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Garissa university attack.
Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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Symbols, even being tycho is political. Humanity is politics.
The big question is that of what kind of politics? Corruptive politics? Or otherwise?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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@AlphDoti - http://www.wazua.co.ke/f...sts&t=31086&p=3
This is a verse you like to quote to bolster the peaceful image of Islam. 5:32 wrote:
For that cause We decreed for the Children of Israel that whosoever killeth a human being for other than manslaughter or corruption in the earth, it shall be as if he had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind. Our messengers came unto them of old with clear proofs (of Allah's Sovereignty), but afterwards lo! many of them became prodigals in the earth.
So as we discuss KDF in Somalia and corruption in Kenya explain how a Muslim is supposed to follow the peaceful part you like to highlight and not the violent part.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/20/2007 Posts: 4,432
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Muriel wrote:Alma,
There is no need to arrest them. They were killed. At least we are told. What use is there arresting dead people?
I do not preach. I am not in Mombasa and have no plans to go.
I do not need to ask anyone if a way is right when I know it is wrong.
You still have not answered my question. Was the administrator corrupt having failed to gather and forward intel that could have mitigated or prevented this crime, a crime done by his son maybe in his own house even?
I am not angry. An accurate description of facts is no indication of anger. Muriel I will not answer your question. Deliberately because that will bring me to undermining and I don't have 200k for bail. Muriel, someone knew there was an attack coming. Someone even warned some people it would happen. Someone did not safeguard the citizens. Infact I can't even tell you about the planes that did not have fuel. Even worse, someone had bombed before and his friends were never investigated. Yet someone's parents had warned that they were fearful about their children. Now you tell me. You are busy blaming a religion while someone ignored all the signs. So you tell me. No don't write it here. You will have the blogger brigade on your neck. It's easy to blame the boogeyman. Its hard to face the truth. We failed. This gov't failed. Symbols, yes Kenyans have accepted corruption as part of their lives. They will suffer the consequences. Even death. Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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Why did you quote from 191, why did you leave out verse 190? Quran 2:190 says: Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. The verses you have qouted is in context of war. It says, war is permissible in self-defence, and under well-defined limits. When undertaken, it must be pushed with vigour, but only to restore peace and freedom for the worship of Allah. In any case strict limits must not be transgressed: women, children, old and infirm men should not be molested, nor trees and crops cut down, nor peace withheld when the enemy comes to terms. We have many hadiths showing prophet muhammad prohibition against Killing Women and Children in Military Expeditions: "I advise you ten things: Do not kill women or children or an aged, infirm person. Do not cut down fruit-bearing trees. Do not destroy an inhabited place. Do not slaughter sheep or camels except for food. Do not burn bees and do not scatter them. Do not steal from the booty, and do not be cowardly." But does killing of women and children prohibted according to the Bible? 1 Samuel 15:2,3: This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy [a] everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.' "Numbers 31:17,18: Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man,18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. Deuteronomy 20:16: However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. What @alma is telling you is that, what you see people doing is not Islam. It is not religion. These are criminals. Instead what you are doing is ignoring what is the religion, and going for what the media is telling you.[/quote] And who is not at war? Your brothers? They were on a peace-building mission like NGOs, right? They were looking for Amalekites, right? To implement certain instructions, right? And they found the Amalekites and finished the job ancient Israel failed to do, right? In this day and age, right? Oh! Allah loves more those who strive hard and fight with their wealth and with their lives. He even has grades for those who fight for him with their lives over and above those who sit at home and has promised paradise, a huge reward to them. (4:95) Is Allah a criminal to issue criminal orders and criminal instructions for criminals to do? Alma tells me in so many words to get my head off the religion and here you are telling me I am ignoring the religion!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 4/30/2008 Posts: 6,029
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AlphDoti wrote:Muriel wrote:alma wrote:
Ohhhh Please!
Take that to your church.
We are grown ups here. We know reality.
You are busy "undermining" muslims YET, your so called "christians" do the same shit every day.
My posts are rather clear.
We are fighting the wrong war. I don't think I can be more clear than that. And those that fight the wrong war, are annihilated.
It's not a christian vs muslim war.
We are fighting cessation here.
Tycho has given you referrence. The Al Jazeera video has given you something to think about.
You are still stuck up on stupid things like religion.
Ever since you knew it was a religious war, how many christians have you saved?
Just a question.
I'm saying this without fear and I really don't need anyone's favor.
We need to rethink what this country stands for and can stand for.
Every 10yrs there's a "new idea" taking over our kids.
First it was let's overthrow the gov't, then mwakenya, then mungiki, now al shabaab. the common denominator is young people who feel disenfranchised by their gov't.
You can go to your churches and continue thinking that Mohammed is coming to kill you kesho. That's your problem not mine. And I'd advise you to increase the reach of your friends. Like really search further than your church and clan.
When Americans were killed by these nutcases, they did not go around hating ALL muslims and immigrants. I don't know about you, but I thrived in the same place where some "outsiders" attacked.
Why?
Because there was a common purpose. All were created equal etc etc
Anyone who follows this monster called religion to foster an idea is one of the losers that actually killed these kids.
Tell your pastor I said that.
Corruption is killing this country. Have no doubt about it.
Deal with it. Now.
Otherwise we shall continue of this silly path of sijui Al Shabaab, Mungiki, and even the Indians are creating their own as we speak. It's called never hire a Kenyan as your boss.
Corruption and a basic lack of a common purpose for the guy in Mogotio and the herdsman in Wajir.
Yes, please! I have not saved anybody (because I have not sought out to) and I do my own thinking. I chart my own course and having had some experience with diversionary tactics in discourses, I think I can maintain my course in this one too. You still have not answered my questions. Let me quote for you a verse, an 'it-is-written', for justification for these killings whose counterparts in other thought systems is missing: Quote:2:191-193 - And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah is worse than killing.. But if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun.
Fitna is disbelief, polytheism etc Zalimun is polytheists, wrong doers etc It is their land. Secession, you say. They will drive you out not because they don't like your skin, language, smell, how you vote etc, but because it is a sacred duty for them. It may not be a matter of corruption only. The perpetrator of this latest crime was a son of an administrator - in the Office of the President - whose job, among other things, is to collect intel about such crimes and forward them to the relevant departments within the same office for further action. He did not know. He collected no intel. Was it because he was 'corrupt'? Why did you quote from 191, why did you leave out verse 190? Quran 2:190 says: Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. The verses you have qouted is in context of war. It says, war is permissible in self-defence, and under well-defined limits. When undertaken, it must be pushed with vigour, but only to restore peace and freedom for the worship of Allah. In any case strict limits must not be transgressed: women, children, old and infirm men should not be molested, nor trees and crops cut down, nor peace withheld when the enemy comes to terms. We have many hadiths showing prophet muhammad prohibition against Killing Women and Children in Military Expeditions: "I advise you ten things: Do not kill women or children or an aged, infirm person. Do not cut down fruit-bearing trees. Do not destroy an inhabited place. Do not slaughter sheep or camels except for food. Do not burn bees and do not scatter them. Do not steal from the booty, and do not be cowardly." But does killing of women and children prohibted according to the Bible? 1 Samuel 15:2,3: This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy [a] everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.' "Numbers 31:17,18: Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man,18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. Deuteronomy 20:16: However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. What @alma is telling you is that, what you see people doing is not Islam. It is not religion. These are criminals. Instead what you are doing is ignoring what is the religion, and going for what the media is telling you. They are Muslims and they ask who the prophet's mother is.Also in Garissa, Westgate etc they left out Muslims and killed christians.These are facts!!!!!!!!!!!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/20/2007 Posts: 4,432
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I've said enough for a long time to come. I'm so bitter about all this I have no more words. I wrote even during Westgate the very same things. Corruption will kill your child. You will find it easy to blame a religion or some madman but the truth is, Kenyans are so corrupt they don't care anymore. That's why the cop will take your 20 bob in your car and then go drive a bomb into a building. In the meantime, you will bring your stupid religions and say how nice you are. You know in your hearts that someone was corrupted and got a big pay day for this to happen. I hope you choke on the beer he buys you on Furahiday. Ni hayo tu. Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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'X' are humans killing or that cherish killing other humans: what's the best response to them? There can only be one answer. Remind them of what humanity is about. Even by embracing death and suffering.
The answer to corruption isn't corruption but 'salvation'. So it doesn't matter what the Koran or the Bible or the Gita says. At any instance the politics of being human override any other issues.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/19/2013 Posts: 2,552
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tycho wrote:Symbols, even being tycho is political. Humanity is politics.
The big question is that of what kind of politics? Corruptive politics? Or otherwise? Big according to who? Isn't that a political view? tycho wrote:'X' are humans killing or that cherish killing other humans: what's the best response to them? There can only be one answer. Remind them of what humanity is about. Even by embracing death and suffering.
The answer to corruption isn't corruption but 'salvation'. So it doesn't matter what the Koran or the Bible or the Gita says. At any instance the politics of being human override any other issues. Where does the political view of what humanity is or should be come from and what makes it the only answer? Unfortunately,your political view undermines itself.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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alma wrote:Muriel wrote:Alma,
There is no need to arrest them. They were killed. At least we are told. What use is there arresting dead people?
I do not preach. I am not in Mombasa and have no plans to go.
I do not need to ask anyone if a way is right when I know it is wrong.
You still have not answered my question. Was the administrator corrupt having failed to gather and forward intel that could have mitigated or prevented this crime, a crime done by his son maybe in his own house even?
I am not angry. An accurate description of facts is no indication of anger. Muriel I will not answer your question. Deliberately because that will bring me to undermining and I don't have 200k for bail. Muriel, someone knew there was an attack coming. Someone even warned some people it would happen. Someone did not safeguard the citizens. Infact I can't even tell you about the planes that did not have fuel. Even worse, someone had bombed before and his friends were never investigated. Yet someone's parents had warned that they were fearful about their children. Now you tell me. You are busy blaming a religion while someone ignored all the signs. So you tell me. No don't write it here. You will have the blogger brigade on your neck. It's easy to blame the boogeyman. Its hard to face the truth. We failed. This gov't failed. Symbols, yes Kenyans have accepted corruption as part of their lives. They will suffer the consequences. Even death. As much as we are to blame the sequence of failures we must not loose sight of other steps in the sequence. We must not have a singular vision of a multifaceted issue. The one who, promptly after the event, soothes you that they are 'peaceful' is as guilty as the one who takes a bank note to let an undocumented person transit. For he deceives you into a false sense of 'security' as the other one fattens his wallet. It is easy, expedient, politically correct even to blame only the one who takes the bank note. And to stop at that, after all, the one soothing you with messages of peace strikes just the right cords.
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
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alma wrote:I've said enough for a long time to come.
I'm so bitter about all this I have no more words.
I wrote even during Westgate the very same things.
Corruption will kill your child. You will find it easy to blame a religion or some madman but the truth is, Kenyans are so corrupt they don't care anymore.
That's why the cop will take your 20 bob in your car and then go drive a bomb into a building. In the meantime, you will bring your stupid religions and say how nice you are.
You know in your hearts that someone was corrupted and got a big pay day for this to happen. I hope you choke on the beer he buys you on Furahiday.
Ni hayo tu. I cannot believe my dance with you is over! So soon! 
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