless when it comes to grabbing land from schools or water towers or whatever. If Ruto could be a relentless land grabber when he was in the opposition, I shudder to think what he will do when he ascends to power.

So what you are telling us is that because of the Kikuyu-Kalenjin dynamic, the country is screwed and we must live in a state of perpetual dysfunction. A state where the average kikuyu businessman is not sure if he can open a business in a non-kikuyu area because our tribal elections are such that his business could be burned to the ground depending on the election result or depending on who feels betrayed.

On top of that, we must live with corrupt public servants. For example, UK cannot tackle corruption boldly if the corrupt person is a kaleo because such an action would offend kaleos and threaten the alliance.

Men we Kenyans have really entangled ourselves with our tribal voting.

So again if tribal alliances are a must in order to keep peace then Kenya is screwed.

I am just saying that we know where our bread is buttered... been stung 3 times we kinda know what is good for us (waSapere wa RVP). I struggle to find an opinionated mSapere from RV on these matters - kwanza we have never really benefited from any mSapere from central government. so mwamba ngoma huvuta pande yake! Kila mtu ajipange... we don't even need to be on the winning team (like 2002) we just need to side with these guys and we shall be sawa. the rest can gang up and have a president from another part of the country - ni sawa. And by the way the narrative that a person is responsible for election violence is a bit narrow minded. Ethnic tensions lead to this type of conflict.... having gone through it 3 times we kinda know what causes these tensions. Wengine mjipange...
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
kaka2za
#10 Posted : Thursday, April 07, 2016 10:33:50 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/3/2008
Posts: 4,058
Location: Gwitu
Jomo gave Kyuks land in the RV and appointed DM as VP to silence them.Kaleos looked on as their ancestral land was taken away and renamed Rurigi,Kiambaa etc
Kyuks in RV then decided support opposition in 1992 rather than KANU and this angered their hosts.
Truth forever on the scaffold
Wrong forever on the throne
(James Russell Rowell)
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