Wazua
»
Club SK
»
Politics
»
EA States and anti-gay laws
Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,635
|
Lolest! wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:Lolest! wrote:and we bigots do love these gays. Just like the bible commands. And just like we love robbers, rapists etc. We just hate what they stand for and do It is your choice to be a bigot. Why not let others be, as well? I am a bigot because you branded us that way. Please speak for yourself. I never called you a bigot, don't event know you from Adam or Steve. You self-identified that way, which is OK with me. As for ' leaving you alone with your laws,' why not? The supreme law of the land is the Kenya Constitution, which clearly prohibits the kind of discrimination you seem to be proposing. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 12/21/2011 Posts: 1,010
|
Tokyo wrote:Let freedom reign. I thought bedroom issues are private. yes they are private until when you start demanding for rights, to be recognized,bla bla bla
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
|
Wakanyugi wrote:Lolest! wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:Lolest! wrote:and we bigots do love these gays. Just like the bible commands. And just like we love robbers, rapists etc. We just hate what they stand for and do It is your choice to be a bigot. Why not let others be, as well? I am a bigot because you branded us that way. Please speak for yourself. I never called you a bigot, don't event know you from Adam or Steve. You self-identified that way, which is OK with me. As for ' leaving you alone with your laws,' why not? The supreme law of the land is the Kenya Constitution, which clearly prohibits the kind of discrimination you seem to be proposing. see post #38,i took 'resident bigots' to mean anti-gay crowd if tomorrow there's a referendum on criminalizing homosexuality, which way would it go?
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,635
|
Muriel wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:Muriel wrote:
Now when it comes to matters of 'like' as in 'I may not like christians proselytizing,,,,,' there is really no way it can be canned into a universally acceptable form. One may launch a counter verbal or physical blitz while the other will ignore while yet another politely decline. The one who politely declines is no less emphatic than the one gets violent. You are no less emphatic in your opinion than Hamburglar, for instance.
Anyway, I agree that if one claims to follow the teachings of Jesus, then he should follow all of them without exception.
Most christians are not fundamentalists just choosy.
Love the Lord ,,,,,,, your neighbour as you love yourself is a summary, the sum-up, compaction of the 10 commands. Its good to have it - hence them - feature at the top. You and I might not be so different after all seeing that this also features at the top for me and I also have beef with certain christians.
Oh, about the muslims, I understand christians there are in the closet, as it were. This tactic gets my 100% approval. I would do it that way if I were there.
Good points above. I think we can agree on this. Let us not criminalize people who, either by choice or genetics, which ever way you look at Gayism, are different from us. If a Gay person commits a crime he/she should be dealt with the same way as any other Kenyan. But being Gay is not a crime, anymore than being Black is, and trying to make it so is just plain wrong. It would be a terrible waste of energy if our MP's were to distract the nation's attention in a futile attempt to police Kenyans bedroom behavior. As someone said already, we have bigger problems to address. Yes, 'criminilization' as in bringing in the civil authorities in matters of conscience will hardly help the way the framers would like. After all, even capital punishment has not forestalled murder. Proselytization by its nature will attract resistance. a) Gays will face stiff resistance from anti-gay christians (and muslims), b) christians in turn face stiff resistance from anti christians e.g. muslims and you, c) hapless muslims like AlphDoti will face stiff resistance from strong anti-muslims. Its all in a days work when it comes to proselytization. On the flip side, ability to thrive under resistance is a major plus for christianity. Look, civil authorities and their capital punishment have not forestalled christinization in arabia. Anyway, this can be our common ground for agreement and dialogue - hopefully - but not like the one I have with Tycho that makes both of us get accused unfairly. Wrongly.  Agreed. Two points though: If Gay people want to lobby for their rights (or proselytize as you insist) which is their right, they must understand that social acceptance of difference never comes easy. Some of the consequences are the kind of homophobic reactions we are seeing on this thread. But that is their choice to make not ours to take away. I am not really against Christians, I used to be one. I am against the hypocrisy that masquerades as Christianity, much of it pushed by the political/business edifice we call 'the Church.' I don't support some of the extreme tactics of Muslim fundamentalists (and Alphadoti is not one) but I would equally not wish our failed brand of Christianity on them. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 7/20/2007 Posts: 4,432
|
There's one thing I would love to know. When you make being Gay a crime. What does it mean. That we shall take you to jail for 10 years because you are gay? Will jailing the fellow make him less or more gay? Exactly what purpose does it server other than some men boasting that they are more manly than other men. Some religious people boasting that they are more religious than others. Other than personal reasons, what exactly does banning mini-skirts, banning gayism, banning missionary style have to do with the gov't? If your religion is not enough to stop the behavior then there's something wrong with your relgion, not the gay guy. Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 7/3/2007 Posts: 1,635
|
Lolest! wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:Lolest! wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:Lolest! wrote:and we bigots do love these gays. Just like the bible commands. And just like we love robbers, rapists etc. We just hate what they stand for and do It is your choice to be a bigot. Why not let others be, as well? I am a bigot because you branded us that way. Please speak for yourself. I never called you a bigot, don't event know you from Adam or Steve. You self-identified that way, which is OK with me. As for ' leaving you alone with your laws,' why not? The supreme law of the land is the Kenya Constitution, which clearly prohibits the kind of discrimination you seem to be proposing. see post #38, i took 'resident bigots' to mean anti-gay crowdif tomorrow there's a referendum on criminalizing homosexuality, which way would it go? You got me wrong. I was not referring to you or your homophobic friends. I was, again, baiting the Bible thumpers (a weakness I have and one I am not proud of - my apologies). I have no reason to insult you for being anti Gay. It is your right to hold a different point of view, and to 'proselytize' that point of view in any peaceful manner. What I believe is not your right is an attempt to deny the same rights you enjoy to other humans merely because they happen to be different from you. Criminalizing people who identify as homosexual is such an attempt. As for referendums, the day a majority of Kenyans vote to criminalize homosexuality, for indeed that is what it might take to amend the bill of rights, I will stand against them. Now that we have insulted each other, I believe we can move on, even if we don't agree. So this will be last comment on this Gay maneno. "The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
|
|
|
Rank: Member Joined: 11/19/2009 Posts: 3,142
|
Wakanyugi wrote:Muriel wrote:Wakanyugi wrote:Muriel wrote:
Now when it comes to matters of 'like' as in 'I may not like christians proselytizing,,,,,' there is really no way it can be canned into a universally acceptable form. One may launch a counter verbal or physical blitz while the other will ignore while yet another politely decline. The one who politely declines is no less emphatic than the one gets violent. You are no less emphatic in your opinion than Hamburglar, for instance.
Anyway, I agree that if one claims to follow the teachings of Jesus, then he should follow all of them without exception.
Most christians are not fundamentalists just choosy.
Love the Lord ,,,,,,, your neighbour as you love yourself is a summary, the sum-up, compaction of the 10 commands. Its good to have it - hence them - feature at the top. You and I might not be so different after all seeing that this also features at the top for me and I also have beef with certain christians.
Oh, about the muslims, I understand christians there are in the closet, as it were. This tactic gets my 100% approval. I would do it that way if I were there.
Good points above. I think we can agree on this. Let us not criminalize people who, either by choice or genetics, which ever way you look at Gayism, are different from us. If a Gay person commits a crime he/she should be dealt with the same way as any other Kenyan. But being Gay is not a crime, anymore than being Black is, and trying to make it so is just plain wrong. It would be a terrible waste of energy if our MP's were to distract the nation's attention in a futile attempt to police Kenyans bedroom behavior. As someone said already, we have bigger problems to address. Yes, 'criminilization' as in bringing in the civil authorities in matters of conscience will hardly help the way the framers would like. After all, even capital punishment has not forestalled murder. Proselytization by its nature will attract resistance. a) Gays will face stiff resistance from anti-gay christians (and muslims), b) christians in turn face stiff resistance from anti christians e.g. muslims and you, c) hapless muslims like AlphDoti will face stiff resistance from strong anti-muslims. Its all in a days work when it comes to proselytization. On the flip side, ability to thrive under resistance is a major plus for christianity. Look, civil authorities and their capital punishment have not forestalled christinization in arabia. Anyway, this can be our common ground for agreement and dialogue - hopefully - but not like the one I have with Tycho that makes both of us get accused unfairly. Wrongly. Agreed. Two points though: If Gay people want to lobby for their rights (or proselytize as you insist) which is their right, they must understand that social acceptance of difference never comes easy. Some of the consequences are the kind of homophobic reactions we are seeing on this thread. But that is their choice to make not ours to take away. I am not really against Christians, I used to be one. I am against the hypocrisy that masquerades as Christianity, much of it pushed by the political/business edifice we call 'the Church.' I don't support some of the extreme tactics of Muslim fundamentalists (and Alphadoti is not one) but I would equally not wish our failed brand of Christianity on them. Sad to see you go as you have told Lolest. Some time later then. Perhaps we can catch up on 'the church' discussion. You were the one I was discussing it with, my memory imagined it was with Tycho.
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 12/27/2012 Posts: 2,256 Location: Bandalungwa
|
Museveni claims he will work with Russians. I laugh. First off does he think Russians are interested in working with him ? Will they plug the budget holes left when donor money leaves Uganda ? And does he realize that Russians despise Africans about as much as they despise gays. Russia is one of the most racist countries on the planet. This is not the 1960s when Russians eagerly welcomed Africans. Times have changed.
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 7/1/2011 Posts: 8,804 Location: Nairobi
|
Some say that they love the 'gays' but hate what they are doing, or they do; but isn't a person what he does? Or are people who we label them? Who are we?
A flip side to making arrests and jailing gays is that arrest depends on detection, is our detective system not just able, but justified to ensure that every individual is under close surveillance at all times and everywhere?
No state can achieve this feat, and no state should. And the more states are trying to imagine that it can accomplish this the more citizens suffer and lose their freedom. Countless children stand to suffer, and mental unease will follow. Why do we want this for ourselves?
States of the world seem to be unable to deal adequately with the 'prepolitical' rights of Man. America and England are advocating for gay rights in a bid to preserve Statehood. African States seem not to have read the times. Like now, is President Museveni's appeal to scientific reason adequate grounds to justify the Law?
In simple terms, he is in fact, undermining the Law.
|
|
|
Wazua
»
Club SK
»
Politics
»
EA States and anti-gay laws
Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.
|