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CENTUM FULL YEAR 2010/2011 RESULTS
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mwekez@ji
#71 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 4:37:43 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 5/31/2011
Posts: 5,121
guru267 wrote:
mwekez@ji wrote:

All listed firms must report as per IFRS. Besides, both IFRS and GAAP do not provide for a company to understate or overstate its books inorder to smooth out the profits. We where have you been reading that stuff of smoothing out the profits?


Most GAAP and IFRS do not collide and neither do they contradict each other.. GAAP were developed to smoothen the rigidities of IFRS and so can be adopted by both listed and non listed firms without upsetting regulators..

Secondly I said that the GAAP that allows for overstating of liability and loss can be used for MANY reasons some of which include smoothening out profits..

Here's one of the studies I read.
http://www4.gsb.columbia.../papers/industrystudies

The part you are looking for is on page 77 of the study..

I know You are probably a centum shareholder worried about 2011 profit disaster that awaits and in denial about the superior quality of jubilees management but no hard feelings..





That does not indicate that IFRS and GAAP allow any firm to understate or overstate its books inorder to smoothen profit. And yes I was having Centum shares under speculative holding and I am already fully out. Thinking of taking the money to Kigali but not Jubilee, unless it touches sub 160. No hard feelings ..

@erifloss; True, an informed investor should not over-rely or under-rely on audited accounts when appraising an investment. I advice on trending very carefully in companies that restate their books
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guru267
#72 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 4:59:44 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
youcan'tstopusnow wrote:
Oh, and not that past performance is a reflection of future performance, but Centum spanked the shit out of Jubilee in terms of share price appreciation from 31 Dec 2009 to 31 Dec 2010. Wouldn't be surprised if that is replicated in the next 5 year average


@youcant I primarily invest in stocks whose value is yet to be unlocked and that is jubilee..

The share is too illiquid for institutions and the price too high to interest retail investors and hence it remains stagnant at these levels even though the EPS keeps on climbing.. (another example being williamson tea).. Well im interested And so I will continue accumulating..

@youcant most stock performance charts do not factor bonus share issuances and I would rather look at the 5 year performance because 1 year is too short to analyse accurately..
So If we do an adjustment for bonus shares then jubilee was at 56bob in 2006 and is 180 as of this fridays close.. Centum was at 9bob in 2006 and 23.5 as of friday.. I think jubilee has performed better over 5 years or its relatively the same..

In the recent AGM The management has ruled out a share split in the near term but promised to start giving sweet bonuses in 2011 to boost liquidity but as long as im accumulating they can take their sweet time
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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guru267
#73 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 5:18:52 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
mwekez@ji wrote:
That does not indicate that IFRS and GAAP allow any firm to understate or overstate its books inorder to smoothen profit. And yes I was having Centum shares under speculative holding and I am already fully out. Thinking of taking the money to Kigali but not Jubilee, unless it touches sub 160. No hard feelings ..

@erifloss; True, an informed investor should not over-rely or under-rely on audited accounts when appraising an investment. I advice on trending very carefully in companies that restate their books


@mwekez@ji did you read page 77 of the study properly? I was simply providing you with what you asked.. Evidence that plenty of reputable LISTED insurance & investment firms like prudential have been overstating their losses since the beginning of accounting and hence have been complying with IFRS & GAAP fully.. What more do you want?? You asked to be taken to the river bed and now you want me to help you drink..

Jubilee has restating their books for the last 75years & will do so for 75more smile
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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youcan'tstopusnow
#74 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 6:04:43 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 3/24/2010
Posts: 6,779
Location: Black Africa
guru, my beef is not about the performance of Centum vs Jubilee but about the sale of Carbacid being factored into the results and your assertion that they sold half of it last year. Did you go to the link I prescribed?
GOD BLESS YOUR LIFE
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guru267
#75 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 8:04:27 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
youcan'tstopusnow wrote:
guru, my beef is not about the performance of Centum vs Jubilee but about the sale of Carbacid being factored into the results and your assertion that they sold half of it last year. Did you go to the link I prescribed?


@youcant i've just watched the video and you are right.. My bad
My basis for my earlier statement was that their H1 2010 cash flow statement showed a huge increase from sale of quoted equities so I just assumed it was carbacid as it was their major holding.. I should have known they hold other equities also..

Looks like the carbacid sale will actually boost 2011 earnings hence I am tempted to withdraw my earlier prediction on centum.. TEMPTED though!
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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Gordon Gekko
#76 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 8:44:53 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 5/27/2008
Posts: 3,760
guru267 wrote:
mwekez@ji wrote:

All listed firms must report as per IFRS. Besides, both IFRS and GAAP do not provide for a company to understate or overstate its books inorder to smooth out the profits. We where have you been reading that stuff of smoothing out the profits?


Most GAAP and IFRS do not collide and neither do they contradict each other.. GAAP were developed to smoothen the rigidities of IFRS and so can be adopted by both listed and non listed firms without upsetting regulators..

Secondly I said that the GAAP that allows for overstating of liability and loss can be used for MANY reasons some of which include smoothening out profits..

Here's one of the studies I read.
http://www4.gsb.columbia.../papers/industrystudies

The part you are looking for is on page 77 of the study..

I know You are probably a centum shareholder worried about 2011 profit disaster that awaits and in denial about the superior quality of jubilees management but no hard feelings..



This statement "GAAP were developed to smoothen the rigidities of IFRS" is fatally flawed. It suggests that. IFRS came first. IFRS is only being adopted and indeed IFRS 1 talks about first time adoption of IFRS from GAAP.
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guru267
#77 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 9:28:53 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
@GG I consider IFRS and IAS to be the fairly same in my opinion though others may not because IFRS is a component of IAS..
I was talking about IAS and not IFRS
The IASB or IASC sets accounting standards which are rigid and clear in their requirements.. Because IAS has no legal jurisdiction of enforcement Different countries interpret, structure and adopt these standards in a way that suits the needs and circumstances of their respective countries.. Hence the name GAAPs arose.. That sounds like dealing with rigidities to me..
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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youcan'tstopusnow
#78 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 9:44:15 PM
Rank: Chief

Joined: 3/24/2010
Posts: 6,779
Location: Black Africa
guru, they are also planning an IPO of one of their private Equity companies, 2 exits and 1 or 2 acquisitions in Southern Africa.
Coupled with their Real Estate investments....
GOD BLESS YOUR LIFE
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the deal
#79 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 10:32:10 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,534
Location: Windhoek/Nairobbery
Uhmm is this company cooking its numbers??? I'm looking at their 1H 2010-11 numbers page 14.

Gains on disposal of investments

30-09-2009

Cost Sh 62M proceeds Sh 63M Gain on disposal Sh 684M????

30-09-2010

Cost Sh 469M Proceeds Sh 950M Gain on disposal Sh 480M

The numbers for 1H 2009 dont make sense to me.
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guru267
#80 Posted : Sunday, June 26, 2011 10:43:52 PM
Rank: Elder

Joined: 1/21/2010
Posts: 6,675
Location: Nairobi
youcan'tstopusnow wrote:
guru, they are also planning an IPO of one of their private Equity companies, 2 exits and 1 or 2 acquisitions in Southern Africa.
Coupled with their Real Estate investments....


And my skeptism and pessimism about this company reduce even further.. Continue to shed light my brother smile
Mark 12:29
Deuteronomy 4:16
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