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Kenya Airways...why ignore..
obiero
#3681 Posted : Friday, March 11, 2016 9:26:38 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,071
Location: nairobi
jerry wrote:
I wonder what essay has not been drawn in the thousands of posts.

I sold my IPO shares at 7.80 when KBC was "baba na mama". I couldn't stand the business news where KQ was always losing.

@jerry epitomises the tragedy of a timid investor, having confirmed that he sold at KES 7.80 when the share rose all the way to KES 126 in less than a decade. Im sorry for your loss of that golden opportunity to create massive wealth. Now, here goes the mini essay in order of financial impact:
1. Route optimisation that has seen rescheduling of primary source markets to enhance efficieny has been noted to rake in increasing annual revenue to over KES 118B in current financial year
2. Sale/lease of underutilised assets will save KQ over KES 3.5B per annum with expected once off revenue of KES 9.2B in current financial year
3. Renegotiation of loan tenor for outstanding facilities was a touch of genius, with expected easing of KES 3.5B in fleet ownership costs per year
4. Staff productivity management has seen improvement of OTP to levels last seen in the early 90s. Further, the HOTAC cashflow dampener has been arrested by onward forwarding of costs to the crew, for identified cases of laxity, saving KQ an average of KES 1,650,000 per successful trip
KQ is on the right track and shall post a massively improved financial position, with an operating profit and a cutback of the overall loss element by over KES 18B in the current financial year ending 31.03.2016 @wazua Bookmark this post..

KQ ABP 4.26
jerry
#3682 Posted : Saturday, March 12, 2016 11:40:09 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/29/2006
Posts: 2,570
obiero wrote:
jerry wrote:
I wonder what essay has not been drawn in the thousands of posts.

I sold my IPO shares at 7.80 when KBC was "baba na mama". I couldn't stand the business news where KQ was always losing.

@jerry epitomises the tragedy of a timid investor, having confirmed that he sold at KES 7.80 when the share rose all the way to KES 126 in less than a decade. Im sorry for your loss of that golden opportunity to create massive wealth. Now, here goes the mini essay in order of financial impact:
1. Route optimisation that has seen rescheduling of primary source markets to enhance efficieny has been noted to rake in increasing annual revenue to over KES 118B in current financial year
2. Sale/lease of underutilised assets will save KQ over KES 3.5B per annum with expected once off revenue of KES 9.2B in current financial year
3. Renegotiation of loan tenor for outstanding facilities was a touch of genius, with expected easing of KES 3.5B in fleet ownership costs per year
4. Staff productivity management has seen improvement of OTP to levels last seen in the early 90s. Further, the HOTAC cashflow dampener has been arrested by onward forwarding of costs to the crew, for identified cases of laxity, saving KQ an average of KES 1,650,000 per successful trip
KQ is on the right track and shall post a massively improved financial position, with an operating profit and a cutback of the overall loss element by over KES 18B in the current financial year ending 31.03.2016 @wazua Bookmark this post..

Before I congratulate you for the essay give us some history of dividends paid since KQ went public in 1996 (?). I agree I'm timid.
The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
VituVingiSana
#3683 Posted : Saturday, March 12, 2016 1:31:20 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,298
Location: Nairobi
obiero wrote:
jerry wrote:
I wonder what essay has not been drawn in the thousands of posts.

I sold my IPO shares at 7.80 when KBC was "baba na mama". I couldn't stand the business news where KQ was always losing.

@jerry epitomises the tragedy of a timid investor, having confirmed that he sold at KES 7.80 when the share rose all the way to KES 126 in less than a decade And back down to 4.50 in less than a decade after that. So @jerry did very well by selling out at 7.80 unlike GoK. The 7.80 over say 20 years placed in T-Bonds = 50 or so. Im sorry for your loss of that golden opportunity All that glitters is not gold to create massive wealth. Now, here goes the mini essay in order of financial impact:
1. Route optimisation that has seen rescheduling of primary source markets to enhance efficieny has been noted to rake in increasing annual revenue to over KES 118B in current financial year
2. Sale/lease of underutilised assets will save KQ over KES 3.5B per annum with expected once off revenue of KES 9.2B in current financial year
3. Renegotiation of loan tenor for outstanding facilities was a touch of genius, with expected easing of KES 3.5B in fleet ownership costs per year
4. Staff productivity management has seen improvement of OTP to levels last seen in the early 90s. Further, the HOTAC cashflow dampener has been arrested by onward forwarding of costs to the crew, for identified cases of laxity, saving KQ an average of KES 1,650,000 per successful trip
KQ is on the right track and shall post a massively improved financial position, with an operating profit and a cutback of the overall loss element by over KES 18B in the current financial year ending 31.03.2016 @wazua Bookmark this post..


I am glad Ngunze is reviving KQ but as an investment TODAY at 4.50 buying KQ shares seems unwise vs the other options.

Many banks eg NIC, I&M, Equity, DTB, etc are trading at very attractive multiples.

Unga trades at a forward PER of 7 with a market that demands more FMCG.

KK is at an (estimated) PER of 9 [for FY 2015] but I estimate an EPS of 1.35-1.50 for FY 2016. I await the results on 18th then AGM for a better understanding of their performance.

And many others, despite a few rough years, are not in the hole e.g. TPSEA [tourism downturn], Britam [Rawat drama], Centum, HFCK, etc.

Others are 'new' eg Flame Tree but show promise if KE's economy improves/grows.

Anyway, it is @Obiero's money. It is @jerry's money. It is @VVS money. Live and learn.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
obiero
#3684 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 6:37:06 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,071
Location: nairobi
Spikes
#3685 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 7:52:09 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/20/2015
Posts: 2,811
Location: Mombasa
obiero wrote:
www.nation.co.ke/business/JKIA-inches-closer-to-direct-US-flights/-/996/3114868/-/6q260rz/-/index.html


Good development but the journey to dreamland is elusive and long!
John 5:17 But Jesus replied, “My Father is always working, and so am I.”
maka
#3686 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 8:58:29 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Spikes wrote:
obiero wrote:
www.nation.co.ke/business/JKIA-inches-closer-to-direct-US-flights/-/996/3114868/-/6q260rz/-/index.html


Good development but the journey to dreamland is elusive and long!


Terminal still not ready....might not be opened on Tuesday by UK....
possunt quia posse videntur
VituVingiSana
#3687 Posted : Sunday, March 13, 2016 11:30:33 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,298
Location: Nairobi
maka wrote:
Spikes wrote:
obiero wrote:
www.nation.co.ke/business/JKIA-inches-closer-to-direct-US-flights/-/996/3114868/-/6q260rz/-/index.html


Good development but the journey to dreamland is elusive and long!

Terminal still not ready....might not be opened on Tuesday by UK....
Not the first time a KE prez has "opened" a project that wasn't ready! KPC did that with Kibaki who commissioned a pipeline/expansion that was anything but ready. http://www.thezimbabwean...ya-day-kibaki-was-duped/
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Afroblk
#3688 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 8:42:20 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 3/3/2010
Posts: 79
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l
Knowledge is contagious...Infect truth!
obiero
#3689 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 11:48:16 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,071
Location: nairobi
move with caution

KQ ABP 4.26
newbie15
#3690 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2016 11:57:59 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 10/21/2015
Posts: 11
ever heard of being killed softly? its what kq is doing to wanjiku
maka
#3691 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 4:45:19 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
VituVingiSana wrote:
maka wrote:
Spikes wrote:
[quote=obiero]www.nation.co.ke/business/JKIA-inches-closer-to-direct-US-flights/-/996/3114868/-/6q260rz/-/index.html


Good development but the journey to dreamland is elusive and long!

Terminal still not ready....might not be opened on Tuesday by UK....
Not the first time a KE prez has "opened" a project that wasn't ready! KPC did that with Kibaki who commissioned a pipeline/expansion that was anything but ready. http://www.thezimbabwean...a-day-kibaki-was-duped/[/quote]

Never happened as expected...only 1 live flight was done...failed dramatically back to the drawing board...
possunt quia posse videntur
sparkly
#3692 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 7:21:28 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 8,083
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.
Life is short. Live passionately.
obiero
#3693 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 10:47:39 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,071
Location: nairobi
sparkly wrote:
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.

@sparkly.. U forgot to tell us that it also traded at KES 126.. To each his own, if airlines were bad investments, then planes wldnt be built, we wldnt have airports.. Seems simplistic, but it is altruist. It depends on the strategy of the airline, otherwise, people like Branson and Buffet wldnt own Virgin & Jetways

KQ ABP 4.26
Spikes
#3694 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 1:06:09 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/20/2015
Posts: 2,811
Location: Mombasa
obiero wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.

@sparkly.. U forgot to tell us that it also traded at KES 126.. To each his own, if airlines were bad investments, then planes wldnt be built, we wldnt have airports.. Seems simplistic, but it is altruist. It depends on the strategy of the airline, otherwise, people like Branson and Buffet wldnt own Virgin & Jetways


@obiero I warned you will sell me your stake at 2bob...As you can observe finally KQ has heed law of free fall!!!

Once PPT is completely wiped out sit tight and watch bloodbath in the streets.
John 5:17 But Jesus replied, “My Father is always working, and so am I.”
maka
#3695 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 1:18:35 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Spikes wrote:
obiero wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.

@sparkly.. U forgot to tell us that it also traded at KES 126.. To each his own, if airlines were bad investments, then planes wldnt be built, we wldnt have airports.. Seems simplistic, but it is altruist. It depends on the strategy of the airline, otherwise, people like Branson and Buffet wldnt own Virgin & Jetways


@obiero I warned you will sell me your stake at 2bob...As you can observe finally KQ has heed law of free fall!!!

Once PPT is completely wiped out sit tight and watch bloodbath in the streets.


whoop whoop....
possunt quia posse videntur
Metch
#3696 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 2:06:13 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 12/22/2015
Posts: 224
Location: Mombasa, Kenya
maka wrote:
Spikes wrote:
obiero wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.

@sparkly.. U forgot to tell us that it also traded at KES 126.. To each his own, if airlines were bad investments, then planes wldnt be built, we wldnt have airports.. Seems simplistic, but it is altruist. It depends on the strategy of the airline, otherwise, people like Branson and Buffet wldnt own Virgin & Jetways


@obiero I warned you will sell me your stake at 2bob...As you can observe finally KQ has heed law of free fall!!!

Once PPT is completely wiped out sit tight and watch bloodbath in the streets.


whoop whoop....


this is hard to watch
Start!
VituVingiSana
#3697 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 2:33:31 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,298
Location: Nairobi
obiero wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.

@sparkly.. U forgot to tell us that it also traded at KES 126.. To each his own, if airlines were bad investments, then planes wldnt be built, we wldnt have airports.. Seems simplistic, but it is altruist. It depends on the strategy of the airline, otherwise, people like Branson and Buffet wldnt own Virgin & Jetways

Shame on you Shame on you Shame on you Kusoma ni bure.

http://www.wsj.com/artic...a-rare-pinch-1420485740
NetJets Unrest Puts Warren Buffett in a Rare Pinch
Pilots Protest Against Pay, Benefits at Berkshire Hathaway’s NetJets

"In the case of NetJets, the pressure to complete the turnaround of a business Mr. Buffett once called his “number one worry” is now spilling into public view."

"In the 16 years that Berkshire has owned NetJets, the jet operator has never paid its owner a dividend, and its net worth is considerably less than the $725 million Berkshire paid for it in 1998" This was from a 2015 article. WB would have been better off putting the money in the bank!

"worsened amid extended contract negotiations with multiple unions representing pilots, flight attendants, mechanics and others. NetJets, based in Columbus, Ohio, has about 6,200 employees, a majority of whom belong to unions."

"NetJets took a major hit during the financial crisis as wealthy clients cut back on private flying, surviving only because Berkshire guaranteed its $1.9 billion debt load."

1) NetJets isn't an 'airline' as much as Uber [which owns planes].
2)NetJets is a pain for WB. Not one of his best performers. Too much drama.
3) No dividends. It has had negative cashflow in many years.
4) Despite all this is has a POSITIVE equity/capital whereas KQ has NEGATIVE capital.

"Everyone but shareholders made money off KQ." True or False?
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#3698 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 2:35:38 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,298
Location: Nairobi
obiero wrote:
move with caution

Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Yaani, @obiero is saying one should be cautious as regards KQ?

*Pigs are flying*

In the meantime... *Please fill up at KenolKobil, we need the money to pay off our debts. KQ & cronies pay cash. Thank You. Come Again.*
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#3699 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 2:56:33 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,298
Location: Nairobi
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l
Without GoK's bailout... = ZERO, SUFURI, NADA
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
obiero
#3700 Posted : Wednesday, March 16, 2016 3:27:05 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 14,071
Location: nairobi
VituVingiSana wrote:
obiero wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Afroblk wrote:
One of the many counters worth dumping loads of cash...returns will be insane...how low do you think this will go? Probably not much lower than current rates. I only have one hope with KQ...direct flights to US. As long as those pigs in parliament can pass that bill and open the terminal, Kenya will be accorded the much awaited category 1 once the FAA conducts the inspection. Honestly I can't wait to get some returns and exit without looking back...I've been patient for a while and haven't sold even a single share...I'm even tired on buying...how much can one accumulate l0l I know CFC guys be like, here he goes again..l0l


15 years ago KQ used to trade at 5.50-7.00 range. Stock is now below that price not because of splits or bonuses, having done a rights issue!

Learn from history. History says that airlines in general and KQ in particular are bad investments. Be smart.

@sparkly.. U forgot to tell us that it also traded at KES 126.. To each his own, if airlines were bad investments, then planes wldnt be built, we wldnt have airports.. Seems simplistic, but it is altruist. It depends on the strategy of the airline, otherwise, people like Branson and Buffet wldnt own Virgin & Jetways

Shame on you Shame on you Shame on you Kusoma ni bure.

http://www.wsj.com/artic...a-rare-pinch-1420485740
NetJets Unrest Puts Warren Buffett in a Rare Pinch
Pilots Protest Against Pay, Benefits at Berkshire Hathaway’s NetJets

"In the case of NetJets, the pressure to complete the turnaround of a business Mr. Buffett once called his “number one worry” is now spilling into public view."

"In the 16 years that Berkshire has owned NetJets, the jet operator has never paid its owner a dividend, and its net worth is considerably less than the $725 million Berkshire paid for it in 1998" This was from a 2015 article. WB would have been better off putting the money in the bank!

"worsened amid extended contract negotiations with multiple unions representing pilots, flight attendants, mechanics and others. NetJets, based in Columbus, Ohio, has about 6,200 employees, a majority of whom belong to unions."

"NetJets took a major hit during the financial crisis as wealthy clients cut back on private flying, surviving only because Berkshire guaranteed its $1.9 billion debt load."

1) NetJets isn't an 'airline' as much as Uber [which owns planes].
2)NetJets is a pain for WB. Not one of his best performers. Too much drama.
3) No dividends. It has had negative cashflow in many years.
4) Despite all this is has a POSITIVE equity/capital whereas KQ has NEGATIVE capital.

"Everyone but shareholders made money off KQ." True or False?

Asante mwalimu. What about Virgin?

KQ ABP 4.26
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