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bonds investments
shinski
#1 Posted : Tuesday, August 23, 2011 5:24:38 PM
Rank: Hello


Joined: 8/23/2011
Posts: 4
would you like to invest in bonds?
the bond fund is suitable for investors seeking a better level of capital stability than equities markets,but also a higher yield than money mareket funds,the fund aims to achieve long term capital growth as well as a reasonable level of income at a low risksmile contact me ruth at icea 0729559885 and i will give you more information
mauryc
#2 Posted : Tuesday, August 23, 2011 6:47:05 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 11/21/2010
Posts: 50
Location: nairobi
if you purchase a bond,can
you opt 2 jump out or
increase ur investment,say
when it is reopened?ama
you risk losing the interest
youve earned?
Mach G
#3 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 6:16:00 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 7/18/2011
Posts: 19
My two cents

- you invest in a five year bond, 2 yrs down the road you feel you need the cash to pay say school fees for your children. You can sell the bond -in the bond market and get the money you had invested. The new buyer(from you)will get the interest payments on the bond for the remaining two years
- in the meantime, the two years that you held the bond you would have been getting interest payments every six months or as per the terms of the bond
- if a bond is reopened, that allows you to invest in the same bond by adding an amount say 100k, the bond if it reopens after six months of intial floatation will have a lifespan of four and half years to maturity and does not affect the original investment of the full five year bond

Hope I make sense
Hunderwear
#4 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 7:29:43 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/14/2011
Posts: 639
Mach G wrote:
My two cents

- you invest in a five year bond, 2 yrs down the road you feel you need the cash to pay say school fees for your children. You can sell the bond -in the bond market and get the money you had invested. The new buyer(from you)will get the interest payments on the bond for the remaining two years
- in the meantime, the two years that you held the bond you would have been getting interest payments every six months or as per the terms of the bond
- if a bond is reopened, that allows you to invest in the same bond by adding an amount say 100k, the bond if it reopens after six months of intial floatation will have a lifespan of four and half years to maturity and does not affect the original investment of the full five year bond

Hope I make sense

Lets say you buy the 12% 30yr bond does it mean you wil get 12% interest for 30 yrs?
Mach G
#5 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 8:12:06 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 7/18/2011
Posts: 19
Yes minus the applicable withholding tax of 10%, usually longer termed bonds attract lower tax than short and medium term bonds. The interest will be paid semi-annually so divide the interestpaid per year by 2. Infrastructure Bonds are withholding tax free. Govt securities show maturity date, interest rate, interest pmt dates, withholding tax etc
maka
#6 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 10:15:18 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
@ Mach G thought withholding tax is 15 %??
possunt quia posse videntur
amolo
#7 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 11:14:36 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/29/2007
Posts: 70
By way of example the 30 yr bond was sold at a discount ie for every 100/= you actually paid less than 100/= meaning the actual interest (in my case at my price) was 13.52%
There is also provision for discounting the bond ie exiting. This normally is when you are unable to sell in the bond market, CBK will buy back the bond. Visit the CBK website to see how discounted price is calculated. However this is punitive and you will lose about 3% on prevailing market rates.




Hunderwear
#8 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 2:27:46 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/14/2011
Posts: 639
amolo wrote:
By way of example the 30 yr bond was sold at a discount ie for every 100/= you actually paid less than 100/= meaning the actual interest (in my case at my price) was 13.52%
There is also provision for discounting the bond ie exiting. This normally is when you are unable to sell in the bond market, CBK will buy back the bond. Visit the CBK website to see how discounted price is calculated. However this is punitive and you will lose about 3% on prevailing market rates.





what about if you buy in the secondary market do u stil buy the 30yr bond@a discount?
maka
#9 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 2:43:26 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
@ amolo which 30 year are you talking about the re-opening?and what happens when you re disount at such a time when rates are way up e.g the 30 year is currently trading at around 15.5%
possunt quia posse videntur
For Sport
#10 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 2:43:27 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 12/23/2010
Posts: 1,229
maka wrote:
@ Mach G thought withholding tax is 15 %??

10% for the long term ones e.g. 30 year
Look at the rate indicated in the last prospectus
maka
#11 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 2:45:28 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,522
Location: Nairobi
@ Hunderwear all bonds trading on the secondary market are now at a discount...a paper like 2/8/5 (around 2 years remaining) is trading @ 11.8-12% crazy rates...
possunt quia posse videntur
Hunderwear
#12 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 3:20:38 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/14/2011
Posts: 639
maka wrote:
@ amolo which 30 year are you talking about the re-opening?and what happens when you re disount at such a time when rates are way up e.g the 30 year is currently trading at around 15.5%

pardon my ignorance but does it mean that if I buy the 30yr bond worth 100k I get 15500 every year?
Mach G
#13 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 4:18:09 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 7/18/2011
Posts: 19
Yes - 15500 per year @15.5% interest but after taxes at 10% you get 13950 and since there will be two semi annual interest pmts you get 6975 every six months for 30 years
Hunderwear
#14 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 5:05:48 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/14/2011
Posts: 639
Mach G wrote:
Yes - 15500 per year @15.5% interest but after taxes at 10% you get 13950 and since there will be two semi annual interest pmts you get 6975 every six months for 30 years

and what are the costs involved in the bond investments,both in initial floating and in the secondary market?
the deal
#15 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 6:53:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
mauryc
#16 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 6:53:36 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 11/21/2010
Posts: 50
Location: nairobi
how difficult is it to sell on the secondary market?i've heard of guys lamenting that they are unable sell..is there adequate demand?
Hunderwear
#17 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 7:52:01 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/14/2011
Posts: 639
[quote=the deal]Read something about bonds here http://www.contrarianinv...ard-by-toxic-bonds.html[/quote]
Am interested in the 30yr bond does it mean ths is the time to buy when the rate is high i.e 16.3%?Are they likely to go up or lower going forward
the deal
#18 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 9:56:38 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
Hunderwear wrote:
[quote=the deal]Read something about bonds here http://www.contrarianinv...ard-by-toxic-bonds.html[/quote]
Am interested in the 30yr bond does it mean ths is the time to buy when the rate is high i.e 16.3%?Are they likely to go up or lower going forward

It depends weather you are buying the bond and holding it till maturity or for trading purposes...generally speaking bonds are trading at a discount to their face value at the moment...but if its for trading purposes u have to critically analyse the interest rates landscape least u r left holding a toxic bond like the banks..CBK is a master of mixed signals...
Scooby
#19 Posted : Friday, August 26, 2011 12:57:53 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 9/2/2006
Posts: 121
maka wrote:
@ Mach G thought withholding tax is 15 %??


Maka,

The with holding tax for any treasury bonds that are mauturies of ten years or more is 10%. This amendment was introduced by Uhuru Kenyatta about 2-3 years ago.

Scooby
#20 Posted : Friday, August 26, 2011 1:15:24 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 9/2/2006
Posts: 121
Mauryc,

Most bond investors buy bonds with the intention of holding them to maturity. So incase one needs to sell the bond, the broker will look to "match" it with another order to buy.

Once that is done, the transaction is then reflected on the stock exchange. It's a kinda weird arrangement compared to shares.

Regards
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