Wazua
»
Club SK
»
Politics
»
National Security Team - Uhuru must act...NOW!
Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
|
Swenani wrote:simonkabz wrote:1. The primary source of raw Intel way back during Baba Moi's and Onyatto's time were the chiefs, sub-chiefs and the likes. We have weakened that system completely. This is a huge part of the problem!
2. The NIS is officially the rich kids employment bureau!
3. Police.....we have limited their freedom of action......sijui IPOA, sijui a weak IG all in the name of human rights and procecting the activists from being clobbered when they riot on the streets. Attempting to free a cop from the command of his boss can only breed indiscipline and disloyalty.
4. Defence tulifunga minyororo na katiba. The situation is bordering on hopeless!
There goes the genesis of our problem. And many more. I think the primary source of intel during moi's era were the wanainchi who were special branch(NIS) without realizing that they were special branch(NIS). I know of a guy who used to be paid by the OCPD to provide information to the OCPD of the ongoings in the estate. That's why the KANU government could easily tell who had a running stomach, who came late at night, who was the drunkard of the estate, who was the petty thief etc. I think it worked, we have now made NIS a rich kids employment bureau who spend most of their time drinking in silly in bars(I have never know why those guys think information is gotten from bars and political rallies). I think in terms of collecting information, its only the citizens who can provide raw intel(of course if there is monetary rewards-Ask Boinet).Am sure thats how the western govts are able to collect intel in kenya by using the Kenyan wanainchi to provide them with intel and paying them for the info.Otherwise how do the western countries able to tell whatever is happening/being planned literally in every corner of the world yet they have very few CIA and ?or FBI guys here? Swenani, Intel. I think nothing today stops my sub chief and my chief from telling my DO and my Dc "Bwana DO/DC nimesikia hii na hii.". Except if the DO/DC is - how can I put it - seen as a "stranger" ,,,,,,, those things of ethnicity! I think that is the greatest weakening of the "system" - ethnicity. Intel.
|
|
|
Rank: User Joined: 8/15/2013 Posts: 13,237 Location: Vacuum
|
Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:simonkabz wrote:1. The primary source of raw Intel way back during Baba Moi's and Onyatto's time were the chiefs, sub-chiefs and the likes. We have weakened that system completely. This is a huge part of the problem!
2. The NIS is officially the rich kids employment bureau!
3. Police.....we have limited their freedom of action......sijui IPOA, sijui a weak IG all in the name of human rights and procecting the activists from being clobbered when they riot on the streets. Attempting to free a cop from the command of his boss can only breed indiscipline and disloyalty.
4. Defence tulifunga minyororo na katiba. The situation is bordering on hopeless!
There goes the genesis of our problem. And many more. I think the primary source of intel during moi's era were the wanainchi who were special branch(NIS) without realizing that they were special branch(NIS). I know of a guy who used to be paid by the OCPD to provide information to the OCPD of the ongoings in the estate. That's why the KANU government could easily tell who had a running stomach, who came late at night, who was the drunkard of the estate, who was the petty thief etc. I think it worked, we have now made NIS a rich kids employment bureau who spend most of their time drinking in silly in bars(I have never know why those guys think information is gotten from bars and political rallies). I think in terms of collecting information, its only the citizens who can provide raw intel(of course if there is monetary rewards-Ask Boinet).Am sure thats how the western govts are able to collect intel in kenya by using the Kenyan wanainchi to provide them with intel and paying them for the info.Otherwise how do the western countries able to tell whatever is happening/being planned literally in every corner of the world yet they have very few CIA and ?or FBI guys here? Swenani, Intel. I think nothing today stops my sub chief and my chief from telling my DO and my Dc "Bwana DO/DC nimesikia hii na hii.". Except if the DO/DC is - how can I put it - seen as a "stranger" ,,,,,,, those things of ethnicity! I think that is the greatest weakening of the "system" - ethnicity. Intel. But there is something today that stops Muriel as a villager in Turkana to Visit either the Chief,DO or OCPD and tell him of the goings on in his village since there is no monetary reward for Muriel which he was used to during Moi's era If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,635
|
McReggae wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:I have been told that sometimes government, and others, read Wazua. I hope they are doing so now.
Last year I posted the following:
2. It is clear that Kenya today has the weakest security team since Independence. This is is a major risk for the nation.
This fact is still true. President Uhuru must completely reorganize the national security team that he has, starting with Ole Lenku, who is clearly out of his depth.
If he must have a Maasai in the docket,may I suggest General (Rtd) Nkaissery for the post. He maybe CORD but, although he plays politics, Nkaissery is a soldier first and I am sure he will get the job done.
The current defense Minister needs to be moved to a new role too.
National security is too important to have novices in any critical position. What about the system? Don't you think it has undergone rot over time? A wise man once said that a fish rots from the head. The system can only be reformed starting from the top. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
|
|
|
Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
|
Swenani wrote:Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:simonkabz wrote:1. The primary source of raw Intel way back during Baba Moi's and Onyatto's time were the chiefs, sub-chiefs and the likes. We have weakened that system completely. This is a huge part of the problem!
2. The NIS is officially the rich kids employment bureau!
3. Police.....we have limited their freedom of action......sijui IPOA, sijui a weak IG all in the name of human rights and procecting the activists from being clobbered when they riot on the streets. Attempting to free a cop from the command of his boss can only breed indiscipline and disloyalty.
4. Defence tulifunga minyororo na katiba. The situation is bordering on hopeless!
There goes the genesis of our problem. And many more. I think the primary source of intel during moi's era were the wanainchi who were special branch(NIS) without realizing that they were special branch(NIS). I know of a guy who used to be paid by the OCPD to provide information to the OCPD of the ongoings in the estate. That's why the KANU government could easily tell who had a running stomach, who came late at night, who was the drunkard of the estate, who was the petty thief etc. I think it worked, we have now made NIS a rich kids employment bureau who spend most of their time drinking in silly in bars(I have never know why those guys think information is gotten from bars and political rallies). I think in terms of collecting information, its only the citizens who can provide raw intel(of course if there is monetary rewards-Ask Boinet).Am sure thats how the western govts are able to collect intel in kenya by using the Kenyan wanainchi to provide them with intel and paying them for the info.Otherwise how do the western countries able to tell whatever is happening/being planned literally in every corner of the world yet they have very few CIA and ?or FBI guys here? Swenani, Intel. I think nothing today stops my sub chief and my chief from telling my DO and my Dc "Bwana DO/DC nimesikia hii na hii.". Except if the DO/DC is - how can I put it - seen as a "stranger" ,,,,,,, those things of ethnicity! I think that is the greatest weakening of the "system" - ethnicity. Intel. But there is something today that stops Muriel as a villager in Turkana to Visit either the Chief,DO or OCPD and tell him of the goings on in his village since there is no monetary reward for Muriel which he was used to during Moi's era Maybe, Swenani, Most of the sub chief and chiefs work is done away from the office. In funerals, markets, opportunistic gatherings and such events. Sub chiefs and chiefs are one of the community members, so and so's uncle, a distant relative and such. I still think the disconnect starts higher up the ladder. With the DO and DC going up.
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,635
|
aemathenge wrote:I bet to differ.
The current crew is apt for the situation, now and into the future.
The current situation can not be likened to the past. This is new a animal all together.
The current crew is fast developing vital experience and options upon which to base the war against terror in particular and crime in general.
Cs. Ole Lenku and the Inspector General can only take so much flack. Sooner or later, when they really get their back against the wall from pressure from all and sundry, they are going to come out fighting and might just surprise us all. That is exactly the problem. You do not want people learning on the job, where lives are concerned, especially when there is much better talent the President could tap. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,635
|
Robinhood wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:I have been told that sometimes government, and others, read Wazua. I hope they are doing so now.
Last year I posted the following:
2. It is clear that Kenya today has the weakest security team since Independence. This is is a major risk for the nation.
This fact is still true. President Uhuru must completely reorganize the national security team that he has, starting with Ole Lenku, who is clearly out of his depth.
If he must have a Maasai in the docket,may I suggest General (Rtd) Nkaissery for the post. He maybe CORD but, although he plays politics, Nkaissery is a soldier first and I am sure he will get the job done.
The current defense Minister needs to be moved to a new role too.
National security is too important to have novices in any critical position. Actually, if some wazuans are to be believed, the security team is first class. It's Raila who is the problem. The real tragedy is that people in power, including the President and the Head of security it seems, believe this nonsense that Raila is behind insecurity in Kenya. It is actually scary when you think about it as it points to a government that seems to be rapidly running out of ideas. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
|
|
|
Rank: User Joined: 8/15/2013 Posts: 13,237 Location: Vacuum
|
Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:simonkabz wrote:1. The primary source of raw Intel way back during Baba Moi's and Onyatto's time were the chiefs, sub-chiefs and the likes. We have weakened that system completely. This is a huge part of the problem!
2. The NIS is officially the rich kids employment bureau!
3. Police.....we have limited their freedom of action......sijui IPOA, sijui a weak IG all in the name of human rights and procecting the activists from being clobbered when they riot on the streets. Attempting to free a cop from the command of his boss can only breed indiscipline and disloyalty.
4. Defence tulifunga minyororo na katiba. The situation is bordering on hopeless!
There goes the genesis of our problem. And many more. I think the primary source of intel during moi's era were the wanainchi who were special branch(NIS) without realizing that they were special branch(NIS). I know of a guy who used to be paid by the OCPD to provide information to the OCPD of the ongoings in the estate. That's why the KANU government could easily tell who had a running stomach, who came late at night, who was the drunkard of the estate, who was the petty thief etc. I think it worked, we have now made NIS a rich kids employment bureau who spend most of their time drinking in silly in bars(I have never know why those guys think information is gotten from bars and political rallies). I think in terms of collecting information, its only the citizens who can provide raw intel(of course if there is monetary rewards-Ask Boinet).Am sure thats how the western govts are able to collect intel in kenya by using the Kenyan wanainchi to provide them with intel and paying them for the info.Otherwise how do the western countries able to tell whatever is happening/being planned literally in every corner of the world yet they have very few CIA and ?or FBI guys here? Swenani, Intel. I think nothing today stops my sub chief and my chief from telling my DO and my Dc "Bwana DO/DC nimesikia hii na hii.". Except if the DO/DC is - how can I put it - seen as a "stranger" ,,,,,,, those things of ethnicity! I think that is the greatest weakening of the "system" - ethnicity. Intel. But there is something today that stops Muriel as a villager in Turkana to Visit either the Chief,DO or OCPD and tell him of the goings on in his village since there is no monetary reward for Muriel which he was used to during Moi's era Maybe, Swenani, Most of the sub chief and chiefs work is done away from the office. In funerals, markets, opportunistic gatherings and such events. Sub chiefs and chiefs are one of the community members, so and so's uncle, a distant relative and such. I still think the disconnect starts higher up the ladder. With the DO and DC going up. What you are saying its true to a certain extent and maybe; only applicable in villagers. Tell me how many residents in Nairobi know their chiefs, assistant chiefs,D.O or even their offices? That's why when Kibaki took over people were complaining that pesa imepotea haifiki mashinani coz kibaki wanted to "professionalize" intelligence services. Moi's system was working quite well If Obiero did it, Who Am I?
|
|
|
Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
|
Swenani wrote:Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:simonkabz wrote:1. The primary source of raw Intel way back during Baba Moi's and Onyatto's time were the chiefs, sub-chiefs and the likes. We have weakened that system completely. This is a huge part of the problem!
2. The NIS is officially the rich kids employment bureau!
3. Police.....we have limited their freedom of action......sijui IPOA, sijui a weak IG all in the name of human rights and procecting the activists from being clobbered when they riot on the streets. Attempting to free a cop from the command of his boss can only breed indiscipline and disloyalty.
4. Defence tulifunga minyororo na katiba. The situation is bordering on hopeless!
There goes the genesis of our problem. And many more. I think the primary source of intel during moi's era were the wanainchi who were special branch(NIS) without realizing that they were special branch(NIS). I know of a guy who used to be paid by the OCPD to provide information to the OCPD of the ongoings in the estate. That's why the KANU government could easily tell who had a running stomach, who came late at night, who was the drunkard of the estate, who was the petty thief etc. I think it worked, we have now made NIS a rich kids employment bureau who spend most of their time drinking in silly in bars(I have never know why those guys think information is gotten from bars and political rallies). I think in terms of collecting information, its only the citizens who can provide raw intel(of course if there is monetary rewards-Ask Boinet).Am sure thats how the western govts are able to collect intel in kenya by using the Kenyan wanainchi to provide them with intel and paying them for the info.Otherwise how do the western countries able to tell whatever is happening/being planned literally in every corner of the world yet they have very few CIA and ?or FBI guys here? Swenani, Intel. I think nothing today stops my sub chief and my chief from telling my DO and my Dc "Bwana DO/DC nimesikia hii na hii.". Except if the DO/DC is - how can I put it - seen as a "stranger" ,,,,,,, those things of ethnicity! I think that is the greatest weakening of the "system" - ethnicity. Intel. But there is something today that stops Muriel as a villager in Turkana to Visit either the Chief,DO or OCPD and tell him of the goings on in his village since there is no monetary reward for Muriel which he was used to during Moi's era Maybe, Swenani, Most of the sub chief and chiefs work is done away from the office. In funerals, markets, opportunistic gatherings and such events. Sub chiefs and chiefs are one of the community members, so and so's uncle, a distant relative and such. I still think the disconnect starts higher up the ladder. With the DO and DC going up. What you are saying its true to a certain extent and maybe; only applicable in villagers. Tell me how many residents in Nairobi know their chiefs, assistant chiefs,D.O or even their offices? That's why when Kibaki took over people were complaining that pesa imepotea haifiki mashinani coz kibaki wanted to "professionalize" intelligence services. Moi's system was working quite well Indeed. Until you mentioned it, I did not realise I was thinking in terms of mashambani. Laugh Laugh Laugh You are right!
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 10/18/2008 Posts: 3,434 Location: Kerugoya
|
Wakanyugi wrote:aemathenge wrote:I bet to differ.
The current crew is apt for the situation, now and into the future.
The current situation can not be likened to the past. This is new a animal all together.
The current crew is fast developing vital experience and options upon which to base the war against terror in particular and crime in general.
Cs. Ole Lenku and the Inspector General can only take so much flack. Sooner or later, when they really get their back against the wall from pressure from all and sundry, they are going to come out fighting and might just surprise us all. That is exactly the problem. You do not want people learning on the job, where lives are concerned, especially when there is much better talent the President could tap. Again, I beg to differ. In the past, we had one "crisis" at a time confronting the head of internal security in particular and the Head of State in general. Today, you have Mpeketoni, Baringo, terror attacks, mungiki, wildlife poaching, corruption, an ineffective Office of the Public Prosecutor letting out security risk suspects out on bond, constitutionally created road blocks, the ICC, and the social media fueled by cheap bundles and wide access to the internet via mobile gadgets, you name it. And to this the challenges of some areas suffering drought while others are about to experience the el nino. Add to this the fact that the Police fear being "taken to the Hague" like Gen. Hussein Ali for "doing" their job. Add to this the many many more politicians on the public pay list and out of it. Add to this the fact that the Police Officers are faced with the lack of support systems such as good housing and trade craft equipment. I read somewhere that the new admissions into the force are sleeping in canteens for lack of accommodation. All these are balls in the air that need jiggling with which no past head of internal security has had to deal with. In view of the foregoing, we have the same situation that faced the US after the fall of the Berlin Wall (Read Communism) and after 9/11. Nobody had "experience" or "expertise". Everybody had to learn on the "go". And hence my point. The heads are the best "experts". Any new person(s) will have to start the learning curve from zero all over again.
|
|
|
Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
|
Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:Muriel wrote:Swenani wrote:simonkabz wrote:1. The primary source of raw Intel way back during Baba Moi's and Onyatto's time were the chiefs, sub-chiefs and the likes. We have weakened that system completely. This is a huge part of the problem!
2. The NIS is officially the rich kids employment bureau!
3. Police.....we have limited their freedom of action......sijui IPOA, sijui a weak IG all in the name of human rights and procecting the activists from being clobbered when they riot on the streets. Attempting to free a cop from the command of his boss can only breed indiscipline and disloyalty.
4. Defence tulifunga minyororo na katiba. The situation is bordering on hopeless!
There goes the genesis of our problem. And many more. I think the primary source of intel during moi's era were the wanainchi who were special branch(NIS) without realizing that they were special branch(NIS). I know of a guy who used to be paid by the OCPD to provide information to the OCPD of the ongoings in the estate. That's why the KANU government could easily tell who had a running stomach, who came late at night, who was the drunkard of the estate, who was the petty thief etc. I think it worked, we have now made NIS a rich kids employment bureau who spend most of their time drinking in silly in bars(I have never know why those guys think information is gotten from bars and political rallies). I think in terms of collecting information, its only the citizens who can provide raw intel(of course if there is monetary rewards-Ask Boinet).Am sure thats how the western govts are able to collect intel in kenya by using the Kenyan wanainchi to provide them with intel and paying them for the info.Otherwise how do the western countries able to tell whatever is happening/being planned literally in every corner of the world yet they have very few CIA and ?or FBI guys here? Swenani, Intel. I think nothing today stops my sub chief and my chief from telling my DO and my Dc "Bwana DO/DC nimesikia hii na hii.". Except if the DO/DC is - how can I put it - seen as a "stranger" ,,,,,,, those things of ethnicity! I think that is the greatest weakening of the "system" - ethnicity. Intel. But there is something today that stops Muriel as a villager in Turkana to Visit either the Chief,DO or OCPD and tell him of the goings on in his village since there is no monetary reward for Muriel which he was used to during Moi's era Maybe, Swenani, Most of the sub chief and chiefs work is done away from the office. In funerals, markets, opportunistic gatherings and such events. Sub chiefs and chiefs are one of the community members, so and so's uncle, a distant relative and such. I still think the disconnect starts higher up the ladder. With the DO and DC going up. What you are saying its true to a certain extent and maybe; only applicable in villagers. Tell me how many residents in Nairobi know their chiefs, assistant chiefs,D.O or even their offices? That's why when Kibaki took over people were complaining that pesa imepotea haifiki mashinani coz kibaki wanted to "professionalize" intelligence services. Moi's system was working quite well Indeed. Until you mentioned it, I did not realise I was thinking in terms of mashambani. Laugh Laugh Laugh You are right! And I am also still right!
|
|
|
Wazua
»
Club SK
»
Politics
»
National Security Team - Uhuru must act...NOW!
Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.
|