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Politics update Tue 26-Mar-13
Morey
#81 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:51:08 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 12/2/2007
Posts: 230
Location: London,SW
maka wrote:
Morey wrote:
maka wrote:
Kethi is asking very tough questions hapa...

She is wasting a lot of time looking around though.

true as she was.told those are matters for kesho it was just an application...

Smokin has also noticed that she is wasting time and ordered her to limit her submission to 7min.
McReggae
#82 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:51:17 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 6/17/2008
Posts: 23,365
Location: Nairobi
Lawyer Ngatia 9+5=16 days!!!!

.......IEBC has bogus lawyers and Ngatia has to talk for them all the time!!!!
..."Wewe ni mtu mdogo sana....na mwenye amekuandika pia ni mtu mdogo sana!".
masukuma
#83 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:51:49 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
washiku wrote:
As a layman, would someone explain to me why IEBC would be unwilling to give the register as its being requested? Why exactly is it difficult apart from the voluminous nature?


IEBC has not refused. This register in in over 33k ballot boxes in 290 constituencies across the country. they said they are willing - but IT WILL TAKE TIME!!
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
chiaroscuro
#84 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:53:50 AM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 2/2/2012
Posts: 1,134
Location: Nairobi
Ms Kilonzo is like her father; talks with much confidence to scare opponents but her arguments [like her father's] are hollow.

Eg; she has just said that the presidential returning officer has custody of the presidential register. There is NO SUCH document!

One register was used for the six elections. May be she did not vote, so she doesn't know how the process went.
washiku
#85 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:55:17 AM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
masukuma wrote:
washiku wrote:
As a layman, would someone explain to me why IEBC would be unwilling to give the register as its being requested? Why exactly is it difficult apart from the voluminous nature?


IEBC has not refused. This register in in over 33k ballot boxes in 290 constituencies across the country. they said they are willing - but IT WILL TAKE TIME!!


Then madam Kilonzo says:

@StandardKenya 4m
Kethi Kilonzo : If the IEBC kept any register in a ballot box then it contravened law and cannot defend itself on an illegality.
heavenly body
#86 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:57:10 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 7/31/2007
Posts: 146
innairobi wrote:
Someone makes an accusation and wants the accused to help them produce all the evidence for them. Wasn't this case supposed to be a slam dunk following all the 'evidence' on Youtube?


Easy...fising expedition
masukuma
#87 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:58:07 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
in which ballot box is the register placed in? there were 6 ballot boxes and one register.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
maka
#88 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 12:02:20 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
heavenly body wrote:
Tebes wrote:
Magigi wrote:
washiku wrote:
As a layman, would someone explain to me why IEBC would be unwilling to give the register as its being requested? Why exactly is it difficult apart from the voluminous nature?

skeletons in the closet...


Why would F. Ngatia, a lawyer for UK, object to the production of the registers by IEBC?d'oh!


My guess...he's objecting to anything that would amount to delay in arguing the substance and merits of the Petition. IEBC were ordered by Lenaola to furnish infro to Cord. My wild guess is that they did. So Cord just playing delaying tactics.

The application was argued by Rachier and Amollo and prayer 3 if I remember well was a prayer for registers!I am listening to Ngatia and unless I havent forgotten Evidence law in respect of Notices to Produce.Kuna the soft copies of the register: that is secondary evidence, wanting the register themselves that is primary evidence. And if I remember Section 69 well if an adverse party knows that he will be required to produce it then they must prepare themselves to produce it!That is learnt in second year!Surely this Supreme Court MUST stamp its authority...
possunt quia posse videntur
washiku
#89 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 12:02:46 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 5/9/2007
Posts: 13,095
heavenly body wrote:
innairobi wrote:
Someone makes an accusation and wants the accused to help them produce all the evidence for them. Wasn't this case supposed to be a slam dunk following all the 'evidence' on Youtube?


Easy...fising expedition


By the way what should be the order:
1. Take the case to court, then look for evidence

OR

2. Get evidence and go to court.

I know of Criminal cases where the suspect must be produced in court within a specified time limit thus they sometimes take it court as investigations continue. On this case, suppose the register is provided and then its realised there was no discrepancy as alleged coz upto this point, since they are yet to see it, they may only speculate?
maka
#90 Posted : Tuesday, March 26, 2013 12:18:34 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
washiku wrote:
heavenly body wrote:
innairobi wrote:
Someone makes an accusation and wants the accused to help them produce all the evidence for them. Wasn't this case supposed to be a slam dunk following all the 'evidence' on Youtube?


Easy...fising expedition


By the way what should be the order:
1. Take the case to court, then look for evidence

OR

2. Get evidence and go to court.

I know of Criminal cases where the suspect must be produced in court within a specified time limit thus they sometimes take it court as investigations continue. On this case, suppose the register is provided and then its realised there was no discrepancy as alleged coz upto this point, since they are yet to see it, they may only speculate?

Comparing a parliamentary and Presidential petition to a criminal case is wrong. The circumstances underpinning the two branches of law is different. One thing that is very important to note in this case is that THERE IS NO SPECULATION. The soft copies of the registers which is secondary evidence were provided by IEBC. What Kethi Kilonzo and Oraro are doing is to simply request (buttressed by the overriding powers of the Supreme Court and Section 69 of the Evidence Act) for the primary evidence namely the actual registers. Forms 34 and 36 have already been provided and there is a variance in the figures thereat and those in the registers. Having understood that point then one needs to know that the agents of all political parties had their own tallying going on during the elections. At the close of the election all the agents from the various parties and in thier polling stations transmitted to the Constituency agents and then to the party agents in Nairobi the figures they had noted. By the end of day of 5th of March the agents for TNA and ODM had their respective figures for the Presidential race. CORD say that their figures differ from what was declared. That is the substance of the Petition. Asking for the primary registers is something that actually should be done by the IEBC constitutionally.
possunt quia posse videntur
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