wazua Sun, May 10, 2026
Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Log In

14 Pages«<1011121314>
28 cops killed in samburu...
Njung'e
#111 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 8:59:28 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/7/2007
Posts: 11,935
Location: Nairobi
Just encountered a column of technicals headed to Nyahururu and obviously from Lanet or Gilgil.The last thing i want to be today in Kenya is to be a close relative of those jinga Turkana savages.Yao imeungamana!!
Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
maka
#112 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 9:19:32 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Um Sayala wrote:
simonkabz wrote:
Um Sayala wrote:
I concur with a Mr Wafula
C&P
Evans Wafula 13 November 2012 3:31 PM
The buck stops with the ground commanders,seriously!but the whole police force falls under you.You are incharge,and therefore you have to take responsibilty.It's like a coach saying that the buck stops with the players.You are the police commissioner must set guidelines,rules or engagements and Standard Operating Procedures to be strictly enforced and followed.For example,there have to be a rule that such operations have only to be done with officers that are familiar with the terrain.That such operations have to be carried out with air support.That such operations have to be carried out with police/officers clad in bullet proof vesist and ballistic helmets.Iteere is the one that has to carry the cross.He can blame the ground commanders all he can,but the buck stops with him.What has he tried to do to improve the police?What reforms has he implemented?He had not tried to fight to his foot soldiers.Has ever asked the government to procure protection gears like bullet proof vests?Many life would have been saved.Or ask the governement to buy armoured vehicles to deal with such missions.



Media sensationalization and side shows. Iteere dont listen to anyone. Was anybody here present to determine the CONTEXT of Iteere's answer, which was right anyway?
NO I disagree
MISSION COMMAND gentlemen.

"Tell them what to do, let them go on determining how best to do it, as long as it follows your intent and Concept of Operations." Gen S Patton, US Army.

Iteere wanted the livestock recovered (primary objective). The local police comanders should determine how best to do it, so long as the objective is attained.

Mission Command follows a docrinal template. the higher Comdr gives his intent, and most importantly allocates resources equivalent to the task then gives the junior comdr the leeway on HOW BEST to execute the mission. Several quiz Iteere should answer:
1. Were the forces well trained and equiped to handle the bandits?. NO you just answered yourself that the army should have gone. So why did police go, who sent them?
2. In Mission command, the responsibility still lies with the higher comdr, he takes credit when mission succeeds, and takes blame for the opposite. Has Iteere accepted responsibilty?

That aside, it should be brought to light that Suguta is no walk in the park, and Police should not have been pushed to go to such a dangerous TERRITORY, in fact, for the sake of the future, it should be in writing, no one shall venture into Suguta valley other than KDF. Practically, only the Armoured Battallion and attack helicopters usually venture there and they do a thorough job. Now picture our hapless unprotected inexperienced Metropolitan police in such a dangerous front facing the ngoroko/toposa/turkana/merille without even an immediate backup which would be useless anyway (apart from collecting their dead colleagues) walking hopelessly in a canalized and ideal killing ground. Rout.

Let our security apparatus learn a serious n hard lesson in this. Let not those precious souls go in vain.



I totally disagree the buck0 stops with the police commish,if am not wrong the team was made upof a combined force of Anti-stock theft,regular and adminstration police,Rapid response unit and The GSU...From wikipedia it says this about the latter...

The General Service Unit (GSU) is a paramilitary wing of the Kenyan Military and Kenyan Police, consisting of highly trained police officers and special forces soldiers.Having been in existence since the late 1940s, the GSU has fought in a number of conflicts in and around Kenya, including the 1963 - 1969 Shifta War and the 1982 Kenyan coup.[2] The Kenyan police outlines the objectives of the GSU as follows, to deal with situations affecting internal security throughout the Republic, to be an operational force that is not intended for use on duties of a permanent static nature, and primarily, to be a reserve force to deal with special operations and civil disorders.[3]

That Wafula guy rightly put it the Police commish should set out guidelines as to how such missions should be undertaken,there should be a rule book on such things,surely if wikipedia things of the GSU as highly trained operatives then the whole planning of the recovery of the herd was poorly done from the top,rem its not the first time this has happened..the number of cops killed this year is alarming lets get the IG and we move forward,have better plans and policies for the future...its not KDFs work kukimbizana na wezi wa mifugo its degrading to them...







possunt quia posse videntur
jaggernaut
#113 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 9:40:38 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/9/2008
Posts: 5,389
There must be Chiefs and Subchiefs in that area and they should tell us what actually happened on the ground, ie the individuals who stole the cattle, those who were involved in the attacks etc. As GoK's eyes on the ground the Suguta chief should start singing. Finya yeye kidogo.
Intelligentsia
#114 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 9:52:15 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/1/2009
Posts: 2,436
@Guka, kwani kenya tuiko na technicals i thought they are a somali brand...??
Did you know the families of the cops killed will most likely be kicked out of police lines? And those injured badly, will have to foot a chunk of their medical bills from their pockets - that is, in addition to losing their jobs if maimed vibaya?
Here's my 2 cents:
1) Establish a permanent security post (think KDF) there, not just sending the army periodically there. Heck, make it their training ground - suguta valley problem will be sorted out forever,
2)Police Commanders i/c samburu ops - must appear before an oversight body (Parliamentary or other credible one) for carelessly sending rookies into harms' way while unprepared. They must be held accountable. Itere too - there's no way such a massive contingent of > 100 cops (plus GSU+Rapid Response Unit)go into an op without Vigilance Hse being aware,huh?
3)Get cops armoured vehicles (they have started manufacturing the
Mamba one here)for those in high risk areas NOW.
4)Mob unanswered qstns: why did gava take too long to rescue those guys? the bandits even had time to come in a second wave and finish off survivors, how now!? No one even knew how many cops went into the ops, surely now...so there ws no central monitoring of the ops and so where was the director of Ops at vigilance hse?
5) Forget all that fancy talk about police reforms - just immediately implement these in the short term:
- give cops a forensic lab
- let police choppers not be for vip transport,it should have
been for aerial support in the suguta ops
- release cops from these silly nanny jobs they hold with
wadosi i.e pushing trolley at s/markets, drivers - ni sheer
misuse of cops
- give all cops who go on patrols bullet-proof vests now.

then talk of long term reforms like life insurance, housing, remuneration.





2012
#115 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 10:10:53 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,592
Location: Nairobi
simonkabz wrote:
So, if no one is supposed to survive, how would anybody know in advance?


Intelligence may be?

BBI will solve it
:)
aemathenge
#116 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 10:48:24 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/18/2008
Posts: 3,434
Location: Kerugoya
Guka, Intel, who are technicals?
Njung'e
#117 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 11:07:24 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 2/7/2007
Posts: 11,935
Location: Nairobi
@Intelli,
For lack of a better word and don't grill me coz i am military nothingSad .What do you call some open jeeps (Vee-nosed) with mounted guns?Pray Actually,one had a heavy gun facing forward and a smaller twin machine gun facing backwards.One thing i am sure,hazikua zinaenda kuchimbua viaziPray smile !!
Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
simonkabz
#118 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 11:26:03 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
I shall insist, Suguta and some other hotspots in Kenya are no police territories. Sad but true. Those are technically battlefields, police dont go to battle, ideally. Let the NSC get their stuff together, and be more prudent when allocating security operations. The force tasked should be equal to the task.Police cannot, and will never make it in Suguta, n if they do, it shall be sheer luck and God's grace.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
simonkabz
#119 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 11:46:00 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
Um Sayala wrote:
simonkabz wrote:
[quote=essyk]What does 'AMBUSH AREA' mean?
If they knew it was,why was it hard to avoid the place or send spies to survey the place first?
Poor boys.






Gal, this is a bit insensitive. No one is SUPPOSED TO SURVIVE A WELL LAID AMBUSH. No one. So, if no one is supposed to survive, how would anybody know in advance?[/quote]

No there are anti-ambush drills. and they work so well, ask KDF how many ambushes they had in somalia and how they managed to counter the same. Time spent in Recce and int is not time wasted.


Um Sayala, maximum respect. I hope this is your field. If it is, then this statement should not be strange to you. NO ONE IS SUPPOSED TO SURVIVE A WELL EXECUTED AMBUSH. The suguta one was a near perfect example. Those al-shabaab ambushes by a few somali boys against a superior and very wary force could not achieve much. Infact, anti-ambush drills are desperate attempt to stop a tsunami......for a well executed one. We might argue all day but the fact remains, an ambush was laid by battle-hardened fierce warriors(I rate them more than 10 times better warriors than alshabaab) against a hopeless outfit of angry and demoralised police. Then what happened happened.

On Mission Command, you are right. You sound like an authority. Me thinks the Police commish was hard pressed, and because there are many instances the police have recovered cattle in other areas, how could he possibly suddenly claim the task is impossible? He would be skinned alive by kenyans. But since that incident, he must not give in to impossible tasks, and must stand firm by his men Like Maj Gen Ali. Let them do only what they are capable of doing, otherwise we shall be burying our sons in scores.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
Jus Blazin
#120 Posted : Wednesday, November 14, 2012 12:12:17 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/23/2008
Posts: 3,966
Yaani hata Wikipedia inajua Suguta Valley ni nini... "The valley is used as a hide-out by Pokot and Turkana cattle rustlers. It is considered a "no go" region by the police due to the extremely harsh environment and familiarity of the rustlers with the terrain."
Luck is when Preparation meets Opportunity. ~ Lucius Annaeus Seneca
14 Pages«<1011121314>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Copyright © 2026 Wazua.co.ke. All Rights Reserved.