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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/6/2008 Posts: 3,588
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poundfoolish wrote:Much Know wrote:@ngalaka Jommo Kenyatta said Moi tosha! was it tribal? 20years later Raila said Moi tosha! where were the gema then? In 2002 he said Kibaki tosha (never mind he had signed a secret self serving MOU). It is not about tribe except for the cords(kabila mbili). moot point again.. Mzees prefered choice was his personal doc. who sadly fellout over very private matters.. at 80 mzee had had all the nyamachoma he needed. choirs and land to last 5generations... he didnt care or senile enough to know what is.. infact some of his statements to clarify his strength were proving the great statesman was losing it..(rem the 'uliza mama...' comment?') Kihika Kimani n Njenga Karume had a plan... so did Njonjo  Why resort to hearsay and rumors when HIS ACTIONS and the facts are clear. Kenyatta kept Moi as VP for a long time and was clear about his succession. BTW this "Kenya was at par with Malaysia" story Tinga peddles was thanks to Kenyatta, the year was 1978, he was a capitalist "laissez faire" economist and even Singapore's famed President Lee Kuan Yew sent technocrats here to study him, Tingas dad was pushing for revolutionary communism like many others in Africa. In an authoritative study of Africa's fifty year Independence history he has been vindicated as Africa's best Independence leader, you name a leader that left a better legacy in Africa. He is the reason Kenya withstood many of the trials many African states have gone through. I so revere him so lets speak facts, he appointed Moi as VP to succeed him, was this tribalism? Ras Kienyeji Man
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/14/2006 Posts: 1,311
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:
@Liv, you keep referring to emotions. Nobody is emotional, we are just chatting. As to what you said or meant. You don't need to actually say the words for me to interpret their meanings. You say Gema folk want a government that will protect their property. So my question to you is this, based on Kenya's past history, there have been 3 governments, which one did not protect the Gema peoples properties. And why did this government not uphold its constitutional duty to protect its citizens properties.
@Obi, I guess you have now understood what I meant to say. Gema people are not special from other communities. But some lost properties in 2007/ 2008 and that has contributed to railaphobia.
About the 3 governments, everyone here can answer your question. You too can analyze the pros and cons of each of the governments with respect to that issue.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/6/2008 Posts: 3,588
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If it were not for the 1982 communist revolutionary coup (reforms), maybe Kenya would be at par with Malaysia. The phobia is real and necessary! Ras Kienyeji Man
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 10/29/2008 Posts: 1,566
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Much Know wrote:@ngalaka Jommo Kenyatta said Moi tosha! was it tribal? 20years later Raila said Moi tosha! where were the gema then? In 2002 he said Kibaki tosha (never mind he had signed a secret self serving MOU). It is not about tribe except for the cords(kabila mbili). Hopeless attempt at re-writing history! J. Kenyatta died in office, and as per the Law then, Moi, the VP took over the reins of power! In fact there was hue and cry from Central why Moi shouldn’t be let to ascend to power, but Njonjo stood for the law. Up to date, Njonjo is a pariah in Central!! I am not aware of Raila declaring Moi Tosha. I maintain Central has never supported/voted for anyone from outside! I may also go further and say they are overly contemptuous of other people! Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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Much Know wrote:If it were not for the 1982 communist revolutionary coup (reforms), maybe Kenya would be at par with Malaysia. The phobia is real and necessary! No it is not. Where does the phobia come from? I believe from these issues: 1.Cultural differences-sifafanui 2.Historical political differences 3.2007 violence and subsequent loss of property. 4.2003/08 rent crisis 5.Perceived arrogance of RAO supporters should he be President. Other reasons like '82 coup, corruption, nepotism and tribalism are not unique to GEMA. RAO has almost shed tears in pleading with GEMA that he is not as evil as you perceive him to be. Is he genuine? I think UMK rule with sanctions will be worse than RAO rule with prosperity for GEMA. As XSK told you we are under katiba mpya!
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/6/2008 Posts: 3,588
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Ngalaka wrote:Much Know wrote:@ngalaka Jommo Kenyatta said Moi tosha! was it tribal? 20years later Raila said Moi tosha! where were the gema then? In 2002 he said Kibaki tosha (never mind he had signed a secret self serving MOU). It is not about tribe except for the cords(kabila mbili). Hopeless attempt at re-writing history! J. Kenyatta died in office, and as per the Law then, Moi, the VP took over the reins of power! In fact there was hue and cry from Central why Moi shouldn’t be let to ascend to power, but Njonjo stood for the law. Up to date, Njonjo is a pariah in Central!! I am not aware of Raila declaring Moi Tosha. I maintain Central has never supported/voted for anyone from outside! I may also go further and say they are overly contemptuous of other people! Well i guess Kenyatta did not know he can die, that's what you're implying? He appointed his successor(and did not expect to die otherwise he would have appointed a kikuyu quickly) and in essence voted for Moi(that was the constitution and law then) and whereas the Attorney General simply upheld the law (you have some alternative major conspiracy theory). You have the choice not to see every action through your tribal lenses as is now clear, you are the one re-writing history to make it tribal because everything is clear to me or any "non-tribal" observer, the facts are clear. Ras Kienyeji Man
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Rank: Elder Joined: 7/23/2008 Posts: 3,017
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Liv wrote:Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:
@Liv, you keep referring to emotions. Nobody is emotional, we are just chatting. As to what you said or meant. You don't need to actually say the words for me to interpret their meanings. You say Gema folk want a government that will protect their property. So my question to you is this, based on Kenya's past history, there have been 3 governments, which one did not protect the Gema peoples properties. And why did this government not uphold its constitutional duty to protect its citizens properties.
@Obi, I guess you have now understood what I meant to say. Gema people are not special from other communities. But some lost properties in 2007/ 2008 and that has contributed to railaphobia.
About the 3 governments, everyone here can answer your question. You too can analyze the pros and cons of each of the governments with respect to that issue. Even non Gema kenyans lost property in this time, mostly in Nakuru, Naivasha and Nairobi Slums. Others lost their lives through police brutality. We were all victims. Why don't you then blame the president at that time MK for not protecting kenya citizens. Why focus on RAO who was not in govt. "The purpose of bureaucracy is to compensate for incompetence and lack of discipline." James Collins
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Rank: Elder Joined: 3/18/2011 Posts: 12,069 Location: Kianjokoma
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Ngalaka wrote:ing history!
J. Kenyatta died in office, and as per the Law then, Moi, the VP took over the reins of power!
In fact there was hue and cry from Central why Moi shouldn’t be let to ascend to power, but Njonjo stood for the law.
Up to date, Njonjo is a pariah in Central!!
I am not aware of Raila declaring Moi Tosha.
I maintain Central has never supported/voted for anyone from outside!
I may also go further and say they are overly contemptuous of other people!
You are increasingly showing symptoms of the AKA disease that affects some wazuans. Njonjo is a pariah? Hiyo sikujua. If he is it must be coz of the stupid comments he made at Uhuru park in 2005! Who do you think central should have voted for in 1992, 1997,2002, 2007 and who should they go for in 2013? Why?
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Rank: Veteran Joined: 11/14/2006 Posts: 1,311
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Obi 1 Kanobi wrote:
Even non Gema kenyans lost property in this time, mostly in Nakuru, Naivasha and Nairobi Slums. Others lost their lives through police brutality. We were all victims.
Why don't you then blame the president at that time MK for not protecting kenya citizens. Why focus on RAO who was not in govt.
It is a fact that most of the people who were affected were from Gema and this was meant to be by the instigators of the violence.... hence the increase of railaphobia.
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Rank: Elder Joined: 12/6/2008 Posts: 3,588
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Lolest! wrote:Much Know wrote:If it were not for the 1982 communist revolutionary coup (reforms), maybe Kenya would be at par with Malaysia. The phobia is real and necessary! No it is not. Where does the phobia come from? I believe from these issues: 1.Cultural differences-sifafanui 2.Historical political differences 3.2007 violence and subsequent loss of property. 4.2003/08 rent crisis 5.Perceived arrogance of RAO supporters should he be President. Other reasons like '82 coup, corruption, nepotism and tribalism are not unique to GEMA. RAO has almost shed tears in pleading with GEMA that he is not as evil as you perceive him to be. Is he genuine? I think UMK rule with sanctions will be worse than RAO rule with prosperity for GEMA. As XSK told you we are under katiba mpya! So what is his "secret solution" to waitiki farm at the coast he was promising squatters? Have you heard of Presidents suspending a constitution? It is just a paper, particularly revolutionary ones to implement their magic reforms? They can even hold another referendum on their new "reformed" constitution, do you want to guess who will win? could the presidential term be extended to give time for "reforms", if you trust him, well and good, it's your vote, i prefer the imaginary sanctions. Ras Kienyeji Man
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