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Centum 2014 business card
Ericsson
#21 Posted : Friday, August 01, 2014 9:03:29 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,809
Location: NAIROBI
The amount of debt this company is taking is getting toxic and it may go burst when the investments refuse to generate the expected returns.
In the annual report one of the key shareholder UAP is reducing stake in the company slowly.
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
tom_boy
#22 Posted : Friday, August 01, 2014 2:35:57 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 2/20/2007
Posts: 767
According to business daily, Centum execs earn about 1 million Ksh a month. That is ok with me. They then earn about 14m each in bonus last year. This is also okay. What is ridiculous is the method of calculating the bonus. It is based on appreciation in asset value which can easily be manipulated. In addition, why pay fat cash bonuses based on a non cash increase in value and yet claim you cant pay dividends..... Ukora kabisa.... And I thought wakora were only in parliament.
They must find it difficult....... those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority. -G. Massey.
Realtreaty
#23 Posted : Friday, August 01, 2014 4:02:58 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 8/16/2011
Posts: 2,387
There we go again, Big muscles.smile smile Applause
Centumbids for majority stake in K-Rep bank
Aguytrying
#24 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 8:58:32 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 5,040
tom_boy wrote:
According to business daily, Centum execs earn about 1 million Ksh a month. That is ok with me. They then earn about 14m each in bonus last year. This is also okay. What is ridiculous is the method of calculating the bonus. It is based on appreciation in asset value which can easily be manipulated. In addition, why pay fat cash bonuses based on a non cash increase in value and yet claim you cant pay dividends..... Ukora kabisa.... And I thought wakora were only in parliament.


companies that do not pay dividends are dishonest, and here is the proof
The investor's chief problem - and even his worst enemy - is likely to be himself
icecube
#25 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 12:45:11 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/2/2008
Posts: 268
Location: Nairobi
Aguytrying wrote:
tom_boy wrote:
According to business daily, Centum execs earn about 1 million Ksh a month. That is ok with me. They then earn about 14m each in bonus last year. This is also okay. What is ridiculous is the method of calculating the bonus. It is based on appreciation in asset value which can easily be manipulated. In addition, why pay fat cash bonuses based on a non cash increase in value and yet claim you cant pay dividends..... Ukora kabisa.... And I thought wakora were only in parliament.


companies that do not pay dividends are dishonest, and here is the proof


They earn millions in salaries and bonuses which are dubiously calculated? If you own shares in this company, did you factor in these issues in your research? or which fundamentals?.. asking for a friend..
mv_ufanisi
#26 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 2:00:56 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/15/2010
Posts: 625
You have to be willing to pay for quality. Simple as that. At least with Centum you know your money is not getting siphoned away a la MSC. Based on the performance they are definitely worth the money - they are definitely hustling to get this company going. Compare them with Transcentury for example, top salaries but poor execution. Ofcourse there has to be a cap on employee compensation and it makes more sense to pay the bonus in company shares than cash. It would be interesting to compare Centum compensation with other companies as well to get a feel. These guys are making 300,000 USD a year, they're definitely lucky.
icecube
#27 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 2:44:17 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 1/2/2008
Posts: 268
Location: Nairobi
Instead of paying themselves millions in bonuses, why don't they reward loyal shareholders with even bonus shares then?
tom_boy
#28 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 3:22:40 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 2/20/2007
Posts: 767
mv_ufanisi wrote:
You have to be willing to pay for quality. Simple as that. At least with Centum you know your money is not getting siphoned away a la MSC. Based on the performance they are definitely worth the money - they are definitely hustling to get this company going. Compare them with Transcentury for example, top salaries but poor execution. Ofcourse there has to be a cap on employee compensation and it makes more sense to pay the bonus in company shares than cash. It would be interesting to compare Centum compensation with other companies as well to get a feel. These guys are making 300,000 USD a year, they're definitely lucky.


The issue for me is not the amount paid out. It is the way the bonus is calculated. Why cant the bonus be based on increase in cash profits to the company. The idea of all these investments is to make a cash return. Therefore, bonus should be based on how well the execs convert the assets into cash earnings. This is a more objective way of doing things. Basing bonus on growth in asset value is deceptive, open to manipulation and gives no incentive to invest in highest cash returning assets available. Asset value means nothing. Its what the asset puts into your pocket that matters.
They must find it difficult....... those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority. -G. Massey.
target1360
#29 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 8:34:21 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 5/14/2014
Posts: 289
Location: nairobi
tom_boy wrote:
mv_ufanisi wrote:
You have to be willing to pay for quality. Simple as that. At least with Centum you know your money is not getting siphoned away a la MSC. Based on the performance they are definitely worth the money - they are definitely hustling to get this company going. Compare them with Transcentury for example, top salaries but poor execution. Ofcourse there has to be a cap on employee compensation and it makes more sense to pay the bonus in company shares than cash. It would be interesting to compare Centum compensation with other companies as well to get a feel. These guys are making 300,000 USD a year, they're definitely lucky.


The issue for me is not the amount paid out. It is the way the bonus is calculated. Why cant the bonus be based on increase in cash profits to the company. The idea of all these investments is to make a cash return. Therefore, bonus should be based on how well the execs convert the assets into cash earnings. This is a more objective way of doing things. Basing bonus on growth in asset value is deceptive, open to manipulation and gives no incentive to invest in highest cash returning assets available. Asset value means nothing. Its what the asset puts into your pocket that matters.


reminds me of the wolf of w*llstreet where investors are sold illussion after illussion while the brokers read mgt take home the real hard cash in form of commissions and bonuses
Am in this stock but am not increasing my petty holdings anymore
I find satisfaction in owning great business,not trading them
VituVingiSana
#30 Posted : Sunday, August 03, 2014 10:09:14 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 18,350
Location: Nairobi
Aguytrying wrote:
tom_boy wrote:
According to business daily, Centum execs earn about 1 million Ksh a month. That is ok with me. They then earn about 14m each in bonus last year. This is also okay. What is ridiculous is the method of calculating the bonus. It is based on appreciation in asset value which can easily be manipulated. In addition, why pay fat cash bonuses based on a non cash increase in value and yet claim you cant pay dividends..... Ukora kabisa.... And I thought wakora were only in parliament.


companies that do not pay dividends are dishonest, and here is the proof
Good point/s by @tom_boy but @Aguy did you know Berkshire Hathaway doesn't pay dividends either while Olympia Capital does?
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
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