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Garissa university attack.
wazuaguest
#251 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:48:38 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 2/9/2012
Posts: 576
when you go to a police station to report a small time theft they harass you like its you who is on the wrong. If you know who stole they ask for pesa ya mafuta, by the time you are done you hate the damn police.Now in case of anything not many people will think about them.
A security analyst, I think its Mbijiwe said we should employ the Ethiopian model where a majority of the police come from the community, so you know your neighbour/friend/relative is a police officer.It's easier to report crimes and also they won't misbehave because they are serving 'their' people.
Africa belongs to Africans.
limanika
#252 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 8:36:59 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 2,032
At some point during MO1 time there was something called chief's Baraza, where the local chief would hold regular meetings at village level (I don't remember if these were monthly or quarterly). Everyone basically had to attend, romour was that if you are caught in your shamba or operating your shop at the time of mtg, you would be arrested. The chief basically knew everyone and everyone knew the chief. All matters security were discussed in this mtg. In such environment no one would harbour strangers. Now, for the last 10+years, I have never known who is my local chief, even now. What's the use of nyumba kumi if there's no reporting system?? Even the chiefs do not know if nyumba kumi is exisistent in my local??
Rahatupu
#253 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 10:02:04 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 1,982
Location: matano manne
limanika wrote:
At some point during MO1 time there was something called chief's Baraza, where the local chief would hold regular meetings at village level (I don't remember if these were monthly or quarterly). Everyone basically had to attend, romour was that if you are caught in your shamba or operating your shop at the time of mtg, you would be arrested. The chief basically knew everyone and everyone knew the chief. All matters security were discussed in this mtg. In such environment no one would harbour strangers. Now, for the last 10+years, I have never known who is my local chief, even now. What's the use of nyumba kumi if there's no reporting system?? Even the chiefs do not know if nyumba kumi is exisistent in my local??


@limanika well said about chief system which was a casualty of the constitution, where all things were looked at from a political angle. About the NIS passing paper is their new role can't arrest or preempt terror activities, why? politics. Sasa mbaya maisha mbaya.
Kihara joni
#254 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 11:13:12 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/8/2013
Posts: 386
Location: Nyali mombasa
Rahatupu wrote:
limanika wrote:
At some point during MO1 time there was something called chief's Baraza, where the local chief would hold regular meetings at village level (I don't remember if these were monthly or quarterly). Everyone basically had to attend, romour was that if you are caught in your shamba or operating your shop at the time of mtg, you would be arrested. The chief basically knew everyone and everyone knew the chief. All matters security were discussed in this mtg. In such environment no one would harbour strangers. Now, for the last 10+years, I have never known who is my local chief, even now. What's the use of nyumba kumi if there's no reporting system?? Even the chiefs do not know if nyumba kumi is exisistent in my local??


@limanika well said about chief system which was a casualty of the constitution, where all things were looked at from a political angle. About the NIS passing paper is their new role can't arrest or preempt terror activities, why? politics. Sasa mbaya maisha mbaya.

I read somewhere sometimes back that the CID or is is it NIS were stripped off the privilege of carrying a gun, so they can know and not anything about it apart from bark, which can be tiring knowing nothing will be done for any information shared no matter how big.
Kihara joni
#255 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 11:32:46 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/8/2013
Posts: 386
Location: Nyali mombasa
Reinhard ‏@Reinhard_Asamoh 1h1 hour ago
So Recce squad drove to Garissa for 5 hours while leaders took a police chopper. #GarissaAttack. Who needed to be there first?
limanika
#256 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 11:43:42 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 2,032
The other strategy used by MO1 is he had 3 basic chain sources if Intel. There was provincial administration, special branch and then some informal structure right from the village. This latter one was headed by Hezekiah oyugi at some point.At village level there was a chief, then headman(chiefs asstnt) and someone called Incharge at e lowest level. I understand for the 24yrs,MO1 used to wake up at 4am and by 8am, he had already talked to his informers at the grassroots and was aware of the security situation in every nook and cranny. Woe unto you if you were a DC or high ranking officer and if he calls you are not aware of the situation in your area. This whole system was dismantled when Kibaki came, and he started to rely 100% on official reports, same thing uhuruto is doing. I think this system it's not working especially in Neastern and coast, since officers will normally report what you want to hear
Euge
#257 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:06:00 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 8/4/2008
Posts: 2,849
Location: Rupi
wazuaguest wrote:
when you go to a police station to report a small time theft they harass you like its you who is on the wrong. If you know who stole they ask for pesa ya mafuta, by the time you are done you hate the damn police.Now in case of anything not many people will think about them.
A security analyst, I think its Mbijiwe said we should employ the Ethiopian model where a majority of the police come from the community, so you know your neighbour/friend/relative is a police officer.It's easier to report crimes and also they won't misbehave because they are serving 'their' people.


You can even be arrested!!!!!!!!!
Then they tell the criminals that it is you who reported the crime. So the thugs come baying for your blood.
Lord, thank you!
AlphDoti
#258 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:06:19 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
limanika wrote:
The other strategy used by MO1 is he had 3 basic chain sources if Intel. There was provincial administration, special branch and then some informal structure right from the village. This latter one was headed by Hezekiah oyugi at some point.At village level there was a chief, then headman(chiefs asstnt) and someone called Incharge at e lowest level. I understand for the 24yrs,MO1 used to wake up at 4am and by 8am, he had already talked to his informers at the grassroots and was aware of the security situation in every nook and cranny. Woe unto you if you were a DC or high ranking officer and if he calls you are not aware of the situation in your area. This whole system was dismantled when Kibaki came, and he started to rely 100% on official reports, same thing uhuruto is doing. I think this system it's not working especially in Neastern and coast, since officers will normally report what you want to hear

I think there is intentionally compromised. How would you explain M01 govt which was more effective compared to this day when we have mobiles, CCTV, cameras, better tools... yet we still do random raids!!!
AlphDoti
#259 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:14:50 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 6,275
Location: Kenya
alma
#260 Posted : Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:21:22 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/20/2007
Posts: 4,432
I'm happy to see limanika's posts and Boris as well.

In fact I was excited to see the new IG take advice on twirra and take his time to thank the person who gave an opinion.

That is what leaders are made off.

200 Kenyans dying means all of us have to take stock of what we are doing and leaders to listen to suggestions.

This former hashtag team's "if you aren't with us, you're with the terrorist" mentality has to go.

It is true the chief system provided better security than nyumba kumi. It's also true that the chief system was used primarily to blackmail citizens into harambees and hero worshiping. Is there a middle ground?

It is true that giving cops more money reduces corruption. But it's also true that the most corrupt cops, traffic cops, will never help anyone in times of need. Is there a middle ground?

It may look nice to have every police officer in the recce squad. But doesn't that mean that they too fall for the human weakness of feeling to hot for themselves and beating everyone they see on the streets just because. Just like Moi's elite CID's?

It's true as Rahatupu has always advocated that the intelligence unit needs operational powers not just pushing papers. But then this is Africa, we know what they did to Kenyans before, can we find a way to check rogue NSIS officers from molesting and beating up the citizenry?


It is true as Ahmednassir has said that those so called "al shabaab" were Kenyan citizens. So where did the rain beat us so that young Kenyans can see it as Godly to Kill other young Kenyans?

There has to be a middle ground in all this. We just can't have people dying every quarter as if its a safaricom quarterly report.

Those still living in the land of Eutopia blaming muslims are a problem to this menace. Al Shabaab has killed more Muslims than they have killed Kenyans.

My fear is a caliphate being created in NEP just because we as Kenyans have refused to listen to each other. Just because some fellows in THIS and PREVIOUS gov't just have to buy a new range rover. Just because, the President of this country seems to be a very nice guy.

Very nice guy my foot. 200 Kenyans died this weekend. No visit to the hospitals, make a statement then go talk to the rich people, say the west hates us then we are killed. It's not time for PR. It's time for action.

Fire every County Commander on who's watch an terrorism attack happened. Fire anyone who brings in bureaucratic nonsense instead of sending the RECCE Squad. Tell your MP's to take 10k off their salaries to just buy shoes for our policemen.

Someone needs to listen to Kenyans. We are not happy, we are depressed.

End corruption now. Implement the National Police Service Act. Get rid of political hanger's on. And take Kenyan's lives seriously. Or at least pretend its being taken seriously.
Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
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