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Kenya Airways...why ignore..
Rank: New-farer Joined: 3/1/2014 Posts: 82
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maka wrote:Gordon Gekko wrote:maka wrote:Aguytrying wrote:Project mawingu cancelled.
I was one of those that said it wasn't feasible. If a non expert in the airline industry, non accountant like me can see a fault in a companys strategy that a whole board goes ahead and persues, kq was in very bad hands. And don't think that much has changed.
which right minded investor would pour 18 billion to a financially mismanaged loss making firm? Unless its the chinco gov. or an airline buying out most of Gov's stake.
That was the only way out for them... Cancelled is incorrect. Halted is more appropriate. Cancelled means the return of all equipment, which isn't the case. I don't think mawingu was a bad strategy, it got delayed by nearly 4 years. Had it run on time, it would probably be a different story today. Somebody on this thread,cant rem who said we look at KQ after 2018...maybe,just maybe....If I close my eyes and buy 250,000 shares today will I be smiling in 2018? If you can pull a chart and get the in at the right timing, your dreams maybe valid! “The beauty of success is that it doesn’t matter how many times you have failed, you only have to be right once and then everyone can tell you how lucky you are.” - Mark Cuban
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/13/2011 Posts: 5,964
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Northern corridor states agree to expedite bilateral airspace agreementswww.newtimes.co.rw/secti...ticle/2015-05-06/188504/
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Kenya Airways has found a way out of a costly deal it had made to buy three 787-8 Dreamliners directly from the manufacturer. The cash-strapped airline has struck an agreement with leading aircraft leasing firm AWAS who will acquire the planes from Boeing and lease them to the Nairobi-based airline. Dublin-based AWAS announced Wednesday that it has agreed to a purchase and leaseback transaction for three Dreamliners, the first of which was delivered today.??????? http://www.businessdaily...6/-/g60b8g/-/index.html
So they will own 6 and lease 3; the writing of these reporters is wanting "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,078 Location: Nairobi
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So... KQ is 'leasing' the planes vs buying them. Some thoughts. 1) KQ needs cash so the 'deposits' will be released to KQ but lease payments start. I wonder if AWAS has asked for a security deposit? 2) KQ can't claim depreciation but lease payments will be have to be made 3) What terms for the leases? 4) Will KQ attract VAT on these leases? Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,487 Location: nairobi
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Kastone wrote:Cde Monomotapa wrote:maka wrote:Aguytrying wrote:Project mawingu cancelled.
I was one of those that said it wasn't feasible. If a non expert in the airline industry, non accountant like me can see a fault in a companys strategy that a whole board goes ahead and persues, kq was in very bad hands. And don't think that much has changed.
which right minded investor would pour 18 billion to a financially mismanaged loss making firm? Unless its the chinco gov. or an airline buying out most of Gov's stake.
That was the only way out for them... Focusing on actionables, KQ doesn't need a equity partner to raise 18B. The going rate for a new 787 is USD180-200M. Now, KQ has 5 of it's older fleet up for sale. Reportedly a 767 and 4 777-200s. The issue is how soon they can be sold. Will help clear debt, but would result to more losses ^ pombe? bangi? please explain how selling of fuel guzzling planes leads to more losses
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/13/2011 Posts: 5,964
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@murchr AWAS steps in with Kenya Airways 787 financingQuote: 30 Apr 2015: African operator Kenya Airways has mandated financing of its final three Boeing 787 deliveries to AWAS through a sale-and-leaseback transaction.
The first unit, MSN 36044, was delivered today, confirms the lessor. Flightglobal's Ascend Fleets database shows that the remaining two deliveries are scheduled for July and August.
The three 787s were initially mandated to African Export-Import Bank in 2012 as part of $1.9 billion funding package comprising nine Boeing 787-8s, one 777-300ER and 10 Embraer 190s. The funding package included pre-delivery payments along with an aircraft delivery finance facility.
The Cairo-based institution acted as global co-ordinator in the transaction, which comprised a senior tranche guaranteed by the US Export-Import Bank plus a commercial tranche.
Afreximbank also acted as the arranger and underwriter of the commercial tranche, while Citigroup Global Markets and JP Morgan Chase were the arrangers for the senior Ex-Im-guaranteed tranche.
The transaction marks AWAS's first 787 acquisitions.
"This marks a milestone for AWAS, our first of many planned new-technology aircraft acquisitions with these three Boeing 787-8s," says AWAS chief executive Ray Sisson. http://www.flightglobal....d&utm_medium=twitter
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/26/2012 Posts: 15,980
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Cde Monomotapa wrote: @murchr AWAS steps in with Kenya Airways 787 financingQuote: 30 Apr 2015: African operator Kenya Airways has mandated financing of its final three Boeing 787 deliveries to AWAS through a sale-and-leaseback transaction.
The first unit, MSN 36044, was delivered today, confirms the lessor. Flightglobal's Ascend Fleets database shows that the remaining two deliveries are scheduled for July and August.
The three 787s were initially mandated to African Export-Import Bank in 2012 as part of $1.9 billion funding package comprising nine Boeing 787-8s, one 777-300ER and 10 Embraer 190s. The funding package included pre-delivery payments along with an aircraft delivery finance facility.
The Cairo-based institution acted as global co-ordinator in the transaction, which comprised a senior tranche guaranteed by the US Export-Import Bank plus a commercial tranche.
Afreximbank also acted as the arranger and underwriter of the commercial tranche, while Citigroup Global Markets and JP Morgan Chase were the arrangers for the senior Ex-Im-guaranteed tranche.
The transaction marks AWAS's first 787 acquisitions.
"This marks a milestone for AWAS, our first of many planned new-technology aircraft acquisitions with these three Boeing 787-8s," says AWAS chief executive Ray Sisson. http://www.flightglobal....&utm_medium=twitter Thanks @Cde...this article is more clear "There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2010 Posts: 5,040
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@obiero. it's because the selling price will be lower than the buying price The investor's chief problem - and even his worst enemy - is likely to be himself
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,487 Location: nairobi
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Aguytrying wrote:@obiero. it's because the selling price will be lower than the buying price Surely.. So should they not sell? Ofcos assets depreciate over time
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 5/18/2008 Posts: 796
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I see how this solves their immediate cash flow issues but doesn't it mean that they will now be making two payments.. i.e. loan repayments to African Export-Import Bank and Lease Payments to AWAS. they'd better make good use of the money they'll receive from the sale to AWAS otherwise they might end up in an even bigger hole in 2-3 years. [quote=Cde Monomotapa]@murchr AWAS steps in with Kenya Airways 787 financingQuote: 30 Apr 2015: African operator Kenya Airways has mandated financing of its final three Boeing 787 deliveries to AWAS through a sale-and-leaseback transaction.
The first unit, MSN 36044, was delivered today, confirms the lessor. Flightglobal's Ascend Fleets database shows that the remaining two deliveries are scheduled for July and August.
The three 787s were initially mandated to African Export-Import Bank in 2012 as part of $1.9 billion funding package comprising nine Boeing 787-8s, one 777-300ER and 10 Embraer 190s. The funding package included pre-delivery payments along with an aircraft delivery finance facility.
The Cairo-based institution acted as global co-ordinator in the transaction, which comprised a senior tranche guaranteed by the US Export-Import Bank plus a commercial tranche.
Afreximbank also acted as the arranger and underwriter of the commercial tranche, while Citigroup Global Markets and JP Morgan Chase were the arrangers for the senior Ex-Im-guaranteed tranche.
The transaction marks AWAS's first 787 acquisitions.
"This marks a milestone for AWAS, our first of many planned new-technology aircraft acquisitions with these three Boeing 787-8s," says AWAS chief executive Ray Sisson. http://www.flightglobal....&utm_medium=twitter[/quote]
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,078 Location: Nairobi
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I wonder if KQ will lose their pre-delivery deposits i.e. that was a loss taken by KQ in exchange for AWAS assuming their contract to buy the 787s... Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2010 Posts: 5,040
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KQ needs a manager like Ohana to clean up the books, radical cost cutting, cleaning the dead wood and retiring debts aggressively. KQ and kk made the major losses in the same year, kk was quick to react KQ is yet to. The investor's chief problem - and even his worst enemy - is likely to be himself
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 3/1/2014 Posts: 82
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obiero wrote:Kastone wrote:Cde Monomotapa wrote:maka wrote:Aguytrying wrote:Project mawingu cancelled.
I was one of those that said it wasn't feasible. If a non expert in the airline industry, non accountant like me can see a fault in a companys strategy that a whole board goes ahead and persues, kq was in very bad hands. And don't think that much has changed.
which right minded investor would pour 18 billion to a financially mismanaged loss making firm? Unless its the chinco gov. or an airline buying out most of Gov's stake.
That was the only way out for them... Focusing on actionables, KQ doesn't need a equity partner to raise 18B. The going rate for a new 787 is USD180-200M. Now, KQ has 5 of it's older fleet up for sale. Reportedly a 767 and 4 777-200s. The issue is how soon they can be sold. Will help clear debt, but would result to more losses ^ pombe? bangi? please explain how selling of fuel guzzling planes leads to more losses Write down losses. “The beauty of success is that it doesn’t matter how many times you have failed, you only have to be right once and then everyone can tell you how lucky you are.” - Mark Cuban
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Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,078 Location: Nairobi
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Aguytrying wrote:KQ needs a manager like Ohana to clean up the books, radical cost cutting, cleaning the dead wood and retiring debts aggressively.
KQ and kk made the major losses in the same year, kk was quick to react KQ is yet to. The major shareholder in KK has direct appointees on the board. The major shareholders in KQ have 'political' appointees. All this boils down to ownership. KK didn't go for an ill-advised expansion plan nor a Rights Issue to hide its underlying problems. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2010 Posts: 5,040
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VituVingiSana wrote:Aguytrying wrote:KQ needs a manager like Ohana to clean up the books, radical cost cutting, cleaning the dead wood and retiring debts aggressively.
KQ and kk made the major losses in the same year, kk was quick to react KQ is yet to. The major shareholder in KK has direct appointees on the board. The major shareholders in KQ have 'political' appointees. All this boils down to ownership. KK didn't go for an ill-advised expansion plan nor a Rights Issue to hide its underlying problems. Correct. This demonstrates how important management is in investing The investor's chief problem - and even his worst enemy - is likely to be himself
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/1/2007 Posts: 539 Location: Nakuru
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Citizen at 1 reports Liberia declared Ebola free... Time to take (speculative) position??? For investors as a whole, returns decrease as motion increases ~ WB
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/23/2009 Posts: 13,487 Location: nairobi
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winmak wrote:Citizen at 1 reports Liberia declared Ebola free... Time to take (speculative) position??? Flights to be resumed from 1st week of June.. several conventions including the cannonisation of sister, plus Obama visit.. Things are looking up
HF 30,000 ABP 3.49; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92; MTN 23,800 ABP 6.45
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Rank: Member Joined: 12/1/2007 Posts: 539 Location: Nakuru
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obiero wrote:winmak wrote:Citizen at 1 reports Liberia declared Ebola free... Time to take (speculative) position??? Flights to be resumed from 1st week of June.. several conventions including the cannonisation of sister, plus Obama visit.. Things are looking up Thanks Obiero, lakini wapi rink ya hii maneno ya June flight resumption? I will spare something for this counter but on a pure speculative basis... Can't ignore this bear shetani hovering around. For investors as a whole, returns decrease as motion increases ~ WB
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/27/2007 Posts: 3,604
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winmak wrote:obiero wrote:winmak wrote:Citizen at 1 reports Liberia declared Ebola free... Time to take (speculative) position??? Flights to be resumed from 1st week of June.. several conventions including the cannonisation of sister, plus Obama visit.. Things are looking up Thanks Obiero, lakini wapi rink ya hii maneno ya June flight resumption? I will spare something for this counter but on a pure speculative basis... Can't ignore this bear shetani hovering around. Although the wod 'likely' has been used by the reporter on the resuming of flights, I would like to assume it's a step in the right direction KQ to resume flights to West AfricaAfrican parents don't know how to say sorry.. the closest you will get to a sorry is a 'have you eaten'
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Rank: Elder Joined: 11/27/2007 Posts: 3,604
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1 order selling at 7.80 while demand spread between 6.90 and 7.15 Supply is slowly thinning out in this price range, I am considering plunging in for speculative purposes African parents don't know how to say sorry.. the closest you will get to a sorry is a 'have you eaten'
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