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Sudan women face death for Christianity
Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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Lolest! wrote:i am shocked that Mohammedans are waiting for a presently dead person to intercede for them. At whichever point this dead fellow intercedes for them. Interesting! @lonest! interesting indeed to see you again missing the point. There is nowhere anybody said or any hadith that says after the dead of the prophet, any of the people prayed to him or through him. The prophet left us with Islam. The complete way of life that governs all facets of life, moral, spiritual, political, economical, intellectual etc. The "religion" and "way of life" brings human being back to the natural state of humility, piety, peace and submission. Islam calls people away from the worship of " creation" and calls them towards the worship of the " Creator" and the concept of monotheism uniting us all under one God. @lonest! I hope that is clear? read the previous posts to understand where we came from about intercession.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti, 'abstaction' is relevant in this case. Why? Without it Man wouldn't be able to reason.
But perhaps to enhance our conversation I will ask you to kindly show me what I have 'abstracted' then I can clarify my objective. You see what I meant is, set is more of abstraction and manifestation blah, blah! Alright, let us give it a try: I = Islam C = Christianity Q = Quran H = Hadith C1 = Christianity words of God C2 = Christianity words of the prophets C3 = Christianity words of the writers N = null set (I don't want us to use null set) I = {Q, H, C1, C2*} NB: *not in the exact words C = {C1, C2, C3} H = C2* NB: * not exact words C is not a subset of I C is not equal to I Let us agree we can amend an erroneous basic assumption above, if we find further truth along the way. Thank you @AlphDoti. I also agree that we can amend erroneous assumptions as we discover the truth. Now please refer to my post #91 http://www.wazua.co.ke/f...amp;m=554693#post554693
And see the premises of my argument that if the above premises are true then neither I or C can claim to be 'the truth'. Please verify that the condition for either I or C to be 'the truth', one must be a subset of the other. @tycho can you show how truth is manifested. Please define 'the truth'. Very well. I define truth as a cognitive quality of propositions, arguments, or formulae exchanged among humans, or systems that relies on axioms that are 'complete' or 'exhaustive' and 'consistent', and useful in resolving commonly perceived problems or queries. So to show 'truth' I'd have to show the above conditions are met. How would you go about defining and demonstrating 'the truth'?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 6/20/2008 Posts: 6,275 Location: Kenya
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tycho wrote:AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti, 'abstaction' is relevant in this case. Why? Without it Man wouldn't be able to reason.
But perhaps to enhance our conversation I will ask you to kindly show me what I have 'abstracted' then I can clarify my objective. You see what I meant is, set is more of abstraction and manifestation blah, blah! Alright, let us give it a try: I = Islam C = Christianity Q = Quran H = Hadith C1 = Christianity words of God C2 = Christianity words of the prophets C3 = Christianity words of the writers N = null set (I don't want us to use null set) I = {Q, H, C1, C2*} NB: *not in the exact words C = {C1, C2, C3} H = C2* NB: * not exact words C is not a subset of I C is not equal to I Let us agree we can amend an erroneous basic assumption above, if we find further truth along the way. Thank you @AlphDoti. I also agree that we can amend erroneous assumptions as we discover the truth. Now please refer to my post #91 http://www.wazua.co.ke/f...amp;m=554693#post554693
And see the premises of my argument that if the above premises are true then neither I or C can claim to be 'the truth'. Please verify that the condition for either I or C to be 'the truth', one must be a subset of the other. @tycho can you show how truth is manifested. Please define 'the truth'. Very well. I define truth as a cognitive quality of propositions, arguments, or formulae exchanged among humans, or systems that relies on axioms that are 'complete' or 'exhaustive' and 'consistent', and useful in resolving commonly perceived problems or queries. So to show 'truth' I'd have to show the above conditions are met. How would you go about defining and demonstrating 'the truth'? What are the elements of the sets? Start from there, then we can analyse.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
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AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti, 'abstaction' is relevant in this case. Why? Without it Man wouldn't be able to reason.
But perhaps to enhance our conversation I will ask you to kindly show me what I have 'abstracted' then I can clarify my objective. You see what I meant is, set is more of abstraction and manifestation blah, blah! Alright, let us give it a try: I = Islam C = Christianity Q = Quran H = Hadith C1 = Christianity words of God C2 = Christianity words of the prophets C3 = Christianity words of the writers N = null set (I don't want us to use null set) I = {Q, H, C1, C2*} NB: *not in the exact words C = {C1, C2, C3} H = C2* NB: * not exact words C is not a subset of I C is not equal to I Let us agree we can amend an erroneous basic assumption above, if we find further truth along the way. Thank you @AlphDoti. I also agree that we can amend erroneous assumptions as we discover the truth. Now please refer to my post #91 http://www.wazua.co.ke/f...amp;m=554693#post554693
And see the premises of my argument that if the above premises are true then neither I or C can claim to be 'the truth'. Please verify that the condition for either I or C to be 'the truth', one must be a subset of the other. @tycho can you show how truth is manifested. Please define 'the truth'. Very well. I define truth as a cognitive quality of propositions, arguments, or formulae exchanged among humans, or systems that relies on axioms that are 'complete' or 'exhaustive' and 'consistent', and useful in resolving commonly perceived problems or queries. So to show 'truth' I'd have to show the above conditions are met. How would you go about defining and demonstrating 'the truth'? What are the elements of the sets? Start from there, then we can analyse. I believe the set definitions you have provided are adequate for now.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Lolest! wrote:i am shocked that Mohammedans are waiting for a presently dead person to intercede for them. At whichever point this dead fellow intercedes for them. Interesting! The "dead fellow" intercedes on Judgement day! And only if Allah allows him to... Everyone who ever lived will be alive on judgement day! We cannot pray directly to Muhammad.. That is a major sin called Shirk! Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Lolest! wrote:Infact, Jesus declares that he is the only way. He further says that NO ONE goes to the Father except by him. Jesus said HE is the only way to heaven... He did not say Christianity is the only way to heaven! By the time Jesus was taken to heaven nothing like Christianity or a single church even existed.. And i'm not sure he would approve!  In Islam we follow Muhammad who followed the way of Christ.. Most Muslims try to follow the way of Christ through piety, prayer, fasting, monotheism and charity... In fact failure to do some of the above can make one a disbeliever! Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/11/2012 Posts: 5,222
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guru267 wrote:Lolest! wrote:Infact, Jesus declares that he is the only way. He further says that NO ONE goes to the Father except by him. Jesus said HE is the only way to heaven... He did not say Christianity is the only way to heaven! By the time Jesus was taken to heaven nothing like Christianity or a single church even existed.. And i'm not sure he would approve! In Islam we follow Muhammad who followed the way of Christ.. Most Muslims try to follow the way of Christ through piety, prayer, fasting, monotheism and charity... In fact failure to do some of the above can make one a disbeliever! ORAIT, So Jesus Christ would not approve of Christianity? OKEI. But He'd approve of Islam? Is it because of the spelling, ama?  Ati Muslims follow Muhamed, who followed... That Muhamed ni shortcut, ama? Si you just follow Christ mara moja? smh And if Muhamed followed Christ, whats with all his wars? Christ never took up arms. Mohamed fought three wars, no? Yenyewe, I never wish anybody harm... but maybe you'd be more emphatic, if you were caught in a crossfire, when those you support, launch their attacks...in the name of revenge. Do women also get 70 virgins? No more njaa?
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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lol..on one hand you say that guy who is buried in medina wont intercede. On the other, he, a mere man shall intercede. Decide on that. Jesus is God's begotten son (Jn 3:16) stop comparing him to the prophets, Jewish patriachs and muhammad. Our God can't be the same as your god. Jesus told us there will be no marriage in heaven. Your book, which your supreme gave you, promises a very carnal heaven where u r promised perpetual virgins, endless erections and sweetest copulation.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/17/2013 Posts: 4,693 Location: Earth
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AlphDoti wrote:tycho wrote:AlphDoti, 'abstaction' is relevant in this case. Why? Without it Man wouldn't be able to reason.
But perhaps to enhance our conversation I will ask you to kindly show me what I have 'abstracted' then I can clarify my objective. You see what I meant is, set is more of abstraction and manifestation blah, blah! Alright, let us give it a try: I = Islam C = Christianity Q = Quran H = Hadith C1 = Christianity words of God C2 = Christianity words of the prophets C3 = Christianity words of the writers N = null set (I don't want us to use null set) I = {Q, H, C1, C2*} NB: *not in the exact words C = {C1, C2, C3} H = C2* NB: * not exact words C is not a subset of I C is not equal to I Let us agree we can amend an erroneous basic assumption above, if we find further truth along the way. Whoa!!Sasa hii dini imekuwa molecular concept!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
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Mukiri wrote:ORAIT, So Jesus Christ would not approve of Christianity? OKEI. 1. Jesus never ate swine so I wonder if would approve. 2. Jesus only prayed to God so I wonder if would approve people praying to him 3. Jesus never saw an drawn image or a carved statue of himself so I wonder if he would approve. 4. Jesus wanted us to focus on his life so I wonder if he would approve of people focusing on his death 5. Jesus said he was just a servant and messenger of God so i wonder if he would approve people calling him God! Mukiri wrote:Ati Muslims follow Muhamed, who followed... That Muhamed ni shortcut, ama? Si you just follow Christ mara moja? smh We would have followed him direct but Christ said that John 16:5 must be fulfilled.. Then came Paul to pervert the words of Christ! Mukiri wrote:And if Muhamed followed Christ, whats with all his wars? Christ never took up arms. Mohamed fought three wars, no? Muhammad followed both Christ and Moses as Christ already approved in Matt 5:17 Christ introduced new things but did not condemn the wars fought by David and Moses! Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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