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Should the chiefs remain?
tycho
#31 Posted : Saturday, October 27, 2012 7:04:18 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
simonkabz wrote:
county govts are protected by the senate n parliament. prezzo can't just go wrecking havoc. I think u r a bit paranoid. what's the fear for? back to chiefs. ...


I have encountered 3 chiefs so far, and in all my encounters they have played the role of propping an authoritarian rule. But such a rule is no longer tenable. I 'fear' that retaining the chief is an attempt to retain a decadent culture.
josiah33
#32 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2012 5:59:31 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 1,777
josiah33 wrote:
A workmate was taken by his wife to the chief because he was not taking his responsibilities seriously. After solving their problem the chief said to the guy as he was leaving, 'Mr.X siuniachie kitu'. If this is what we want to continue with, i vow never to listen to any pro-chiefs rant. by the way the guy told the chief, hatujalipwa mshahara', and went home.

xxxxx
Mukiri
#33 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2012 7:20:05 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
It became an unruly mashinani when the Chiefs were stopped from caining philandering husbands and drunkards. It would be sadder now if they were removed. My grandma always prides herself in having the chiefs cellphone number on her phone

Proverbs 19:21
alma
#34 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2012 8:09:13 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/20/2007
Posts: 4,432
When in shags, the chief and subchief are very important. But important to whom? My grandmother who was in the Mau Mau.

If the issue is solving neighbour disputes, then set up a small claims court at the local level.

This idea of sticking with an archaic system that was setup to actually humiliate the populace is out of the 19th century.

So, though I understand that there needs to be local solutions to local issues, I just don't subscribe to the idea that only chiefs can do so.

After all, in my small estate, I have never seen the chief, don't even know who he is and we still have a better living standard than all those fellows in shags with a subchief and chief as daily visitors
Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
Mukiri
#35 Posted : Sunday, October 28, 2012 9:57:54 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/11/2012
Posts: 5,222
alma wrote:
When in shags, the chief and subchief are very important. But important to whom? My grandmother who was in the Mau Mau.

If the issue is solving neighbour disputes, then set up a small claims court at the local level.

This idea of sticking with an archaic system that was setup to actually humiliate the populace is out of the 19th century.

So, though I understand that there needs to be local solutions to local issues, I just don't subscribe to the idea that only chiefs can do so.

After all, in my small estate, I have never seen the chief, don't even know who he is and we still have a better living standard than all those fellows in shags with a subchief and chief as daily visitors


So in a nutshell, what you are saying is we stop calling them chiefs, because the name reminds us of colonial humiliation and instead call them small claims court because it sounds 20th century-like?

Proverbs 19:21
alma
#36 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2012 6:51:06 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/20/2007
Posts: 4,432
@Mukiri if that is what you understood from my statement, so be it.

It's called separation of powers which is in the constitution. Executive, Parliament and Judiciary. Exactly what part of this are the chiefs? The executive has no part in executing justice.

If their work is in settling family disputes, which are legal in nature, then its in the judiciary. So speak to the earinged one and I'm sure you will find support for local solution courts. If I'm not wrong he supports elders.

But chiefs as you have put it are in the colonial era, not even the 20th century. They aren't supposed to have been there in the first place.
Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
tycho
#37 Posted : Monday, October 29, 2012 12:17:06 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
Mukiri wrote:
alma wrote:
When in shags, the chief and subchief are very important. But important to whom? My grandmother who was in the Mau Mau.

If the issue is solving neighbour disputes, then set up a small claims court at the local level.

This idea of sticking with an archaic system that was setup to actually humiliate the populace is out of the 19th century.

So, though I understand that there needs to be local solutions to local issues, I just don't subscribe to the idea that only chiefs can do so.

After all, in my small estate, I have never seen the chief, don't even know who he is and we still have a better living standard than all those fellows in shags with a subchief and chief as daily visitors


So in a nutshell, what you are saying is we stop calling them chiefs, because the name reminds us of colonial humiliation and instead call them small claims court because it sounds 20th century-like?


This is where we go wrong. We haven't woken up to the fact that we now have a chance to create an administrative system that is pro the masses. I know that the 'middle class' person may prefer to have the chief because the chief was created to support this class. For example, I once attended a baraza that tacitly approved the killing of youth who cause 'insecurity'. This sort of criminology is loved by the middle class who believe that they are entitled to what they have by virtue of hard work only. Of course this is what our schooling has made us believe. But this is far from true.

There are very many people who are languishing under this political and administrative system!

It's time we had the government work for the masses just as it works for the middle and ruling classes. And this doesn't need a person who wield a baton and scare us with his 'Wazee wa kijiji' and police.

The bigger the government, the more the transgressions of the ruled, and you can imagine what will happen when taxes go up amid increasing unemployment! Crime will go up and in no time the middle class will be seeking refugee status!

The government needs an administrative structure that will prevent this and as far as I can see, the chief and his office need massive re-structuring.
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