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It's a presidential system
Rank: Elder Joined: 2/7/2007 Posts: 11,935 Location: Nairobi
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PSC settles for presidential system.President to be head of state and government,chair cabinet meetings,will not be an MPig and all ministers will not be MPigs either.....325 MPigs  ??...Whose idea is this   Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/29/2008 Posts: 1,566
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Thats good for us. The Naikunis, JMwangis., etc will be the ministers to run public affairs with a business sense, free of constituents issues to worry about as is the case with the Mp ministers. It's Kudos for me Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/5/2008 Posts: 174
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Before we celebrate,who will tame a rogue president in the likely event that we have one after 2012? For bookkeeping and bank loan interest recalculation try us:niando.becia@gmail.com
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/1/2009 Posts: 2,436
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good qstn by niando.
how will the president's powers be checked?
Dont tell me its that rogue Parliament to do so.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 2/7/2007 Posts: 11,935 Location: Nairobi
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@Niando, It is said checks will come from parliament,judiciary and regional governments.Don't ask how since i haven't seen the fine print. Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/5/2008 Posts: 174
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Presidential sysem has failed us since independence, a parliamentary system where the PM is elected directly by the people would have worked better.Both PM and President elected by the people. This would have created a win-win situation and helped us avoid the 2007 scenario. You mean we can count on the rogue judiciary/parliament to check an imperial president after 2012? My initial reservations to the PSC draft would be a NO.The outcomes seems too selfish and shortsighted. For bookkeeping and bank loan interest recalculation try us:niando.becia@gmail.com
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 5/31/2008 Posts: 1,076
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What we have had all this while was not a pure presidential system but a mixture of both presidential and Parliamentary, albeit in 60/40 ratio. May be thats where the rain begun beating us as the mongrel was only good at barking but no canines. Dunia ni msongamano..
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Rank: Elder Joined: 5/4/2008 Posts: 1,703
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The Mpigs are the ones to vet the ministers Think Positive Test Negative
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 6/17/2009 Posts: 1,619
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ALL appointments by the president will be vetted by parliament.What i cant fathom is another 100 mps,what for?.On the other hand let us see how many pretenders to the presidency will be left standing.
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Rank: New-farer Joined: 12/3/2009 Posts: 17
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The proposal can work only if proper checks n balances are put in place.....lets give these guys a chance..... AM NOT A SAINT, UNLESS A SAINT TO YOU IS A SINNER WHO KEEPS ON TRYING
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Rank: Elder Joined: 10/1/2009 Posts: 2,436
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@niando why do u want the PMpig & Preso both elected by the electorate? Then they will both demand both executive power, leading to 2 centres of power, confusion of a divided govt,etc?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/17/2008 Posts: 23,365 Location: Nairobi
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325 mPIGS is crap......who needs these numbers???? .......selfish decisions and compromises!!!! ..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
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Rank: Chief Joined: 8/24/2009 Posts: 5,909 Location: Nairobi
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Cabinet Ministers from outside parliament - I think is a good idea, what is shortsighted, is that the creation of this ministries may be a prerogative of the President (read appointment of cronies)..when a president can control parliament with a simple majority, then his/her(almost forgot this) word will become law. Aside from paying 325MPs' salaries, we will also be paying the cabinet ministers(wonder if they will get a new salary scale).
If the PM still comes from the party with majority seats, one side of this political divide will push for their constituencies to be split, hence the newly created posts for MPs will go to that party (NB: One man, One vote)
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/5/2008 Posts: 174
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Intelligensia, the aim is to have one center check on the other both directly elected by the people. The duties and responsibility of each center MUST BE WELL DEFINED. No one should cross the path of the other. 325 mpigs just helps me make a concrete NO decision. For bookkeeping and bank loan interest recalculation try us:niando.becia@gmail.com
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/2/2009 Posts: 2,458 Location: Nairobi
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yippie yeeee!!!
so now we can detach running ministries from running government.. i will vote for it, because of that one clause.
it has always been said, govt has no business running businesses.. lets get technocrats running this country like its a business.
President not being an MP... yet part of govt is good. Jokers take a walk. so how about the vice president?
indeed this detaches executive from parliament and judiciary...
we had a mongrel for long.. courtesy of Baba wa Taifa inner circles.
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Rank: Member Joined: 10/9/2009 Posts: 311
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This attempt at pleasing everybody is something that can spiral endlessly. The end result of trying to please everybody is eventually upsetting everyone. We would have moved from 2 centres of power of a Prezzo and PM to 3 centres of power of a Prezzo, PM, Governor-General to 4 centres of power of PM, Prezzo, Governor-General and an Emperor...ad infinitum. By 2030 we will be having NGOs advocating for 30 positions of central power each checking the other. With each centre of power's primary job description being to check the other centres of powers, the end result is zero work gets done. The hybrid as defined by this draft was always utopian esp. considering the circumstances under which both the PM and Prezzo would assume office. Pure presidential or pure parliamentary is the way to go I think. And either can work perfectly as long as they are well structured. Katika Jangwa la Jangili ndipo Pwagu hupata Pwaguzi.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 5/30/2009 Posts: 1,390
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I was fearing they wld go for a parliamentary system.then the pattnis n karumes of this world would rule over us.thank God for the consensus! What a wicked man I am!The things I want to do,I don't do.The things I don't want to do I find myself doing
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Rank: Member Joined: 11/10/2009 Posts: 23
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Happy belated new year to all Skerians ehhh Wazuarians or whatever.
Anyways, i have some beef with wazua. Why is the site unavailable on most nights and almost all weekends ? I hope this is just a glitch that comes with launching a new site.Some of us are on different time zones.
Getting back to Njunge's discussion, these Mpigs have decided to adopt the American system almost word for word.
Question is with our corrupt ways and the ridiculous levels of impunity, can this system work in our beloved country where almost everything (politically) is up for sale?
I like the checks and balances aspect of it especially when it comes to appointing Cabinet Ministers, Judges and other senior govt officials.
I also like the fact that most Mpigs will hopefully be motivated to join politics to represent their constituents and not just so that they could join the Cabinet or feast on our taxpayer shillings.
The idea of more Mpigs is crazy unless all or most the new Mpigs represent women, disabled and other minority groups thus providing a balancing effect. However, i wonder if we could afford all these salaries considering we are taxed to death while these Mpigs are just getting fatter by the day.
All i can say is that It took the U.S more than 200 years to mature and i wonder if we have it in us to move in the same direction with corruption embedded in our psyche starting with the very top. This has become a part of our daily lives.Picture this, if you are transporting something from say Nakuru to Nairobi, you will probably have to pay something along the way. We are not called Nchi ya kitu kidogo for nothing !
Till the day impunity is severely punished,i don't hold much hope. However considering all options, it is probably the best option for now.
I am sorry to say this but what Kenya needs right now is a Paul Kagame, a benevolent Dictator who will not accept corruption and impunity and who will punish the same severely. Hi mambo ya kitu kidogo must end. I really admire the way he is running Rwanda.
Look at what these Somali Pirates are doing to our economy/real estate sector and what is this corrupt govt doing. Nothing, absolutely nothing. People cannot even afford a house in Buru anymore ! This is just ridiculous.Its not even funny anymore.I am so pissed !!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/19/2008 Posts: 4,268
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Actually, the constitution as is this far is good enough to change this country. It now calls upon each and every kenyan to do their part and vote in the proper leaders who are not corrupt, be more proactive in politics so that we demand for accountability from the person we have put there instead of grumbling at the back seat and doing nothing.. its upon us to stop voting in "our" sons and daughters and vote in people of integrity who do not have to dish out handouts to get to the position... the minute we agree to be compromised from the beginning, is the minute we give the corruption certificate to these mpigs and those in power.
Am not in support of 320+ mps, but if eveyrone was doing their job and there was no corruption, we can easily pay all of them without even adding extra taxes.... look at all the money we have lost over the years over corruption - the oil, maize, water ministry, roads etc... 320+ mps only is not an enough reason to vote this constitution NO because there are way too many good things in it and i dint expect a perfect document anyway because my perfection will be anothers imperfection and we shall end up in circles trying to please everyone.
With proper leaders, this constitution could be the best in the world.... who said raila, mk, uk, mislov, km will rule this country for ever? We have the powers to make sure that we have the right person up there, everything else will flow smooth. The ball is on our court.
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 1/7/2010 Posts: 1,279 Location: nbi
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Talk about a dog chasing its own tail. We spend 20 years and almost Ksh20bn yapping about a new constitution that among other things, gets rid of the imperial president and then we arrive at the conclusion that an imperial president is a good thing! Just to make it even worse, we are giving him the powers to select non-elected memmbers of his family;tribe;golf;clan;church;religion et al as ministers... The Governor of Nyeri - 2017
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