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Should the chiefs remain?
madammary
#11 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 12:20:26 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/23/2011
Posts: 175
Location: Nairobi
radio wrote:
They represent the semblance of government to the wananchi or is it wenyenchi.

They help in dispute resolution, community mobilization and other many activities in village level. Remember the village is a community and it needs a leader.

I say they should STAY!

Looks like u are actually reading from a text book description of the functions of a chief ready to sit for a history examination. Things are quite different on the ground radio. A chief's work is to actually extort money from widows who want to access their husband's pension monies and want to have them sign some forms. there is so much much more evil this chief's do. By the way, is the chief's office an alternative court and the chief an alternative judge and are the chief's judgements binding in terms of laws of kenya?
richdad
#12 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 12:45:20 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 2/12/2010
Posts: 474
Location: Nairobi
According to Kaguthi (Former Nairobi PC and NACADA boss) provincial administration do solve over 75% of disputes in Kenya.

Does it mean that Kenyan will have to travel miles to get burial certs and report petty disputes like land boundaries. We should accept that our society is not that enlightened and the bureaucracy of courts plus corrupt lawyers would make most people shy away from them. Kenyan court process is also too expensive for a commom mwananchi.

The county gvt will be run by politicians who might at times not be at par with the Nairobi government. Disputes will also be biased on where they get support.


Keep it simple
simonkabz
#13 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 1:00:08 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
kenyans are an awefully confused sorry lot. wazuans castigate politicians daily, but here we are ati we leave security matters with county govts. haha we are a veeeery confused society. I trust the dc n his men more than the governer n his kanjoras
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
simonkabz
#14 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 1:04:02 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
further, the katiba doesn't provide for local security. so, who shall do it? the Role of county govt is not security. I say again, it is not security provision, just dvt agenda.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
tycho
#15 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 1:26:11 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,804
Location: Nairobi
richdad wrote:
According to Kaguthi (Former Nairobi PC and NACADA boss) provincial administration do solve over 75% of disputes in Kenya.

Does it mean that Kenyan will have to travel miles to get burial certs and report petty disputes like land boundaries. We should accept that our society is not that enlightened and the bureaucracy of courts plus corrupt lawyers would make most people shy away from them. Kenyan court process is also too expensive for a commom mwananchi.

The county gvt will be run by politicians who might at times not be at par with the Nairobi government. Disputes will also be biased on where they get support.




The 'installation' of the chief was a resultant of political forces at a certain time. But now we should not simply say whether chiefs should go or not, but we should also interrogate the political context and the roles needed to be played by government at the smallest administrative unit.

One may argue that we are not an advanced country, but he will not be aiding his argument, for the facts of history are showing otherwise. We certainly have more educated citizens than we had in 1963. And besides, we do not need even a half of the citizenry to be 'enlightened' to create enlightened systems.

What kinds of conflict are we going to experience in the villages? Are villages the same as estates? Besides is an urban slum equal to a village?

What kind of leadership is the chief providing? Is it 'pro-people' or is it pro-government? For example, most leaders look at insecurity as a problem brought about by the youth. Is such a view acceptable?

I am finding it very difficult to call for the retention of chiefs. It is expected that if chiefs will protest about these changes but it is up to the leadership of the day to 'manage' this matter.

But look now, if we are so afraid of changing the village, can we change the state?

radio
#16 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 1:28:31 PM
Rank: Veteran

Joined: 11/9/2009
Posts: 2,003
I am happy to see I am not alone in support of the chiefs.
Lucid_Iam
#17 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 2:14:48 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 9/30/2011
Posts: 483
They don't have to be called chiefs or provincial admin, their roles could be redefined. Who for instance will coordinate security at the local level? Who will issue IDs etc. Their role is critical, we shouldn't just say they need to go because the new katiba does not have a role for provincial admin. The problem with us is we never think through decisions.
sheri
#18 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 2:44:23 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/11/2007
Posts: 694
They should stay.
josiah33
#19 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 2:55:05 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 1,777
THEY SHOULD GO
simonkabz
#20 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 3:01:45 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/2/2007
Posts: 8,776
Location: Cameroon
tycho wrote:
richdad wrote:
According to Kaguthi (Former Nairobi PC and NACADA boss) provincial administration do solve over 75% of disputes in Kenya.

Does it mean that Kenyan will have to travel miles to get burial certs and report petty disputes like land boundaries. We should accept that our society is not that enlightened and the bureaucracy of courts plus corrupt lawyers would make most people shy away from them. Kenyan court process is also too expensive for a commom mwananchi.

The county gvt will be run by politicians who might at times not be at par with the Nairobi government. Disputes will also be biased on where they get support.




The 'installation' of the chief was a resultant of political forces at a certain time. But now we should not simply say whether chiefs should go or not, but we should also interrogate the political context and the roles needed to be played by government at the smallest administrative unit.

One may argue that we are not an advanced country, but he will not be aiding his argument, for the facts of history are showing otherwise. We certainly have more educated citizens than we had in 1963. And besides, we do not need even a half of the citizenry to be 'enlightened' to create enlightened systems.

What kinds of conflict are we going to experience in the villages? Are villages the same as estates? Besides is an urban slum equal to a village?

What kind of leadership is the chief providing? Is it 'pro-people' or is it pro-government? For example, most leaders look at insecurity as a problem brought about by the youth. Is such a view acceptable?

I am finding it very difficult to call for the retention of chiefs. It is expected that if chiefs will protest about these changes but it is up to the leadership of the day to 'manage' this matter.

But look now, if we are so afraid of changing the village, can we change the state?


long on words, short on content. it would have been good if you tychho suggested on the replacement for chiefs. how will the roles of chiefs be carried out, and by who? a whole back, a DC had 2 roles. 1. supervise dvt. 2. security.
county govts have taken over dvt. so, who has taken over security? we will still have county commisioners or whatever name, n his men...tupende tusipende.
TULIA.........UFUNZWE!
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