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Kwisha, Kibaki aendi Mweiga.
washiku
#21 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:04:43 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
AlphDoti wrote:
@tycho I must say I understood all of your post above, man keep up you've become very considerate to laymen like us!

@alba I have your same amazement too. This is what you get when you kill your opposition. When I read "Jubiree" people always singing and not realizing anything wrong with some garment actions, I realize even the learned here cannot help this country. The elite are no longer honest to themselves, just support because "it's my people" and loose interest of the country.


Wow...Jubiree must be such a super performer. They built a palatial home for Kibaki even before they were elected?
Wainadi
#22 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 3:07:32 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 8/6/2013
Posts: 640
washiku wrote:
AlphDoti wrote:
@tycho I must say I understood all of your post above, man keep up you've become very considerate to laymen like us!

@alba I have your same amazement too. This is what you get when you kill your opposition. When I read "Jubiree" people always singing and not realizing anything wrong with some garment actions, I realize even the learned here cannot help this country. The elite are no longer honest to themselves, just support because "it's my people" and loose interest of the country.


Wow...Jubiree must be such a super performer. They built a palatial home for Kibaki even before they were elected?

Its stipulated in the presidential retirement benefits and jubilee or anyone else who would have won, has nothing to do with it.
Its all good.
washiku
#23 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 3:19:07 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
Wainadi wrote:
washiku wrote:
AlphDoti wrote:
@tycho I must say I understood all of your post above, man keep up you've become very considerate to laymen like us!

@alba I have your same amazement too. This is what you get when you kill your opposition. When I read "Jubiree" people always singing and not realizing anything wrong with some garment actions, I realize even the learned here cannot help this country. The elite are no longer honest to themselves, just support because "it's my people" and loose interest of the country.


Wow...Jubiree must be such a super performer. They built a palatial home for Kibaki even before they were elected?

Its stipulated in the presidential retirement benefits and jubilee or anyone else who would have won, has nothing to do with it.


That is my point. The house was built even before elections but @Alph want us to believe its Jubiree that built it.
Alba
#24 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:00:04 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
Kibaki has given himself retirement gifts as if he was some Mandela like Statesman. This is a man who led Kenya for 10 years and never addressed corruption, never reduced unemployment and actually worsened tribalism and crime spiralled during his reign. . This is a man who inherited a Kenya that was united behind him and ended up turning Kenyans into bitter enemies. This is a man who is mostly responsible for PEV 2007.

And its not like he and his family needs it. He already became supremely wealthy during his days as finance minister in the 1970s. He has already amassed so much land. Only the Kenyatta and Moi families have more land than Kibaki. But somehow he saw it fit to take such huge perks in retirement. Most people with a conscience could not sleep at night. But clearly Kibaki lacks a conscience
Once again all I can do is smile at the situation and shake my head, smile smile smile .
Kratos
#25 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:16:29 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 1,694
Alba wrote:
Kibaki has given himself retirement gifts as if he was some Mandela like Statesman. This is a man who led Kenya for 10 years and never addressed corruption, never reduced unemployment and actually worsened tribalism and crime spiralled during his reign. . This is a man who inherited a Kenya that was united behind him and ended up turning Kenyans into bitter enemies. This is a man who is mostly responsible for PEV 2007.

And its not like he and his family needs it. He already became supremely wealthy during his days as finance minister in the 1970s. He has already amassed so much land. Only the Kenyatta and Moi families have more land than Kibaki. But somehow he saw it fit to take such huge perks in retirement. Most people with a conscience could not sleep at night. But clearly Kibaki lacks a conscience
Once again all I can do is smile at the situation and shake my head, smile smile smile .


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly You're joking right?

“People will believe a big lie sooner than a little one, and if you repeat it frequently enough, people will sooner or later believe it.” ― Walter C. Langer
Alba
#26 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:26:04 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/27/2012
Posts: 2,256
Location: Bandalungwa
tycho wrote:


@Alba, what you're recommending is worse politics than the one being played now. The citizens don't get mugged because police are ill equipped, but because they live in 'prisons'. The slum dwellers don't need a government that builds them houses, they need confidence and leadership that will allow them to build their own homes or afford decent housing. 'We' don't need roads built just because there's money but because active engagement of the citizen creates opportunities and income that can build and sustain infrastructure.

I get the feeling that the more we complain about our government and country the worse we get because we stick to status quo ideas of 'serikali' being the source of all good things just like it happened in 'animal farm'.

We need a different political paradigm.


You are dead wrong:

1. Poorly equipped and outnumbered police force emboldens criminals. There is one police station serving all of Kibera a slum with 500,000 people. No wonder criminals are so brazen.

You can make Nairobi safer by via more street lights , more police stations and police posts, CCTV cameras, more police patrols, better trained policemen, databases to track criminals etc. In some cases policemen do not even have petrol to go after thieves.

2. Every responsible government builds low cost housing, be it the USA or UK or wherever.

It is laughable for you to say all they need is confidence to build their own homes. You must be one of those that was born with a silver spoon. Most Kenyan middle class types cant even build their own homes and you think slum dwellers can build homes ? Reality please !

3. Serikali is not the source of all good things. But it must get its priorities right.

Instead of palatial homes, why not build better infrastructure to enhance economic activity ? So much Productivity is lost in constant traffic jams. So much productivity is lost due to power outages.

Why not invest in making Kenya more secure ? This will bring more tourists.

Why not build social halls , basketball courts, football fields for the youth ? This will keep them busy and away from crime. Some of them might become good enough to earn a living from sports.

The colonial masters saw it fit to build housing for the poor and football fields for the youth. And even social halls. Kenya's best boxers were products of social halls like Muthurwa aka Dallas. Now such social hall are grabbed by bigwigs and Kenya is no longer good at boxing.

Virtually all the stadiums and football grounds in Kenya were built by the colonialists. The only exceptions are Nyayo and Kasarani. Sports can be a good source of revenue and employment. Yet instead of building sports facilities were are building palatial homes.

How is it possible that the colonial masters were kinder to Kenyans than our own leaders ?
tycho
#27 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:06:21 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
AlphDoti wrote:
@tycho I must say I understood all of your post above, man keep up you've become very considerate to laymen like us!

@alba I have your same amazement too. This is what you get when you kill your opposition. When I read "Jubiree" people always singing and not realizing anything wrong with some garment actions, I realize even the learned here cannot help this country. The elite are no longer honest to themselves, just support because "it's my people" and loose interest of the country.


It's not true that the opposition in Kenya has been killed by the government. The bottom line is Newton's third law of motion; 'to every action there's an opposite and equal reaction'.
tycho
#28 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:20:49 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
InnovateGuy wrote:
tycho wrote:
Alba wrote:
Yenyewe sometimes when I see the goings on in Kenya I think I am in the twilight zone. I did not even know a 500m home was built for Kibaki at taxpayer expense.

Yaani we have a country where 60% of urbanites live in slums with no water, no electricty and no dignity. And instead of building some housing for the urban poor, Kenya saw it fit to build a palatial home for Kibaki. He already has several palatial homes so its a no brainer that he was never going top use that home.

On top of that, 250m was spent building him an office. Why does a retiree need an office ?

Meanwhile Kenyans complain about Nairobi traffic all day. Yet this is money that could have been used say to expand roads and provide infrastructure.

Funny that Kibaki's home that nobody lives in is replete with state of the art security including an electric fence, two 6 metre concrete walls and various cameras manned by security. It is also guarded 24-7 by 12 GSU officers.

Meanwhile Kenyans are being mugged, carjacked and generally abused by gangsters because the police force is poorly staffed ,outnumbered is demoralized and poorly equipped.

Kweli Kenya ni nchi ya maajabu. All I can do is laugh at the absurdity of it all.


@Alba, what you're recommending is worse politics than the one being played now. The citizens don't get mugged because police are ill equipped, but because they live in 'prisons'. The slum dwellers don't need a government that builds them houses, they need confidence and leadership that will allow them to build their own homes or afford decent housing. 'We' don't need roads built just because there's money but because active engagement of the citizen creates opportunities and income that can build and sustain infrastructure.

I get the feeling that the more we complain about our government and country the worse we get because we stick to status quo ideas of 'serikali' being the source of all good things just like it happened in 'animal farm'.

We need a different political paradigm.


@ Tycho. Are you one of aliens? Thank you.


What do you mean @innovate?
tycho
#29 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:56:33 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Alba wrote:
tycho wrote:


@Alba, what you're recommending is worse politics than the one being played now. The citizens don't get mugged because police are ill equipped, but because they live in 'prisons'. The slum dwellers don't need a government that builds them houses, they need confidence and leadership that will allow them to build their own homes or afford decent housing. 'We' don't need roads built just because there's money but because active engagement of the citizen creates opportunities and income that can build and sustain infrastructure.

I get the feeling that the more we complain about our government and country the worse we get because we stick to status quo ideas of 'serikali' being the source of all good things just like it happened in 'animal farm'.

We need a different political paradigm.


You are dead wrong:

1. Poorly equipped and outnumbered police force emboldens criminals. There is one police station serving all of Kibera a slum with 500,000 people. No wonder criminals are so brazen.

You can make Nairobi safer by via more street lights , more police stations and police posts, CCTV cameras, more police patrols, better trained policemen, databases to track criminals etc. In some cases policemen do not even have petrol to go after thieves.

2. Every responsible government builds low cost housing, be it the USA or UK or wherever.

It is laughable for you to say all they need is confidence to build their own homes. You must be one of those that was born with a silver spoon. Most Kenyan middle class types cant even build their own homes and you think slum dwellers can build homes ? Reality please !

3. Serikali is not the source of all good things. But it must get its priorities right.

Instead of palatial homes, why not build better infrastructure to enhance economic activity ? So much Productivity is lost in constant traffic jams. So much productivity is lost due to power outages.

Why not invest in making Kenya more secure ? This will bring more tourists.

Why not build social halls , basketball courts, football fields for the youth ? This will keep them busy and away from crime. Some of them might become good enough to earn a living from sports.

The colonial masters saw it fit to build housing for the poor and football fields for the youth. And even social halls. Kenya's best boxers were products of social halls like Muthurwa aka Dallas. Now such social hall are grabbed by bigwigs and Kenya is no longer good at boxing.

Virtually all the stadiums and football grounds in Kenya were built by the colonialists. The only exceptions are Nyayo and Kasarani. Sports can be a good source of revenue and employment. Yet instead of building sports facilities were are building palatial homes.

How is it possible that the colonial masters were kinder to Kenyans than our own leaders ?


How many police stations should Kibera and it's half a million people have? And why is that?

What 'causes' slums are imperfect markets and barriers to free market participation. America and England are examples of countries that support the creation of slums. As you've said, they even build them for their citizens in the name of 'low cost' housing.

We don't have a shortage of boxers and sports persons because there are no training facilities, we have a 'shortage' because their market is limited.

I wonder who or what you are representing in this conversation, and even what your political interests are.

murchr
#30 Posted : Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:05:17 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 15,980
I like your thinking tycho...the creation of slums in the us (section 8) is what is ailing the American economy today. That cant and shouldnt happen in Kenya.
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
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