Wazua
»
Investor
»
Stocks
»
Jubilee is KING!!
Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
|
Horton wrote:@guru, Just curious, are you the UNDISPUTED KNOW ALL in insurance? I am not a "Know it all" in the slightest.. Infact i probably know less about insurance than you do... But the insurance gurus and auditors reported an underwriting profit for JUB of 540mn in 2011.. And i see no reason to doubt them... And neither should you because as a layman you clearly do not know how many possible calculations can go into deriving an underwriting profit... Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
|
|
|
Rank: Chief Joined: 5/31/2011 Posts: 5,121
|
@the deal, @Horton, @xxxxx
We all seem to agree that:
1. Underwriting profit = Net insurance premium revenue - Net insurance benefits and claims – expenses
2. Combined ratio = (Net insurance benefits and claims + expenses) / Net insurance premium revenue
From our workings, we can conclude that composition of expenses seems to be our point of disagreement.
Actuaries, insurance accountants and other insurance professionals in the house may give us their views on how this is done in the field.
@msimon, et al, views would do this discussion a lot of good.
Otherwise, I choose to agree with Jubilee team that underwriting profits for year 2011 impressively stands at KES 540M, up from KES 476M in 2010.
I rest my case
|
|
|
Rank: Chief Joined: 1/3/2007 Posts: 18,347 Location: Nairobi
|
guru267 wrote:@the deal wrote:The Kes3.4bn is coming from Jubilee financial statements...you mean they have overstated their Opex and commissions they pay to agents who sale their policies? What your figure?  @the deal why would you include OPEX in calculating underwriting profits?? Just because Buffet does it like that?? What do accounting & acturial standards say about this'll ?? Well, I venture Mr. Warren Buffett knows a thing or 2 about insurance firms. Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 9/25/2009 Posts: 4,534 Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
|
Bottom line: Only invest in Jubilee because of their investment in Aga Khan Firms such as NMG, DTB...TPS and Aga Khan Projects such as Bujagali energy and Nation Centre...that's where all their profits come from in form of dividends, rent and capital gains...oh not to forget they have a big bond portfolio
which earns them good interest income and help manage liquidity situations...now the stock is undervalued at the NS
e...go ahead and BUY...if you make money remember me...a cold Windhoek Lager does a trick!
Advice: Study Warren Buffet's Annual letters to shareholders their the best thing you will ever come across...if you understand and master the content of those letters going to school to study investment is a waste of cash...!
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/16/2009 Posts: 994
|
mwekez@ji wrote:@the deal, @Horton, @xxxxx
Otherwise, I choose to agree with Jubilee team that underwriting profits for year 2011 impressively stands at KES 540M, up from KES 476M in 2010.
I rest my case
In so far as they are consistent in the method of calculating the underwriting profits year on year, then the statement on growth in Underwriting profits should hold no matter the approach. so yes, its a growth and not a dip. Time is money, so money is time. Money saved is time gained in reverse! Money stores your life’s energy. You expend your energy, get paid money, and store that money for a future purchase made in a currency.
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
|
So what's the conclusion/consensus then?
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
|
Horton wrote:So what's the conclusion/consensus then? SIMPLE!! 1.Learn more about insurance before commenting about it.. 2.Learn to read and understand annual reports... They help laymen like us to make sense about sectors we do not understand!! 3.Dont agrue with experts(jub staff & auditors) especially if you are not one yourself.. It is unflattering and exposes ignorance!! Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 8/30/2007 Posts: 1,558 Location: Nairobi
|
@ guru thanks but u need to do that yourself. The formula online for underwriting profits and combined ratios in all books and websites include EXPENSES. Why u dOnt subtract it is beyond me.
A case of blind faith in the management madam? I didn't think that would be you, trusting blindly. Remember Enron?!
Before critisizing, please give us links, quotes, something that proves us wrong with hard facts. Don't just tell me to trust the statement from the management.
|
|
|
Rank: Elder Joined: 1/21/2010 Posts: 6,675 Location: Nairobi
|
Horton wrote:Before critisizing, please give us links, quotes, something that proves us wrong with hard facts. Don't just tell me to trust the statement from the management. Here is a link with some hard facts.. www.jubileeinsurance.com...oops-12-insurance-awards I think some awards include.. 1. Composite UNDERWRITER of the year (1st place) 2. Medical UNDERWRITER of the year (1st place) What do you and @the deal know that the rest of the world doesn't?? Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
|
|
|
Rank: Veteran Joined: 9/4/2009 Posts: 700 Location: Nairobi
|
mwekez@ji wrote:@the deal, @Horton, @xxxxx
We all seem to agree that:
1. Underwriting profit = Net insurance premium revenue - Net insurance benefits and claims – expenses
2. Combined ratio = (Net insurance benefits and claims + expenses) / Net insurance premium revenue
From our workings, we can conclude that composition of expenses seems to be our point of disagreement.
Actuaries, insurance accountants and other insurance professionals in the house may give us their views on how this is done in the field.
@msimon, et al, views would do this discussion a lot of good.
Otherwise, I choose to agree with Jubilee team that underwriting profits for year 2011 impressively stands at KES 540M, up from KES 476M in 2010.
I rest my case
The AKI writes an annual report every year. In 2010 they said Jubilee made KES 336M and not KES 476M. Perhaps one should give them a call to ask why the discrepancy. My gut feeling is that there are certain op. expenses not included in the calculation as they're incurred for activities outside of the core business. However, I'm not an expert in this field. my 2 cents “We are the middle children of history man, no purpose or place. We have no great war, no great depression. Our great war is a spiritual war, our great depression is our lives!" – Tyler Durden
|
|
|
Wazua
»
Investor
»
Stocks
»
Jubilee is KING!!
Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.
|