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VAT Bill - 2013
Ali Baba
#11 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 4:07:51 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 8/29/2008
Posts: 573
I kind of disagree.The govt should tax the poor and the middle clases more so as to make them work hard,become rich,then enjoy the lower rates of taxation.This is the Same message Robert Kiyosaki has been preaching: tax laws are made to discourage people from living in poverty.
accelriskconsult
#12 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 4:59:54 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
Ali Baba wrote:
I kind of disagree.The govt should tax the poor and the middle clases more so as to make them work hard,become rich,then enjoy the lower rates of taxation.This is the Same message Robert Kiyosaki has been preaching: tax laws are made to discourage people from living in poverty.



In practice taxation discourages work. Secondly, poor people are not necessarily lazy.

If you doubt it, just ask yourself why accidents have increased after traffic offence related fines (a form of taxation) were increased. Increasing or introducing new taxes in may cases just creates rent seekers - KRA staff and cops.

And why should the rich pay more in taxes? Because they enjoy more benefits from public goods and services. Whether it is security, good roads, oxygen (leafy neighbourhoods) etc, the rich enjoy more of it.

You hypothesise that poor people dont work hard. Join a gang of factory workers as they march to industrial are every morning and come back and tell me that drivel.

Poverty in many cases is a function of lack of opportunity. That is why I believe in paying school fees for my watchman's son and other kids from disadvantaged backgrounds. When thieves come to my house, the watchman puts his life on the line for mine and that of my family. It would very hyprocitical of me to claim that the man doesnt work hard just because such incidences do not happen every day.
accelriskconsult
#13 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 5:03:25 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
And please people spare us Kiyosaki's thoughts. The man is very often quoted out of context. Please look to the Bible, Talmud or the Koran . Rich dad poor dad is lame as a source of wisdom.
Lolest!
#14 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 5:12:17 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Ali Baba wrote:
I kind of disagree.The govt should tax the poor and the middle clases more so as to make them work hard,become rich,then enjoy the lower rates of taxation.This is the Same message Robert Kiyosaki has been preaching: tax laws are made to discourage people from living in poverty.

The way Kiyosaki's name crops up here makes me dislike him with his American economy ideas. This is Kenya. Jubilee govt promised easier life for us before they got to power. Taxing milk and books doesnt make it any better for the lower class. Some items are consumed across all classes. It would be fair if foodstuff, fuel books rmained untaxed. But how will treasury fund the cost of the new constitution? All these projects? There was bound to be more taxes. We were forewarned in 2010
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
accelriskconsult
#15 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 5:25:09 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
The VAT increase is especially maddening when you consider the following;

1) MNCs are stripping the country off its assets and income through transfer pricing and management fees. All major MNCs operating in Kenya do it. The charges are at best dubious and in many cases outrightly fraudulent

2) The gold export scams believed to have cost the country Sh 30 billion -- and this happening after goldenberg

3) The inflated prices at which the government procures everything from biros to newspapers

4) 100 scumbags planning to go for a joy ride to the Hague on tax payers expense.

5) The tax breaks enjoyed by flower exporters and some companies in the EPZ. Companies that subsequently repatriate all their profits.
itz
#16 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 7:11:04 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/20/2009
Posts: 348
Lolest! wrote:
Kulipa ushuru ni kujitegemea. With the bigger govt structure, what did we expect?

To sustain big govt the citizens must pay more taxes.The more money the different levels of govt ask for the more taxes citizens will have to pay.
the deal
#17 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 8:23:37 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
They should introduce a Ksh2000 note then..heck Ksh1000 is nothing this days...
Rankaz13
#18 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 9:02:00 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 5/21/2013
Posts: 2,841
Location: Here
the deal wrote:
They should introduce a Ksh2000 note then..heck Ksh1000 is nothing this days...


The most practical would be to re-denominate the currency by knocking off the zero in 1000 so that it becomes 100.
Life is like playing a violin solo in public and learning the instrument as one goes on.
the deal
#19 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 9:41:13 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
Rankaz13 wrote:
the deal wrote:
They should introduce a Ksh2000 note then..heck Ksh1000 is nothing this days...


The most practical would be to re-denominate the currency by knocking off the zero in 1000 so that it becomes 100.

Wewe its called rebasing...there is no need to rebase or revalue an already overvalued currency....it will kill Kenya's exports...rebasing...or revaluation should only be done in a hyperinflation environment ..we dont have that yet....lets say we knock...one zero....$1=Ksh8.7....see how Kenyan goods become expensive....imports will shoot...sinking local manufacturers...
Drobos fly
#20 Posted : Tuesday, September 03, 2013 9:43:20 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/24/2012
Posts: 331
Location: Vantage point
accelriskconsult wrote:

In practice taxation discourages work. Secondly, poor people are not necessarily lazy.

If you doubt it, just ask yourself why accidents have increased after traffic offence related fines (a form of taxation) were increased. Increasing or introducing new taxes in may cases just creates rent seekers - KRA staff and cops.

And why should the rich pay more in taxes? Because they enjoy more benefits from public goods and services. Whether it is security, good roads, oxygen (leafy neighbourhoods) etc, the rich enjoy more of it.

You hypothesise that poor people dont work hard. Join a gang of factory workers as they march to industrial are every morning and come back and tell me that drivel.

Poverty in many cases is a function of lack of opportunity. That is why I believe in paying school fees for my watchman's son and other kids from disadvantaged backgrounds. When thieves come to my house, the watchman puts his life on the line for mine and that of my family. It would very hyprocitical of me to claim that the man doesnt work hard just because such incidences do not happen every day.


Very well said, it is very great to hear someone living by example. It is easier for one to identify with a problem that is right before you than to look over seated on a high place assuming you have all the corners covered... kudos. I like that.

Ali Baba wrote:
I kind of disagree.The govt should tax the poor and the middle clases more so as to make them work hard,become rich,then enjoy the lower rates of taxation.This is the Same message Robert Kiyosaki has been preaching: tax laws are made to discourage people from living in poverty.


Have you ever looked at the taxation table and tried to understand why the government has different taxing strategies. From your comment taking it that you have never thought of it, the highly taxed services/goods are solely to discourage people from taking to them. So with your reasoning, you sound very naive of your countries revenue management. Your reasoning will actually entrench poverty further into the society if you don't create opportunities to alleviate the extra burden.
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