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This is Your "Leader"
bepari
#51 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 6:55:28 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 12/6/2009
Posts: 108
Location: nairobi
kyt wrote:
masukuma wrote:
nostoppingthis wrote:
kyt wrote:
@ Laughing out loudly, even prince charles returned a debt of over 100 yrs borrowed from the bank of england by his grand father, can uhuru do the same?


with the support of akina @Lolest, i doubt....

return to who?

To the public, this was public. this was public land masukuma ala!!!!

what old jomo did was morally wrong but absolutely legal.he had the power to allocate any person(s) land(katiba mzee), only tha he chose to allocate himself entire districts.morally reprehensible but still legal.
if you aint livin on the edge,you are taking too much space....
YesuWangu
#52 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 7:39:25 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 8/11/2010
Posts: 1,588
Lolest! wrote:
kyt wrote:
its called condemnation by representation @Laughing out loudly, mtoto wa nyoka ni nyoka. even children from abusive marriages are likely to turn out the same #uhuru found the land, its public land, can he correct the sins of his father? swala nyeti hiyo!!

So if I like drooling at TV girls my son will definitely take my trait? He could end up different, a priest or even a muffler! This argument stinks. Again I ask, whose name is on the titles of Kenyatta land? What has Uhuru stolen so that I join you in stoning him? Reminds me of another tired line in 2002 blaming the collapse of KCC on Kenyatta family coz they own Brookside! Finally, are you sure that your thinking on this issue is not clouded by your support for Raila and dislike for some people?


You should know there is a difference between ones' character and ones' possessions. That will stop you from making useless comparisons.

Character cannot be transferred from one person to another. Goods can. Lands can.
nostoppingthis
#53 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 8:32:05 AM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 8/24/2009
Posts: 5,909
Location: Nairobi
Lolest! wrote:
@nostop and @kyt, I do not support Uhuru. Just askin 4 a more sober debate.


I was just wondering why you chose to defend him ...that was not asking for sober debate, at some instances you do have points, not this time!! Can you imagine a UK presidency? flashback to the bitterness in this man's eyes...the "kwa nyokwa" statements and still facing issues of revenge attacks during PEV (a possible prove that he can actually revenge!!!)...some parts of this country will not develop at all...

masukuma
#54 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 8:37:24 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
kyt wrote:
masukuma wrote:
nostoppingthis wrote:
kyt wrote:
@ Laughing out loudly, even prince charles returned a debt of over 100 yrs borrowed from the bank of england by his grand father, can uhuru do the same?


with the support of akina @Lolest, i doubt....

return to who?

To the public, this was public. this was public land masukuma ala!!!!

who is the public? what determines what was public land and what was not? its not some arbitrary decision its the LAW. this goes back to the question. Uhuru tulipewa ama tulinyakua! People with issues of land should go to court.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
masukuma
#55 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 8:40:31 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
pariah wrote:
i only scanned through this thread, i am not surprised but all the same disappointed at people who bend back wards to defend the UKs and WRs of Kenya. I never get it at all, I have got to be real dumb!!!! The guys killed people grabbed land but we can still find a way to justify it just because they are your tribes mate, and you call yourself a christian!!!! Heri niende jeanamu

meza wembe, you do not tell us how to behave or who to support! we will not operate in a container defined by you.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Jaluo
#56 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 8:47:01 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 6/22/2011
Posts: 72
Location: Joburg
@ bepari said...

.....“ what old jomo did was morally wrong but absolutely legal.he had the power to allocate any person(s) land(katiba mzee), only tha he chose to allocate himself entire districts.morally reprehensible but still legal.’’.....


Very good point! Just to fafanua a little, here is an excerpt from Ogiek Link

*************************************************

Jennifer Widner explained in her 1992 book, The Rise of A Party-State in Kenya: From "Harambee!" to "Nyayo!" that KANU urged central control of all regions in an effort to forestall local majimbo legislation restricting land transfer to those born in the area, and to maintain the foothold of the party's Kikuyu supporters in the Rift Valley land market".

Many settlers were returning to Britain. Kenyatta and his cronies quickly formed the Settlement Transfer Fund Schemes (STFS) and asked the British for a loan to the Kenyan government, to buy off land from colonial settlers returning to Britain. Good idea up to this point.

Britain, having been reassured by Kenyatta that those settlers still wishing to stay on in Kenya would not have their land repossessed, advanced the money. This money was used to buy settler land which was officially sold into the Kenyatta initiated Settlement Transfer Fund Schemes (STFS).

Next, Kenyatta began to give away and sell for peanuts, these government (STFS)-acquired, former colonial land parcels, to himself, his family and cronies around 1964 and 1965. This is the point when the rain started beating Kenya.
'' The European condemns the Africans for having two wives yet he keeps two mistresses'' - Jomo Kenyatta
masukuma
#57 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 8:54:42 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 10/4/2006
Posts: 13,823
Location: Nairobi
While I will vote for Martha Karua, but I know that folks like @kyt and @pariah here will not vote for Uhuru or WR (if their names ever show up on the ballot and they were 'clean') this is because land issues, IDPs, ICC, brookside e.t.c. are but squirrels that are thrown on the path to make us loose sight of the antelope.
They are not really unhappy that Uhuru and WR are alleged to have done what they did, they are not really unhappy that land was said to be grabbed, they are not really unhappy that IDPs spend their nights in the cold.
The real reason (the antelope) they are unhappy with the two is solely in the fact that the 2 are able to wipe the floor with their man RAO. if they were really true to themselves and able to tell us the truth - they would confess that they were happy when Kikuyus were being killed like flies in Jan 2008. semeni ukweli tuu. Its ok to have political positions but is insulting when you try to make us believe that the reasons you dislike the 2 men is on principle not by the fact that they seem like the guys who will spoil the party for your man.
tuambiane ukweli - hizo zingine ni excuses tu.
All Mushrooms are edible! Some Mushroom are only edible ONCE!
Lolest!
#58 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 9:06:37 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
Why should I not defend Uhuru? When guys accused Prof Nyongo of writing against infrastructure dvpt did I not defend him? Why didnt u ask why I was defending him? How much acreage has Uhuru stolen?
nostoppingthis wrote:
[quote=Lolest!]@nostop and @kyt, I do not support Uhuru. Just askin 4 a more sober debate.


I was just wondering why you chose to defend him ...that was not asking for sober debate, at some instances you do have points, not this time!! Can you imagine a UK presidency? flashback to the bitterness in this man's eyes...the "kwa nyokwa" statements and still facing issues of revenge attacks during PEV (a possible prove that he can actually revenge!!!)...
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
Jaluo
#59 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 9:11:49 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 6/22/2011
Posts: 72
Location: Joburg
@ Lolest said

.....”Very unfair criticism if you ask me. I do not know of a single LAND scandal UK has been involved in. Kama babake aliiba, wachana na mtoto.(Ez 18)”....


I guess that is a moral issue. Personally if I owned that much land I would DONATE some to the IDP’s, not much, but just enough for them to live like human beings (leave alone Kenyans)

It may not be a Land scandal, but it is unjust, inhuman and immoral.

The extended Kenyatta family alone owns an estimated 500,000 acres - approximately the size of Nyanza Province - according to estimates by independent surveyors and Ministry of Lands officials.

We have approximately 350, 000 IDP's living in camps. Suppose the Kenyatta family (and other major landholders) donated just 1 acre to each IDP ? It is a matter of morals...

more excerpts from Ogiek.org

******************************************
Among the best-known parcels owned by Kenyatta’s family, for instance, are the 24, 000 acres in Taveta sub-district adjacent to the 74, 000 acres owned by former MP Basil Criticos, whereby the title deeds are grabbed by a bank.

Others are 50, 000 acres in Taita that is currently under Mrs Beth Mugo, an Assistant minister of Education and niece of Kenyatta.

29, 000 acres in Kahawa Sukari along the Nairobi - Thika highway, the 10, 000 acre Gichea Farm in Gatundu, 5, 000 acres in Thika, 9,000 acres in Kasarani and the 5, 000-acre Muthaita Farm.

These are beside others such as Brookside Farm, Green Lee Estate, Njagu Farm in Juja, a quarry in Dandora in Nairobi and a 10, 000-acre ranch in Naivasha. There is another 200 acres in Mombasa, and 250 acres in Malindi.

Other pieces of land owned by the Kenyatta family include the 52,000-acre farm in Nakuru and a 20,000-acre one, also known as Gichea Farm, in Bahati under Kenyatta’s daughter, Margaret.

Besides, Mama Ngina Kenyatta, widow of the former President, owns another 10, 000 acres in Rumuruti while a close relative of the Kenyatta family, a Mrs Kamau, has 40,000 acres in Endebes in
the Rift Valley Province.

Uhuru owns 5,000 acres in Eldoret, 3,000 acres in Rongai and 12,000 acres in Naivasha, 100 acres in Karen, and 200 acres in Dagoretti. A 1,000-acre farm in Dagoretti is owned by Kenyatta’s first wife Wahu.


'' The European condemns the Africans for having two wives yet he keeps two mistresses'' - Jomo Kenyatta
Lolest!
#60 Posted : Wednesday, March 07, 2012 9:25:58 AM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 12,069
Location: Kianjokoma
@Jaluo, much respect.Applause thanks for the info. Do we know how all that land was acquired?
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
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