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12-Year Infrastructure Bond
mukiha
#1 Posted : Friday, September 02, 2011 10:15:04 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
20b worth to finance energy roads and water.

Coupon rate 12%, paid half-yearly

Openning for sale on 16th Sept

Value date 3rd Oct 2012

Redemption in three phases: 2015, 2019 and 2023

Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
For Sport
#2 Posted : Saturday, September 03, 2011 7:54:51 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/23/2010
Posts: 1,229
Mainat
#3 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 1:19:56 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
Is 12% (i.e. 10.2% after tax) abit on the low side? Inflation is 16%. Average mortgage/lending is circa 15%.
Sehemu ndio nyumba
maka
#4 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 1:37:13 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
Mainat wrote:
Is 12% (i.e. 10.2% after tax) abit on the low side? Inflation is 16%. Average mortgage/lending is circa 15%.

It's an IFB it doesnt attract tax...
possunt quia posse videntur
KulaRaha
#5 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 2:22:56 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/26/2007
Posts: 6,514
I wonder who will buy this stuff when inflation is soaring, and money markets have been in turmoil?
Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
maka
#6 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 2:35:42 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
KulaRaha wrote:
I wonder who will buy this stuff when inflation is soaring, and money markets have been in turmoil?

Fund managers,NSSF etc
possunt quia posse videntur
stocksmaster
#7 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 4:49:57 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 9/26/2006
Posts: 403
Location: CENTRAL PROVINCE
Mainat wrote:
Is 12% (i.e. 10.2% after tax) abit on the low side? Inflation is 16%. Average mortgage/lending is circa 15%.


Is the 12% fixed or subject to bidding? If not fixed, then potential investors will surely quote rates higher than prevailing inflation (> 16%).

Happy Hunting.
Mainat
#8 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 5:09:51 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
stocksmaster wrote:
Mainat wrote:
Is 12% (i.e. 10.2% after tax) abit on the low side? Inflation is 16%. Average mortgage/lending is circa 15%.


Is the 12% fixed or subject to bidding? If not fixed, then potential investors will surely quote rates higher than prevailing inflation (> 16%).

Happy Hunting.

Its a fixed coupon. I think Banki Kuu might be overestimating appetite at this rate...
Sehemu ndio nyumba
amolo
#9 Posted : Monday, September 05, 2011 6:55:09 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/29/2007
Posts: 70
Although coupon rate is fixed at 12% you buy at a discounted price so depending on your bid price your effective rate could be as high as 18% or more if you are lucky, then add no w/h tax! I'll bid at around 18%, so what if I don't get!
maka
#10 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 9:39:42 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
amolo wrote:
Although coupon rate is fixed at 12% you buy at a discounted price so depending on your bid price your effective rate could be as high as 18% or more if you are lucky, then add no w/h tax! I'll bid at around 18%, so what if I don't get!

Competitive bids have to be above 20 M thats the only time you can bid anything below you will just get at par...
possunt quia posse videntur
KulaRaha
#11 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 9:54:17 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/26/2007
Posts: 6,514
This bond will flop. Its too soon after all the recent upheavals, and perhaps the banks will show CBK the displeasure of how they have been handled recently.
Business opportunities are like buses,there's always another one coming
Mainat
#12 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 10:10:30 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/21/2006
Posts: 1,590
I'd like to see some invention from CBK especially on these important Infrastructure bonds. Why not offer stepped interest rates depending on bid amount?
Sehemu ndio nyumba
maka
#13 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 10:58:36 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
KulaRaha wrote:
This bond will flop. Its too soon after all the recent upheavals, and perhaps the banks will show CBK the displeasure of how they have been handled recently.

It won't flop with UK declaring the government is broke they really need this money,most definitely guys will go in at high rates but there will be some level of caution since there is some liquidity in the market from matured papers...
possunt quia posse videntur
kizee1
#14 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 11:35:38 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 9/29/2010
Posts: 679
Location: nairobi
maka wrote:
KulaRaha wrote:
This bond will flop. Its too soon after all the recent upheavals, and perhaps the banks will show CBK the displeasure of how they have been handled recently.

It won't flop with UK declaring the government is broke they really need this money,most definitely guys will go in at high rates but there will be some level of caution since there is some liquidity in the market from matured papers...


matured papers yes, no one will trust CBK on rates anytime soon, guess funds and such will be keen, i dont see too many banks interested
amolo
#15 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 12:19:42 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/29/2007
Posts: 70
It is Non Competetive bids which are limited to a maximum of 20m. I have bought bonds several times in the past, my bids are never (and will never} reach 20m. My bids are always competetive and in most cases I've got at above weighted average rate, which is used for all non competetive bids.
Ali Baba
#16 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 1:05:25 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/29/2008
Posts: 571
AMOLO:Stop lying(this is not Hague),Non-Competitive bids maximum ceiling is Ksh 10 million and not shs20 million like you allege. Check the CBK website for confirmation.
mukiha
#17 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 1:39:02 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/27/2008
Posts: 4,114
Ali Baba wrote:
AMOLO:Stop lying(this is not Hague),Non-Competitive bids maximum ceiling is Ksh 10 million and not shs20 million like you allege. Check the CBK website for confirmation.


I think @Amolo was only trying to clarify that there is no lower limit for competitive bids as long as they are above 50k.

@Maka had suggested that one needs at least 20m to make a competitive bid. The truth is that while there is an upper limit for non-competitive bids, there isn't a lower one for competitive bids.
Nothing is real unless it can be named; nothing has value unless it can be sold; money is worthless unless you spend it.
Ali Baba
#18 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 2:00:50 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/29/2008
Posts: 571
MUKIHA: If that's the case,now I do get both of you.I agree.
For Sport
#19 Posted : Thursday, September 08, 2011 5:30:42 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/23/2010
Posts: 1,229
mukiha wrote:
20b worth to finance energy roads and water.

Coupon rate 12%, paid half-yearly

Openning for sale on 16th Sept

Value date 3rd Oct 2012

Redemption in three phases: 2015, 2019 and 2023



Period of sale: August 16th, 2011 - September 27,2011
amolo
#20 Posted : Friday, September 09, 2011 11:37:50 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/29/2007
Posts: 70
This is the CBK link AlliBaba. The limit for non competetive bids is 20m. This is information in the public domain, what is there to disagree on!
http://www.centralbank.g...st/91%20-%20Day/1915.jpg
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